00:00hi everyone welcome to the a 6nz podcast
00:02i'm sonal and today i have with us the
00:06brothers cranny and that includes our
00:08in-house operating head marc cranny and
00:11who i actually I'm gonna call cranny
00:13because that's what everyone here calls
00:14him and his brother Todd cranny who I'll
00:18call Todd on this podcast because that's
00:20your name and and Todd you a political
00:22operator for a very long time like
00:24what's your background there's only one
00:26cranny and a sixty I got that so I've
00:30worked on three presidential campaigns I
00:32worked on President Bush's reelection
00:34campaign I worked on both of Governor
00:35Romney's presidential campaigns I worked
00:38for Governor Schwarzenegger reelection
00:39campaign and I also worked for Meg
00:41Whitman when she ran for governor of
00:42California so when you say you've worked
00:44on campaigns like what there's so many
00:46different functions on a campaign like
00:47what was your overall role particularly
00:49in the political operation I served as
00:51the deputy political director nationally
00:53from Mitch campaign and ran the western
00:56states from it the first time he ran and
00:59then I also was political director for
01:00Meg when she ran for governor so a lot
01:02of the focus for me has been on the on
01:04the political operations side of the
01:07campaign the actual politics of the
01:08campaign that's great so those are our
01:10listeners who don't know the other
01:12cranny you bring a ton of expertise on
01:15go-to-market strategy and one of the
01:16things that you guys are both telling me
01:18from very different vantage points is
01:19that there's a lot of similarities
01:21between business and politics which i
01:23think people can buy on the surface but
01:24what argument would you make i think you
01:27know if from a entrepreneur and point
01:30your go-to-market executive or even a
01:33CEO putting in the politics aside if you
01:37look at what's going on in these big
01:40campaigns particularly now in compared
01:42to what you're doing on a go to market
01:44side there's a there's little things you
01:46can learn because it is kind of the
01:48Super Bowl of you know a big go to
01:50market if you think of how these started
01:53off as primaries and they had to go
01:55through this whole process now we're
01:57down to the final two it's a lot like
02:00Enterprise sells for campaign selling to
02:03you know large enterprises you got to
02:05get a lot of different people on board
02:08in these complex selling situations it
02:12essentially get them to vote for you
02:14on the on the tech cell side so I hear
02:17the similarity is that there's some
02:18lessons to be learned from campaigns or
02:20just thinking about them as the same
02:22type of thing like getting to a vote and
02:24getting to someone to pick you
02:25essentially or you pick your product but
02:27break it down for me at the very basic
02:29level what's the product here the
02:31product is the candidate I mean in
02:33politics the product really is the
02:34candidate now the advantage you have in
02:36business is that the the product is
02:38innate and you can improve it and
02:40control it completely in politics you
02:42can't control the the Kennedy because
02:44it's a person obviously and they've got
02:46to learn and grow and they're gonna have
02:47their moments but the product is the
02:49candidate and that's what you have to
02:50build off of and then you essentially
02:52have an organization and it's a business
02:53organization just like you have on the
02:55business side I mean you have a strategy
02:57team that's setting up in terms of what
02:59is the overall strategy of the campaign
03:01the resource allocation decisions have
03:02to be made there's a political
03:03department which is essentially the
03:05marketing department you know not
03:07exactly one to one but it's very much
03:09similarities you have a communications
03:10team that is doing all the PR and the
03:13outreach dealing with reporters and
03:14helping build the narrative you have an
03:16administrative team that's taking care
03:17of all the legal and all of the you know
03:20compliance issues and everything under
03:22the Sun and how the actual organization
03:23runs and don't forget the finance team
03:26raise the money of finance team I mean
03:28it's a big business but political
03:31campaign really is the ultimate startup
03:33you come in with nothing and you have to
03:35basically build a organization and you
03:38got to do it in zero to sixty in in a
03:40hurry and it's kind of the ultimate
03:40startup and then shut down so a
03:42political campaign unlike a start-up
03:44when it shuts down it's just it let me
03:47start it's actually shut down too they
03:48do yeah not a campaign you have a finite
03:50period Meg always would ask me what's
03:52the biggest difference for doing
03:53business in politics and I just say the
03:55difference between business and politics
03:56is that you can in business be competing
04:00with somebody in a quarter and come in
04:02second and still make a lot of money and
04:04still be in business for the next
04:06quarter and politics you come in second
04:10it's over there's a second there is no
04:11second there are no points for a second
04:13place you know the other thing that is a
04:14similarity between business and politics
04:16is it in particular on the sell side is
04:19it's a relationship heavy I mean it is
04:22it requires a lot of building
04:24relationships interpersonal skills
04:26dealing with others conflict
04:28resolution solutions less about innate
04:31objects more about dealing with people
04:32if you're doing with the technology and
04:34the engineers are fixing the problems
04:36and working out the bugs and they can
04:37improve the product from feedback you're
04:39getting and really improve it
04:40dramatically well you know we're helping
04:43the candidate who is the product right
04:44and we're giving advice but there are
04:46human being they have their strengths
04:47and the other weaknesses they're not a
04:49technology well I would argue that even
04:51technologies have strengths and
04:52weaknesses and cranny to point mark
04:54cranny I've heard you argue that sales
04:56and go to market is all about
04:58relationship building well I mean you
05:00know kind of to that point gonna start
05:02up is as wall is in a political campaign
05:05it is in the control of the go-to-market
05:08team with what should that buying
05:11criteria be you have the ability of
05:14helping a customer and or a voter show
05:17them what that criteria should be and
05:19how they should go about thinking about
05:21that if you watch what's going on right
05:23now both sides have two completely
05:26distinct views I mean there's X amount
05:28percent on either side already set in
05:31their ways but that middle piece is the
05:33one that's gonna show you one way or the
05:35other and a lot of cases that that
05:36happens you know in and go to market
05:39particularly in highly competitive
05:40situations where you've got you know a
05:43bunch of people going at it and you know
05:45it didn't later on in the process it
05:47might come down to the two finalists you
05:49know what is that criteria have you got
05:51the votes when I've heard you talk about
05:53criteria it's essentially saying don't
05:55just look at what's right in front of
05:56you there's a whole context that you're
05:58creating for this product and this
06:00engagement how does that play out in the
06:02election example I mean we're not
06:03actually saying hey you're telling the
06:04voters what to think
06:05obviously you you kind of are I mean the
06:08reality is you are responding to what
06:10the voters want you know sometimes
06:12voters don't know what they want you
06:13know just like buyers don't know what
06:14they want you got to tell them what they
06:15want and you can't tell them what they
06:17want you can actually create a new
06:19paradigm with them even for voters who
06:20seem like they know exactly what their
06:22views are on certain issues I mean
06:24there's definitely you know sense I mean
06:25on either side of the spectrum that are
06:27set in their ways and they're not
06:28persuadable I mean we talk a lot about
06:30persuadable who are the persuadable and
06:32that you could actually set the criteria
06:33with I mean he talks about criteria well
06:35we will could we scribe it in the
06:36political world is what is the narrative
06:38that you want to tell what is the
06:39there's nothing more important in a in a
06:41political campaign than the message that
06:44you want to deliver what's the story you
06:46want to tell it's exactly the same
06:47terminology exactly from a marketing
06:49standpoint and there's different levels
06:51of that story if you're going after a
06:53large technology company you know
06:55there's all the users that might you
06:57know use your product there's kind of
06:58little mid-level management and there's
07:00executives everybody has a different set
07:02up buying criteria for a user than it is
07:04for an executive so if I'm a seller of
07:08technology I need to understand what all
07:10these three personas the users managers
07:13and the CXOs what they're gonna care
07:16about from a political standpoint they
07:18need to know that too and I need to hit
07:21it from multiple different angles and
07:22they're the the amount of data on the
07:24voters that a political campaign comes
07:27up with is is enormous and how they go
07:29to market to you know either get out the
07:31vote and or get them to vote for them is
07:34is enormous all the way down to putting
07:36boots on the ground from cells for
07:38standpoint we use an enormous amount of
07:40data to help us figure out what the
07:42message needs to be how do you craft the
07:44narrative off that message and then what
07:46are the channels of delivery that you
07:47use to get that message out I mean
07:49there's obviously the advertising route
07:50and they can you know digital route etc
07:53but then there's the on-the-ground field
07:55operations field staff working with
07:57volunteers who are sharing that through
07:59their channels there's endorsements
08:00validators of products that are telling
08:03the same story this message reference
08:05selling right I mean other things you
08:07just went through it's on the marketing
08:09side is you know the advertising versus
08:11digital what is my ROI on the political
08:14side well that's the same thing a CMO
08:16has to answer from a technology sell
08:19standpoint as well and I better off
08:21doing this type of yeah actually a
08:23leaner program it's fascinating to watch
08:26a presidential campaign how do you
08:29unseat an incumbent it's hard to see the
08:31incumbent and there's a whole different
08:33set of strategies and tactics to do that
08:35versus starting from a level playing
08:38field so what are some of the
08:39differences when you don't have two
08:40fresh new startup candidates or products
08:42and you have like say a David versus
08:44Goliath type of situation what's some of
08:46the differences I mean both politically
08:48and in business I've been on both sides
08:50of this I mean I was on the on the
08:51incumbent side with President Bush and I
08:53on the other side of this with Governor
08:55Romney the parallels between oh four and
08:57twelve are pretty stark I mean it is a
08:59huge advantage to be the incumbent the
09:01president has a ton of money and has
09:02been building up organization for four
09:04years has been road-testing that an
09:06organization in a smart way one of the
09:08biggest criticisms for example of the
09:10twelve race of MIT is is is digital and
09:14the investment in infrastructure well
09:15the problem is we didn't have the money
09:17to invest in infrastructure in both
09:19field and on the data side because we
09:22were broke you know and we had for
09:24months over the summer to try to redo
09:25all that sort of stuff to build out a
09:28field fulfilled program to invest in
09:30data and technology well for months when
09:33the president and his team had been
09:35spending four years in fact eight years
09:36running for president and they've done a
09:39great job and they used that to their
09:40advantage data and technology and field
09:42operations mattered the Obama campaign
09:45had plenty of lead time to build that
09:47organization out to road-test and try
09:49different things and one of the things
09:50they didn't really smartly was they
09:52learned about this whole concept of
09:53virtual precincts and generally
09:55precincts or neighborhoods right you've
09:57organized you have one person
09:58neighborhood they're friends with
10:00everybody in a business world the
10:01equivalent would be like territories I
10:02would categorize it in our world is you
10:04know role granular segmentation and
10:07targeting it actually probably call it
10:09the same thing in your world I would
10:11assume yeah and if you look at the
10:13political side of the shop I mean you
10:14get down to it there's you know a
10:16handful of states that really matter if
10:18I'm a start-up or you know trying to
10:20take on the incumbent I'm starting
10:22behind they have account control they
10:25there's probably technologies and legacy
10:28in place like in a political campaign so
10:31I need to go after not the states that
10:34matter but I needed to go out the you
10:35know do my segmentation and targeting
10:37type exercises to go where I can have an
10:40impact quickest if I want a chance to
10:42win and get the toehold and then build
10:44from there so sort of a beachhead
10:46strategy and that you know to go spend a
10:48lot of money in a if I'm not in a come
10:50incumbent situation on states that don't
10:53matter and or accounts that are gonna
10:55not you know they're not gonna be right
10:57I think to translate I lean more is it
10:59when you're not the incumbent you have
11:01very little room for error and you have
11:03very much a much more difficult resource
11:05allocation decision to make
11:07you got to really know what's the 20%
11:09that's gonna get you 80% of the way
11:11if you mess set up as an incumbent you
11:14got a big early way that you can
11:15probably deal with and you can again
11:17road test and learn and fix it
11:18use your Challenger and the situation
11:20you're in you just don't have that room
11:22right you don't have the resources or
11:24even the reputation you have nothing
11:25this smart strategy that the Obama team
11:27figured out was the influencer model
11:30instead of just picking one person in
11:32the neighborhood they started figuring
11:33out through data mining and email social
11:36and social exactly there's certain
11:38people that don't pay attention don't
11:39really care but they'll pay attention to
11:41the expert on politics in their
11:42neighborhood but what does your
11:45neighborhood really look like nowadays
11:46well your neighborhood is could be
11:49nationwide I've lived in I don't know
11:51it's 15 different places I mean I got
11:53friends all over the place I don't
11:54necessarily have a neighbor yeah in fact
11:57my neighborhood right now I live in I'm
11:59hardly ever there I don't even barely
12:00know my neighbor neighbors there are
12:02certain people in those virtual
12:04neighborhoods that are influencers in
12:07politics the Obama campaign did a nice
12:09job of identifying those kind of people
12:11who could then spread the word out and
12:12organize that's important part of sales
12:15I think well that's a it's a huge you
12:18got you know the coach you know what's
12:19interesting a coach and a champion and
12:21you know champions ask you're gonna go
12:22advocate on your behalf without you
12:24there the and or in the marketing world
12:27on the on the tech side the influences
12:31are very similar and the point is they
12:33they took business practices and applied
12:36it to politics we're in basically the
12:38same business but it's just different
12:39for different purposes well look you
12:42have to be careful with the comparisons
12:44I mean every campaign is different
12:46anyway and President Obama was more of a
12:47movement candidate than some others are
12:49hey everyone gets in love I'm politics
12:52on the digital and on the grassroots
12:53side but you really have to have the
12:55right kind of candidate as well um you
12:58know you still need to apply the same
12:59organizational principles or you'll lose
13:01it if movement candidates can combine
13:03organization like the principles we're
13:06talking about here go to market
13:07strategies basically they can you know
13:10they can be pretty devastating in a
13:11successful way but what is the movement
13:13the movements the message so if you
13:16don't get the message right and you
13:17don't have the narrative right it
13:20for that okay I would much rather have
13:22message in movement and take my chances
13:25on organization although I want both
13:26because you can't win without both
13:28really there's actually a good analogy
13:30on the movement what I would say the
13:32bottoms up type movement which we see a
13:34lot in our world a good example has been
13:37the devops world and open-source world
13:40where the movement might start
13:41grassroots wise like a viral app well
13:44they could be viral app it could be you
13:47know movement from github users and/or a
13:50slack and then you've got to put your
13:53go-to-market team and strategy in place
13:55to move up market in size of companies
13:58as well as up into the executives to go
14:01institutionalize that across the whole
14:02company that's a good example of you
14:05know watching what happens on the
14:07political side as well I mean just
14:09having a movement where I've got a bunch
14:11of rowdy fans if you can't go put a
14:15strategy a team in place to capitalize
14:18on that it doesn't mean you're gonna win
14:20right absolutely it's really crucial
14:22that you have to be able to capture that
14:24energy and excitement and channel it or
14:27your just dissipate you lose it a lot of
14:31times you have one but not the other and
14:32you need both and you need both I mean
14:34you know and and if you get in an
14:35environment where you don't have the
14:36movement in your battle let me tweak you
14:38candidates they're both just traditional
14:40then yeah you want the organization
14:41because organization can muscle thing
14:43through and get back you know the extra
14:45few points we kind of which over the top
14:47a field operation to us is paid field
14:50staff that are organizing volunteers the
14:52grassroots organization do they could be
14:53worth two to four points in a close
14:56election race if it's done well that was
14:59basically unfortunately the difference
15:00between us and President Obama I mean he
15:02made by three and a half points it was
15:04him being able to squeeze out on his
15:07field operation and what they did was
15:10they maximized the technology and the
15:12digital to get there and that was the
15:14key well cranny for for the sales in the
15:16go-to-market operation where's the
15:18difference between the field and the
15:19inside and do you have the equivalent in
15:21political campaigns yeah I think it's
15:23very ya know it's it's very similar yeah
15:26I mean you all let Todd describe his
15:29side but say we've got a bottoms-up kind
15:32of viral thing going on
15:33and it could be both on the digital side
15:36customer-facing or b2c or on the
15:39enterprise side you can have that you
15:42know that beachhead established but if
15:45you're just spending all your time going
15:47established another beachhead at another
15:49company you're at risk of getting pushed
15:52out by the incumbent and/or somebody
15:55that's got that organizational control
15:56and that's it that's going to be the
15:57incumbent or another startup that
15:59actually builds out that that next layer
16:02to move up market in either size of
16:04company and or up market inside the the
16:07big company that are penetrated and my
16:09point though is I mean you can have the
16:10best product in order you have the best
16:11candidate in the world you can have the
16:12best story in the world but if you can't
16:13tell it correctly and you can't tell it
16:15or it's revelant to the parties that are
16:18interested you're in you're screwed I
16:20have that conversation over and over
16:22again in with working with a lot of
16:25startups where they have a piece of the
16:28message right for a particular audience
16:31typically it's the users but they
16:34haven't thought about what different
16:37level of that message is going to be
16:39required as they move up to managers VPS
16:44the cxos the CEOs or the V or the VPS or
16:48you have to know your audience right and
16:50there's multiple audiences multiple
16:52layers of organization process and
16:55messaging that needs to be in place to
16:57go grow a technology company if you
16:59don't think about that thing those
17:01things that the incumbent and/or another
17:04startup is gonna have an angle to come
17:07in and stunt your growth how do you guys
17:10know in both of your spheres that the
17:12message is working like is this do you
17:15just not get traction if it doesn't work
17:17I mean do you just keep redoing it you
17:19look at the data you look at the market
17:21research basically we do polling in
17:23focus groups and that pretty much gives
17:24us a chance to really vet out and know
17:26kind of what works and what doesn't work
17:28I think one of the worst things people
17:30do and it drives me crazy still ins
17:32business is that these people that want
17:34to go with their get I'm not a big
17:35believer about pulling things out of my
17:37ass I may be you know really talented
17:39you know all those sorts of things I
17:40like to know the answer before I ask the
17:42question so you know what the message is
17:44you know it work because you've tested
17:47what will happen is you got to them stay
17:48disciplined on that message and not have
17:50this sort of thing where well I don't
17:52think that message works and the polling
17:53must mean it's kind of waffle can you
17:55scroll back and forth you have no
17:56message discipline I just think it's a
17:57really crucial a lot of people look at
17:59things and they'll say well my instinct
18:01tells me this yeah you have to have
18:02instincts when you're selling it in a
18:04room and reading the room and knowing
18:06how to deliver it and deliver it in the
18:07right way but the message itself you
18:10test it you know what it is you know
18:11what the data tells you now that's the
18:13first part of it then you have to have a
18:14somebody who can deliver it and someone
18:17who can deliver it the way it's supposed
18:18to be delivered and in order to deliver
18:19it the way you tested it and then
18:21deliver it with some confidence and stay
18:23on that message and not wander all
18:25around and and well I think my gut tells
18:27me this and this another date message
18:29development and message discipline is
18:30crucial I think everything so that's
18:32just going to come from the candidate
18:34only but that's got to be or the founder
18:36CEO right sing it from the same sheet of
18:42music throughout a sales marketing
18:44organization and or a political campaign
18:47and how you communicate that how you you
18:50know train and enable people and are you
18:51providing them you know the content and
18:55what that message is and otherwise you
18:56know you lose right so far we've been
18:58talking about politics
19:00candidates as products and technology as
19:02products how does this all play out
19:04given the competitive landscape it's the
19:06same principle that you have in business
19:08well you got to know your competition
19:09they get another strengths or weaknesses
19:11you got to know what they're selling how
19:13they're selling it what they're saying
19:14what they're gonna do because you got to
19:16be able to counteract it obviously but
19:18not just be defensive about about how do
19:20you go on the offense on this thing and
19:21so there's a huge element I think of
19:24research and and knowing your
19:26competition knowing what they're saying
19:28why they're saying it what they're doing
19:31so you know how to counteract that but
19:33also look for opportunities not just to
19:35play defense but going to offense and
19:37you got also know again they're out
19:39there trashing you obviously in politics
19:42is pretty obvious you see it on
19:44television but you also see it at every
19:46level all the way down there the field
19:48reps all the way down to the local
19:49County chairmen abhava there are people
19:51out there trashing all the time so you
19:53have to be knowing that what is being
19:55said so you could fight you know you
19:56could push back it is in sales and
19:58marketing in general if you know the
20:00particularly for earlier stage companies
20:02they're so focused on what they you know
20:06what their message is and what what
20:08their value proposition is they forget
20:10you know that they have there are there
20:12alternatives they might be the big
20:14incumbents there's other startups they
20:16have to compete with and if you don't
20:19really know how they're deep positioning
20:22you you can go through a whole cycle and
20:26come up empty at the end because they've
20:29laid the traps they've set the criteria
20:31and if you don't know enough about your
20:32competition to understand when you're
20:34walking into a trap then you're sure as
20:36heck not going to be in a position to be
20:38laying traps and the best way of
20:40preventing a trap being lady to say my
20:42opponent or my competitor is gonna say
20:45this about me right they're not such a
20:47lack of courage in a sales force you
20:51usually that's due to a lack of
20:52knowledge of the competition if you know
20:55what the competition is going to say you
20:56should say my opponents gonna say this
20:58and it's not that way because of this
21:01and here's what you should be looking at
21:03because we're you know that that's the
21:05type of thing you need you need to be
21:07focused on and have the playbooks built
21:09out so I know if I'm dealing with this
21:12competitor this is the criteria they're
21:14going to be trying to help the prospect
21:17bake into their process if you're
21:20explaining based on what your competitor
21:23said you're losing and that's a big
21:25thing in politics and yours a big thing
21:27if you're explaining you're losing and
21:29that's a big thing we say and what's
21:33interesting to is two points mark makes
21:35he talks about you got to know your
21:37product inside now because you got to be
21:39able to inoculate and go after it
21:40there's a next layer of knowing the
21:42product you got to believe in the
21:43product and be able to deliver a belief
21:45of that product with sincerity and
21:47passion conviction yeah and you're not
21:49going to get that conviction if you
21:50don't really know what your competitor
21:52and is and or what the Aza's environment
21:55is for you no but whoever you're selling
21:57to and or running against and his I was
22:01even more basic question about that
22:03you know in politics it seems like if
22:05you work on a campaign you have to
22:06believe in that candidate and that
22:08mission in companies we talk about
22:10employees believing in the startups
22:11mission which is why they work there how
22:13that play out for like the Salesforce do
22:15you need a Salesforce that's totally
22:16bought into the the mission or do you
22:18actually want someone who has a bit of
22:19healthy skepticism like I don't believe
22:21like how does it play out there the
22:23conviction is huge if there if there's
22:26any doubt thought I mean sells calls
22:28you've been on but you know people can
22:30see they can read in a face-to-face type
22:33situation or a presentation and yeah
22:36they got a belief I totally believe that
22:38in any kind of human interaction
22:40you're either selling or you're being
22:43sold hey it's great to be helpfully
22:46skeptical but if you're gonna go out to
22:49war for me in the field and I'm gonna
22:51count on you to deliver then you aren't
22:53and you're skeptical you that's gonna
22:55resonate in front of a customer I also
22:57think to your question to our fathers
23:00they always say don't believe your own
23:01 you can be skeptical and you
23:03could be smart and have a good healthy
23:07self evaluation that's not that's not
23:10the same thing we're talking about here
23:11though you can do that and at the same
23:13time believe in your product nothing has
23:15gotten it was out without flaws but it's
23:17your product or your candidate or
23:19whatever it might be you know a good
23:22example I may have a product that I'm
23:24going to market with that you know I
23:26don't have the users right or maybe
23:28there's competition that does better
23:30down with the feature function you know
23:32forward of developer or for you know the
23:35individual employee but that competition
23:38doesn't have the scalability or the
23:41architecture to be used across you know
23:44fortune 500 global 2000 company I have
23:47two thirds of the of the equation the
23:50competition has one third well I mean
23:52you know I'm gonna focus my time going
23:54top down in that situation and yeah I'm
23:57gonna be skeptical I'm gonna do that
23:59internally and I'm gonna beat the heck
24:00out of engineering to make sure we build
24:02out that type of functionality I have no
24:04issue having courage a conviction and
24:07going to market and sitting across the
24:09table from a manager or VP or even a you
24:14know the user of my potential product
24:16and making sure we win that deal another
24:19important parallel to is the feedback on
24:23the ground that for example the sales
24:25team is giving the engineering on
24:27to improve the product Oh got this all
24:30the time that's happening in politics
24:32all the time I mean you're pulling in
24:33you're doing focus groups but there has
24:35to be feedback coming up to the to the
24:37to the strategy team in the candidate to
24:39give them a real ground testing of like
24:41what's really going on out there and
24:42that's why the more eyes and ears you
24:44have out there and that's what you have
24:45in your field team and your and your
24:47volunteers in the technology world put
24:50yourself in the buyers shoes and I in
24:52Todd's world put yourself in the boat
24:54voters shoes what are the what are they
24:56asking themselves I don't I think on the
24:59Marcel's a marketing side there's not
25:01enough of that that goes on what is
25:04their criteria so that they go through
25:05they asked themselves three questions
25:06why should I care or why should I do
25:09anything if you can get it past that you
25:12know you get some interest piqued
25:14interest and then you know they're gonna
25:15ask themselves alright why you versus
25:17someone else the third one is why now
25:20the why you over a competitor is one of
25:24the competitors is do nothing different
25:25than what I'm doing versus you know I
25:27could also you know buy from a big and
25:29comment I could buy from another startup
25:31or I could just do nothing
25:33I haven't motivated them enough because
25:34of it feature functionality or scale
25:37it's more typically more technical
25:39technically related the why now is
25:41typically something that right this is
25:43the best place I can invest my not only
25:46capital and money but also time and and
25:50management and people and process to you
25:55know making something happen inside my
25:57company and I think those three
25:58questions probably you know putting
26:00yourself in the voters shoes you know I
26:02think candidates asking themselves how
26:05would you how would you answer that from
26:07the political view why what I would say
26:09simply is that if I'm Hillary Clinton or
26:12I'm Donald Trump but I would and I'm and
26:15I'm their strategy team on either side I
26:17would take the three questions that Mark
26:20just asked and make sure I'm asking
26:22myself those questions and what are the
26:24answers that we want them to be and I
26:26think that you can pretty much define
26:27this presidential race on those three
26:29questions and who answers them correctly
26:32there or the right way in voters minds
26:34is gonna be the one that wins so I
26:36that's what the way I describe it okay
26:37so just to wrap up the movement is a
26:41the if you're explaining you're losing
26:43and it sounds like the story is the
26:45strategy and there's a lot of parallels
26:47clearly between politics and business
26:49Thank You Todd and Mark cranny thank you
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