"The Most Important Nutrient You've Never Heard Of" Found In Mushrooms
FreshCap Mushrooms2024-07-11
30K views|1 months ago
💫 Short Summary
The video discusses the unique abilities of mushrooms, such as their CO2 exhalation beneficial for plant growth in space and their high concentration of Ergothioneine with potential health benefits. Ergothioneine is crucial for human health, acting as an antioxidant and cytoprotective agent, and is essential for maintaining healthy cellular pH levels. Studies show correlations between Ergothioneine consumption and lower mortality rates, particularly from cardiovascular and neurological diseases. The video also explores the benefits of Ergothioneine supplementation in reducing the risk of age-related disorders and improving cognitive health, emphasizing the importance of high-quality supplements for optimal intake.
✨ Highlights
📊 Transcript
✦
Mushrooms exhale CO2 crucial for plant life, making them valuable for plant growth in space.
02:09Garden City Fungi collaborated with Florida Atlantic University to study mushroom mycelium strains' CO2 output in near space.
The experiment aimed to identify strains that can consistently produce high levels of CO2 over time.
These strains could potentially serve as an in-situ CO2 source for plant growth in space.
✦
Impact of high CO2 on mushroom cultivation.
04:06Oyster mushrooms can have long stems and small caps in high CO2 environments.
Noi mushrooms are an exception, grown in high CO2 for a unique appearance.
Mushrooms emitting CO2 are being studied for mosquito control by attracting and trapping mosquitoes.
This method shows promise as an alternative to traditional mosquito control methods like sprays.
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Ergothioneine: A powerful antioxidant found in mushrooms with potential health benefits.
07:13Research indicates it may be crucial for reproductive health, tissue protection, skin health, and age-related conditions such as ocular and neurological disorders.
Some view ergothioneine as a "longevity vitamin" due to its impact on aging.
Although not officially classified as a vitamin, ergothioneine is essential for normal growth and development.
It must be consumed through the diet as the body does not produce it.
✦
Importance of Ergothioneine in Oyster Mushrooms
09:04Oyster mushrooms are a primary dietary source of Ergothioneine, a potent compound with various health benefits.
Studies show a correlation between higher Ergothioneine consumption and lower mortality rates, particularly from cardiovascular diseases and neurological disorders.
Ergothioneine is associated with reduced mortality and decreased risk of cardiovascular disease.
The importance of Ergothioneine in the diet is highlighted, emphasizing the need to pay more attention to this compound found in edible mushrooms.
✦
Importance of Mushrooms in Human Health
13:11The speaker has extensive experience in the herbal industry and became a medical herbalist in 2013.
Mushrooms play a significant role in human health by interacting with the immune system through compounds like beta glucans.
Mushrooms act as prebiotics and contain beneficial molecules such as triterpenes and phenolic compounds.
Humans have a unique relationship with mushrooms, highlighting their potential health benefits.
✦
The importance of Ergo thionine in human health.
16:50Ergo theanine acts as an antioxidant and cytoprotective agent.
It is a crucial nutrient that cannot be produced internally by the body.
Works in conjunction with glutathione as part of the antioxidant team.
Provides protection against oxidative stress in the body.
✦
Ergothioneine is concentrated in specific tissues due to transporters bringing it in from food.
19:20Transporters are highly expressed in the small intestine and upregulated before meals.
The body efficiently absorbs ergothioneine, accumulating it in cells, especially in high oxidative stress tissues like red blood cells, liver, and the eye.
Transporters are also present in blood vessel linings.
Ergothioneine acts as a cytoprotective agent in red blood cells and helps manage oxidative stress in various tissues in the body.
✦
Ergothioneine acts as a unique antioxidant in cells with high oxidative stress, adapting to cellular pH levels.
22:52Ergothioneine specifically targets stressed cells, adjusting pH levels to counteract acidity and combat oxidative stress.
In unhealthy states, small changes in pH can have significant consequences, making Ergothioneine's ability to maintain cellular health crucial.
The adaptability of Ergothioneine to different cell conditions allows for effective antioxidant protection in varying environments.
✦
Ergothioneine's role in maintaining cell pH balance is crucial for human health.
26:15Ergothioneine is not produced in the body and must be obtained from the diet.
Limited availability of ergothioneine in common food sources raises questions about its evolutionary significance.
While not a strict vitamin, ergothioneine is conditionally essential for protecting against oxidative stress.
Ergothioneine supports overall health and development in humans.
✦
Importance of Ergothioneine for plant and human health.
29:58Ergothioneine is delivered to plants by soil fungi, but modern farming practices disrupt fungal communities and reduce levels in plants.
Low Ergothioneine levels in American population linked to increased mortality and disease risk.
Cooking mushrooms does not affect Ergothioneine content, longer cooking may enhance other benefits.
Regular Ergothioneine supplement suggested due to sporadic mushroom consumption; many people supplement due to inadequate diet.
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Potential benefits of Ergothioneine in reducing cardiovascular disease, lowering risk of neurodegenerative diseases, and improving sleep quality.
34:04Ergothioneine may help in reducing mortality and lowering the risk of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's disease.
Clinical trials are needed to validate the findings on the benefits of Ergothioneine.
Elderly individuals showed improvements in sleep quality and cognitive health with Ergothioneine supplementation.
Further studies are needed to explore the full extent of Ergothioneine's benefits on cognitive function and overall well-being.
✦
Importance of Ergothioneine in Healthy Aging
36:51Ergothioneine is linked to age-related disorders and is crucial for combating cognitive impairment and Alzheimer's disease.
Lack of antioxidant protection in cells can lead to disease development, making ergothioneine supplementation important for aging populations.
Research shows that supplementing with ergothioneine can improve cellular uptake and potentially prevent age-related issues.
Earlier studies suggest a deficiency of about three to four milligrams per day in the American diet.
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Importance of Ergothioneine Supplement in Health Benefits
41:44Studies are focusing on a daily intake of 20 milligrams of the supplement, a moderate amount.
Different mushroom varieties have varying levels of ergothioneine, with yellow oyster mushrooms having higher levels.
Consuming 100 grams of fresh exotic mushrooms daily can provide significant health benefits due to ergothioneine.
For most people, it may not be feasible to consume such large quantities of mushrooms, highlighting the need for high-quality supplements for optimal intake.
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Potential impact of mushrooms as functional medicine and nutrition source.
44:30Mushrooms may gain recognition as a separate food group due to their direct effects on human diets.
Ergine is essential for all vertebrates, highlighting the importance of considering supplements for pets.
Evolving research on mushrooms presents exciting possibilities for future consumption and health benefits.
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Benefits of Sharing Mushrooms with Pets
47:12Dr. Rob Silver discusses the idea of incorporating mushrooms into pets' diets.
Emphasis is placed on the benefits of mushrooms for pets and their overall health.
Importance of including pets in family health considerations is highlighted.
Information on learning more about mushrooms and interacting with experts, such as Dr. Rob Silver, is provided.
00:00welcome to the mushroom show the one
00:01place where you need to be if you want
00:02to stay on top of all the cool things
00:04happening in the world of mushrooms I'm
00:06your host Tony Shields this is episode
00:0838 and in this episode we're going to be
00:10talking about a secret superpower that
00:12mushrooms have in fact it's one that
00:14they share with humans and it might have
00:16some implications for helping us thrive
00:18in space we're also going to be talking
00:20about the most important nutrient you've
00:21never heard of a little known compound
00:24found in high amounts and edible
00:25mushrooms and some scientists have even
00:27dubbed it the longevity vitamin we're
00:29going to to be going over everything you
00:31need to know including an interview with
00:33Lee Carroll the chief medical herbalist
00:35at real mushrooms all about this
00:36incredible but confounding compound so
00:38if you like mushrooms if you like the
00:40mushroom show please go ahead and hit
00:41that like button it really does help the
00:43channel grow and if you want to see
00:44future episodes of the show make sure
00:45you go ahead and hit that subscribe
00:46Button as well let's jump into the show
00:48on to our first story a quick piece of
00:50mushroom news that I just had to talk
00:52about because we just did a segment a
00:54little while ago about how mushrooms
00:55might be the first step to colonizing
00:57Mars speaking more so about the
00:59potential for them to Shield humans and
01:01equipment from radiation so when I saw
01:03yet another piece on the mushroom Space
01:05story I had to dig in and to be honest
01:07this one doesn't seem that far-fetched
01:09it actually seems quite practical makes
01:11a lot of sense and is likely a lot
01:13closer to becoming a reality it all
01:15revolves around the fact that as
01:16mushrooms grow they actually breathe
01:18quite a bit like humans in that they
01:20exhale CO2 and CO2 although it gets
01:23quite a bad rrap for being too prevalent
01:25in the atmosphere these days it's
01:26actually crucial for plant life it's how
01:29plants breathe so humans and mushrooms
01:31breathe in oxygen and breathe out CO2
01:33but plants do the opposite for example
01:35sometimes when people grow plants
01:36indoors on an industrial scale they will
01:39sometimes bring in pressurized canisters
01:40of CO2 release that CO2 in the room and
01:43help the plants breathe help them grow
01:44better but mushrooms of course do this
01:46naturally they exhale CO2 and some
01:49people think that might be useful for
01:50helping to grow plants in space I saw an
01:53article recently from NBC Montana I'll
01:55put the link in the description all
01:57about the story of Garden City fungi who
01:59is a company in Montana with ambitions
02:01to harness the power of mycelium to
02:03create carbon dioxide essential for
02:05plant growth in space it's quite the
02:07ambition but they are slowly taking
02:09steps towards making that a reality and
02:11recently they collaborated with Florida
02:13Atlantic University to send little
02:14packages of mushroom melium different
02:16strains of mushroom mycelium into space
02:18or near space not exactly sure how you
02:21define space but basically they put them
02:23on a balloon that was 30 Mi above the
02:26surface of the Earth so I guess in the
02:28stratosphere they did this mainly to
02:29study the effects that solar radiation
02:31might have on different strains of
02:33mycelium and its subsequent CO2 output
02:36they sequenced the Genome of these
02:37specific strains of mycelium before they
02:39went out into space and then again
02:41sequenced them when they returned to
02:42Earth to observe the changes and
02:44according to the article what they were
02:46looking for were strains that could
02:47produce high levels of CO2 consistently
02:50and over long periods of time which
02:51would then potentially be able to act as
02:53an insitu source of CO2 that would help
02:55with plant cultivation either in space
02:57or on other planets now interestingly in
02:59mushroom cultivation generally this high
03:02production of CO2 is kind of a problem
03:04because the high levels of CO2 produced
03:06by mushrooms inside of a grow room will
03:09quite often cause mushrooms to have long
03:11skinny stems and tiny little caps which
03:13obviously isn't ideal if you're trying
03:15to just make gourmet mushrooms oyster
03:17mushrooms are the absolute worst at this
03:19they produce huge amounts of CO2 and
03:21this can affect the way that they grow
03:22again they grow these long stems and
03:24it's just very obvious that they're not
03:26getting enough oxygen because they have
03:27way too much CO2 the exception of course
03:29course is an noi which is one of those
03:31mushrooms which is purposefully grown in
03:33high CO2 environments where you get that
03:35long stem and that tiny little cap that
03:37classic in noi look but for the most
03:39part for Gourmet mushrooms this is
03:40something that people want to avoid they
03:42want to try and bring in lots of more
03:44fresh air into the grow room but it's
03:45just a feature that mushrooms have so
03:47not knowing anything about the actual
03:48strains they used I would think that
03:50they would be looking at oyster
03:51mushrooms because they grow fast they're
03:53super tenacious as and they can grow in
03:54all sorts of substrates and they can
03:55grow in all sorts of conditions and they
03:57produce tons of CO2 but is this going to
04:00realistically lead to actually being
04:02able to grow plants in space it seems
04:04wild it seems like this is something
04:06that is maybe way out into the future
04:08but I still think it's pretty cool to
04:09see and basically you got to start
04:10somewhere and on a very similar note in
04:12terms of useful micology I also saw an
04:14article recently that was talking about
04:16mosquito control using mushrooms and
04:18believe it or not it really uses the
04:20same concept this idea that mushrooms
04:21emit CO2 as they grow just like humans
04:24and livestock breathe out CO2 and that
04:26is apparently quite attractive to
04:28mosquitoes this is the Artic article
04:30that I saw trying out this idea on a
04:32golf course it's actually the same
04:33company which is kind of cool Garden
04:35City fungi finding all sorts of ways to
04:37benefit from the natural CO2 emissions
04:39from mushrooms and actually I have
04:41noticed this myself many years ago I was
04:43growing a bunch of oyster mushrooms
04:45outside and I noticed there was tons of
04:46these what looked to be mosquitoes that
04:48were just all over this Fring oyster log
04:51I did kind of have this idea that hey
04:52maybe this could be used for mosquito
04:54control but I didn't quite know what to
04:56do with this information but I guess the
04:58idea that was utilized here here was
05:00again CO2 attracts of mosquitoes
05:02specifically female mosquitoes that want
05:03to lay eggs which can then be trapped by
05:06sucking them up through a pump they were
05:07trying this out on a golf course and
05:10apparently they're working and can cover
05:12a few Acres with each of these units
05:15this is the best kind of micro
05:16technology something that's very
05:18practical it's useful it's here now and
05:20if it works it's way better than just
05:22spraying with mosquito spray we have
05:24pretty horrendous mosquitoes here where
05:25I live in Alberta over the summer so I
05:27might try this out this summer and I'll
05:29let you know how it works this episode
05:30of the mushroom show is brought to you
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06:08get yours let's get back to the show on
06:10to our next story talking about a
06:12compound found in mushrooms that might
06:14just be the most important nutrient
06:16you've never heard of now I've often
06:17said when it comes to functional
06:18mushrooms it's not the mushrooms
06:20themselves that make a difference right
06:21it's not these fleshy or these wooden
06:24blobs that are actually responsible for
06:26the benefits that they're so well known
06:27for no it is the compounds in side that
06:30make a difference and the compounds that
06:32most often take Center Stage are for
06:34example the beta glucans these long
06:36chains of polysaccharides that form an
06:38integral part of the mushroom cell wall
06:41that are kind of the unifying factor of
06:43all functional mushrooms and mostly
06:45responsible for the immune supporting
06:47benefits that mushrooms have or the
06:48triterpenes for example which are also
06:51well known and they're most prevalent
06:52and important for mushrooms like RI for
06:55example or for chaga and there's also
06:57other specialty compounds like corpin in
07:00Corps or the Heron and arines in Lion
07:03man these are the well-known compounds
07:04that we talk about all the time but
07:06mushrooms are really good chemists they
07:08are full of other interesting compounds
07:10that are sometimes overlooked but there
07:11is one specific compound found in
07:13mushrooms that is starting to get a lot
07:15more attention and it might just secure
07:17a place up there with the much better
07:19known compounds in fact some scientists
07:21have argued that it is so essential to
07:23human health that it should be
07:24considered as a vitamin it's called Ergo
07:26thionine and technically it's an amino
07:28acid but in the human body it acts as a
07:30powerful antioxidant and what's
07:32interesting about this particular
07:33antioxidant is that it seems to show up
07:35in tissues that are commonly associated
07:37with oxidative damage such as the bone
07:39marrow the liver the kidneys and the
07:40eyes for that reason it's thought to be
07:42important to overall human health and
07:44research has shown it could be a factor
07:46for Reproductive Health prevention of
07:47tissue injury protection of the skin but
07:50also as we get older things that are
07:52part of the aging process such as ocular
07:54health neurological disorders and
07:56cardiovascular disorders there have
07:58actually been a number of studies
07:59suggest blood levels of Ergo thionine
08:01decrease as we age which again is why
08:04many have dubbed this compound the
08:05longevity vitamin but could you really
08:07consider it a vitamin well vitamins are
08:09generally defined as organic compounds
08:11that are essential for normal growth and
08:13nutrition and are required in small
08:15quantities in the diet because they
08:16cannot be synthesized by the body
08:18although it's not a closed case it sure
08:19seems that ergothioneine is essential
08:22for health for normal growth and for
08:23development and perhaps that is
08:25something that will be figured out over
08:26time but the second part is a lot more
08:28clear ergothioneine is not produced in
08:30any direct path within the body and
08:32needs to be obtained from the diet which
08:33is really wild to think about because
08:35although it's found in small amounts and
08:37certain foods dietary levels of orine
08:39are not really found in that many places
08:41it is really only made by some bacteria
08:43specifically cyano bacteria so think of
08:45like spirulina and then of course
08:47mushrooms which turns out to be the
08:49primary dietary source of this powerful
08:51and important compound the amount of
08:52Virgo thionine and mushrooms can vary
08:54significantly between different species
08:56with oyster mushrooms most often only
08:57thought of as a gourmet mushroom but in
08:59my opinion should probably be classified
09:01as a functional mushroom generally
09:02having some of the highest Ergo thyine
09:04content when compared to everything else
09:06the typical American diet unfortunately
09:08doesn't usually contain a lot of oyster
09:09mushrooms and in general is low in Ergo
09:12thyine consumption which according to
09:13one study published in the Journal of
09:15nutritional science titled is ergo
09:17thionine a longevity vitamin Limited in
09:18the American diet has some pretty
09:20startling correlations obviously
09:21correlation is not causation but still
09:24these graphs are pretty interesting to
09:25look at you can see this one here has
09:27total mortality per 100 ,000 graphed
09:30against estimated Ergo consumption and
09:33you can see there's a pretty clear Trend
09:34down to the right with higher Ergo
09:36thionine consumption being related to
09:39lower total mortality in a similar vein
09:41this chart here shows mortality from
09:43neurological disorders plotted against
09:45estimated Ergo consumptions and you can
09:47see that it has a very similar Trend
09:50with higher Ergo consumption generally
09:52being related to lower mortality from
09:54neurological disorders with the outlier
09:56here being Finland for some reason and
09:58this third chart shows just total life
10:00expectancy again plotted against
10:02estimated ergothioneine consumption and
10:04you can see there's another clear Trend
10:05up and to the right with life expectancy
10:08generally increasing in correlation to
10:10estimated ergothioneine consumption
10:12which is really interesting this is all
10:14supported by another study published in
10:15heartt in 2020 titled ergothioneine is
10:18associated with reduced mortality and
10:20decreased risk of cardiovascular disease
10:23that looked at 112 different plasma
10:25metabolites from over 3,200 individuals
10:28and found that ergo inine was the
10:30metabolite most strongly connected to a
10:32quote health conscious food pattern and
10:34was associated with lower risk of
10:36coronary disease cardiovascular
10:37mortality and overall mortality all very
10:40interesting and it all boils down to the
10:41fact that we should probably be paying
10:43more attention to this little bit of
10:44fungal magic to help understand more
10:46deeply this topic of Ergo thionine
10:48including its foundational role in the
10:50human body and its relationship to
10:52edible mushrooms I sat down with Lee
10:54Carroll who is the chief medical
10:56herbalist at real mushrooms on a mission
10:58to distill complex clroom and herbal
11:00knowledge into practical clinically
11:02relevant insights that Empower
11:03individuals and practitioners alike I
11:05got the chance to meet Lee last summer
11:07at the mushroom Summit in Denver and I
11:09always wanted to have him on the show
11:10now Ergo thine is a topic that he is
11:12deeply passionate about so I thought
11:13this was the perfect opportunity to
11:15bring him on the show let's jump into
11:16the discussion Lee Carol thank you so
11:18much for joining us today on the
11:20mushroom show my pleasure Tony it's it's
11:23great to be here looking forward to it
11:25yeah I'm super excited to chat with you
11:26as well now first of all why don't you
11:28tell the audience a a little bit about
11:30who you are your background and what got
11:32you interested in mushrooms in the first
11:34place sure um I've had quite a long
11:36career in herbal medicine I started as a
11:38production manager at a company called
11:40mediherb back in 1990 so coming in on
11:43nearly 35 years in that industry so I've
11:46done done lots of different things I've
11:48had great kind of training and
11:49background along the way I went back and
11:52did another degree and got qualified as
11:54a medical herbalist so I'm in I'm in
11:55clinical practice so you're sitting in
11:57my clinic now uh I've been doing that
12:00since
12:012013 and I got interested in mushrooms
12:03in 2020 I developed a a small range of
12:07products for a company in Northern
12:08California and that introduced me to
12:10namx and then the love affair of
12:13mushrooms kind of grew from there and
12:15winding forward over the few years um
12:18you know I'm now now the chief um
12:21medical herbalist at real mushrooms and
12:22I'm very excited about that yeah that's
12:24very cool I mean you said the Micha
12:26Revolution there's definitely something
12:27happening there it's been kind of
12:29swelling under the surface and people
12:30who have been close to it think that
12:31it's kind of already blown up but I
12:33really think that we're just kind of
12:34getting started I got the chance to meet
12:36you at the mushroom Summit in Denver
12:37which was kind of the first annual
12:40Gathering more so on the business side
12:42of mushrooms but you know that's just
12:43another sign of things to come and how
12:46we're just getting started because
12:47mushrooms are are powerful right but
12:50they're not necessarily powerful because
12:51of the mushrooms they're powerful
12:52because the compounds inside of them so
12:54I thought that would be a good place to
12:56start and from your perspective if you
12:58could give us maybe a brief overview of
13:00some of these better known compounds
13:01inside a mushroom specifically like
13:03betag glucans and triterpenes you know
13:05typically the ones we think of as active
13:07compounds and a little bit about kind of
13:09what they are and and how they're linked
13:11to human health sure um and I agree with
13:14you mus mushrooms are really popular at
13:17the moment but there's still a long way
13:18to go to you know penetrate the
13:20Consciousness because they are just so
13:22important and humans have got a unique
13:25relationship with with the with the
13:27fungal realm and and you know from a
13:30from a disease point of view human
13:32immune systems have evolved to be
13:36defending against fungal attack so we
13:39you know we don't want to get fungal
13:40diseases so mushrooms don't cause
13:42disease but they have the same sort of
13:44signatures that pathogenic mush the
13:47pathogenic fungi do so the beta glucans
13:50in
13:51mushrooms U naturally interact with um a
13:54number of our immunological receptors to
13:58bring about
13:59uh improved function within the immune
14:01system so improved recognition of of
14:04what's a pathogen uh improved you know
14:07cellular function across both the
14:09Adaptive and the innate immune systems
14:11so that that area is probably the
14:13biggest area um and gets a lot of
14:15research but beta glucans are also
14:18prebiotics so a lot of the action of of
14:21mushrooms is is a Prebiotic action that
14:24those beta glucans get converted into
14:26short chain fatty acids and they have
14:28you know global effects in the body as
14:30well but there's kiten which is a the
14:32structural thing in mushrooms that
14:34allows them to be erect and strong and
14:37that acts as a Prebiotic as well um
14:39there's micost sterols ergosterol gets
14:42converted to vitamin D2 so you know
14:44there's a big piece around that and you
14:46mentioned trines there's also phenolic
14:49molecules so those secondary metabolites
14:53play an important role in antioxidant
14:55defenses and some of the triterpenes are
14:58where the adaptogenic effects come from
15:02from a mushroom like say RI or charer
15:05where they they get into cells and they
15:07educate the they help the cells and they
15:09educate them to be you know more
15:11functional and more resistant to stress
15:13Etc but there's a long taale of really
15:16important molecules um that also provide
15:19a benefit and a mushroom it's not just
15:21about the one thing it's the whole
15:22constellation of of constituents that
15:25drive the efficacy that we see yeah and
15:28I love the way that you frame initially
15:29this whole idea that we've kind of
15:30evolved along with mushrooms in order to
15:32try and fight off you know fungal
15:34pathogens and that's why our bodies are
15:37immune systems react so naturally to
15:39mushrooms and I think that's kind of
15:40cool because that's a key point but the
15:42other key point from what you're saying
15:44it seems like mushrooms are just kind of
15:45incredible chemists right they're
15:47producing all sorts of compounds um a
15:50lot of them have pretty substantial
15:52effects on the human body you mentioned
15:54some of them but there is another
15:56compound that I wanted to talk about
15:57today it's one that's getting you know
15:59it's much less well known historically
16:01but it's starting to get a lot more
16:03attention and I think I've heard you
16:04call it before the most important
16:06nutrient you've never heard of it's
16:09called Ergo thionine I was hoping you
16:11could give us kind of a brief overview
16:12of what that is sure and uh Ergo
16:16thionine Ergo theanine uh I think is the
16:20most amazing kind of you know discovery
16:23that I've I've made in my 35 years um
16:27I've talked about a lot of things you
16:29know in my educational environment
16:31talked about Nrf2 for example U you know
16:34long before it was popular
16:36gop1 with o oek is really popular now I
16:40was talking about that 10 years ago and
16:42how herbs would you know influence the
16:44production of that so Ergo theanine uh
16:48is an incredibly important molecule for
16:50human health and the human body is
16:53designed to um need it as a nutrient so
16:57we can't make it we've got to get it
16:58from an external Source um just just
17:02like you know amino acids you know for
17:04example we can't make those and Ergo
17:08theanine acts as a as an antioxidant
17:11although antioxidant is a kind of it's a
17:14it's a Vex term because there's a myth
17:17around antioxidant activity that if you
17:19take antioxidants you'll cure diseases
17:22of of oxidative stress and that kind of
17:24hasn't been proven before so um
17:29when when you look at Ergo theine it's
17:31got some really unique properties um
17:34which make it incredibly valuable to
17:37human health and it's it's probably
17:40better described as a
17:42cytoprotective so it gets involved as a
17:45member of the antioxidant team so when
17:48we think about antioxidant action in the
17:50human body we we can think about
17:52intracellular and extracellular
17:55compartments and the Ergo theanine gets
17:57involved in the interest cellular
17:59compartment and it plays an important um
18:02Team role along with glutathione which
18:05is the main intracellular
18:08antioxidant and that evolutionary
18:10comment you know we talked about earlier
18:13in
18:14fungi Ergo theanine is the main
18:16antioxidant intracellularly and
18:18glutathione is the secondary one the
18:21backup one and in a human glutathione is
18:23the primary one and ero theanine is the
18:26backup one so that you you know the the
18:29the fungal and the and the animal
18:31environments um share the same
18:34relationships but they're flipped around
18:37I think that's so cool and that's you
18:38know just another example of how
18:40mushrooms and fungi are in sorry humans
18:43and fungi are inherently related um I
18:45haven't heard that one before but it's
18:46pretty cool there's you know you keep
18:48seeing these different things and how
18:50we're so interconnected with with
18:52mushrooms um which is which is super
18:54neat now speaking of that though I have
18:56read in terms of ergine that it's found
18:58in high concentrations in certain
19:00tissues it's one of those antioxidants
19:02that seems to accumulate in certain
19:04tissues in the body and I was wondering
19:06what you could uh if you could
19:08potentially explain like why these
19:10particular tissues accumulate more
19:12ergothioneine and what implications this
19:14might have for human health and
19:15including like what parts of the body
19:17seem to accumulate more erine well part
19:20of the the uniqueness of Ergo theanine
19:23uh is that the human body has got
19:25Transporters which bring Ergo theanine
19:28in from from the from the food that we
19:30consume so these Transporters are
19:32expressed in very high levels in the
19:34small intestine and there's some in the
19:36in the large intestine so we we avidly
19:39bring it in and the the body's very good
19:41at harvesting it and there's a natural
19:44wisdom around this and when we have
19:46regular eating times in animal studies
19:48these Transporters get up regulated
19:51before the meal so the body knows that
19:53there's a meal coming and that they'll
19:55get some ergine so the ability to
19:57harvest it is increased and then those
20:00Transporters are expressed
20:02constitutively so they're expressed in
20:04many cells um all a time um and then
20:08ergine gets taken up into those cells
20:12and the these Transporters they're like
20:13doorways that allow these molecules in
20:17but they only work one way once the
20:19erine gets in that transporter can't
20:22transport it back out of the cell so it
20:25gets kind of stuck in there so the the
20:27body avidly hangs on to to this stuff
20:29and then it's also inducible so if
20:31there's if there's elevated stress in a
20:33certain tissue and on the on the DNA the
20:38the the um the inflammatory genes and
20:41the genes for the production of these
20:42Transporters are very closely linked
20:45together so where there's inflammation
20:47you get an increase in the production of
20:49these Transporters that brings more Ergo
20:51theanine in so coming back to the
20:53question now that I've set the scene for
20:54that um erines are the highest in red
20:58blood cells and it's the highest um in
21:00liver tissue and in red blood cells Ergo
21:03theanine because they're an unusual cell
21:05that don't have a nucleus um you know
21:07they got a different kind of arrangement
21:09Ergo theine plays a really important
21:11role as a cytoprotective within a red
21:14blood cell but the liver is a site of um
21:17very high uh demands in terms of dealing
21:20with oxidative stress and so it's no
21:24surprise that it's high there um some
21:26tissues just in the body naturally
21:29experience high levels of stress like
21:31the eye is exposed to the atmosphere so
21:34high levels of oxygen um and the retinor
21:36in the ey is exposed to lots of UV light
21:39so Ergo theanine Transporters um you
21:42know are highly expressed in those
21:45tissues as well um the Linings of the
21:47blood vessels are a site of high
21:49oxidative stress so there's there's lots
21:51of Transporters and ero theanine there
21:54but just about every cell in the body um
21:57you know has the Capac City to use this
21:59molecule it's um it's it's fascinating
22:03the way that it works and if just just
22:05at the risk of going a little bit long
22:07in answering this question um
22:10antioxidants are have a double edge to
22:12them so if you have too much of an
22:14antioxidant it it can become prooxidant
22:17like with vitamin C you know humans need
22:19about you know 80 milligrams 100
22:21milligrams a day to be healthy um if you
22:24have really high doses it become can
22:26become prooxidant same with vitamin E if
22:28you have too much Alpha toopal it can
22:30actually make things worse not better um
22:33so ergine doesn't have this problem
22:36because it's got this unique uh
22:38characteristic where it exists in two
22:41different forms it's technically called
22:42a tortimer that doesn't really matter
22:45though but it changes its shape
22:48depending on the cellular pH so ergine
22:52inside the cell um and if that cell's
22:54happy and harmonious and everything's
22:57functioning normally GL thion doing its
22:59thing um then Ergo theanine sits in its
23:03inactive form which is called a thione
23:06form as the cellular pH drops and normal
23:10cellular pH is about 7.4 so as it drops
23:13below that uh this the shape of the of
23:16the Ergo theanine just instantaneously
23:19flicks into a different shape and it
23:21becomes its thol form and in that form
23:24it can act as an antioxidant and do its
23:26thing so it's all to do with the health
23:29of the cell so coming back to the liver
23:33you know which is a really good example
23:35the demands that get placed on the
23:37hepatocytes in the liver go up and down
23:39depending on the nutrients that are
23:41being given to it so if you just had a
23:43couple of glasses of cocacola and you
23:45got a lot of sugar in your system then
23:47there's a lot of oxidative stress in
23:49those cells as they break down you know
23:51that that glucose into its uh you know
23:54constituent bits turns it into ATP
23:57eventually so the levels of glutathione
24:00go up and down in the cell depending on
24:02how many free radicals are being
24:03produced so Ergo theanine flicks in and
24:08out of its active form based on the
24:09amount of Ergo theanine sorry the amount
24:11of glutathione that goes up and down
24:14which Alters the pH of the cell so when
24:17you got free radicals or oxidative
24:19stress it it Alters the pH makes the
24:22cells more acidic so Ergo has got this
24:25really unique ability uh so it only has
24:30negligible effects in healthy cells so
24:32it it's it's only doing its thing when
24:35there's when there's some sort of
24:37cellular uh acidity which correlates
24:39with cellular stress that is absolutely
24:42fascinating I mean human physiology is
24:44insanely complicated so you know there's
24:46there's a lot baked into everything you
24:47just said to try and understand it and
24:50pH is something that really stood out to
24:52me and I'm just wondering you said like
24:53the um basically the structure of ergine
24:57can change depending on the pH of the
24:59cell I think I interpreted that
25:00correctly
25:01yeah can the pH of the cell or the pH of
25:04the body I guess also be changed by the
25:07concentration of Ergo thionine does that
25:09is that able to alter the pH of the cell
25:11at all or is it only a oneway oneway
25:13streak yeah that's a good question when
25:15we're in an unhealthy State and we've
25:18got excessive amounts of oxidative
25:20stress it makes the body acidic and
25:23we're talking very small changes you
25:25know like if your pH and your blood
25:26changes too much you know it's it's a
25:29lethal kind of consequence so we're
25:31talking about very fine
25:33variations um so Ergo theanine plays a
25:37really important role in controlling the
25:40the internal pH of the cells so it's
25:44it's probably the latter that as the pH
25:46becomes more acidic it's the Ergo
25:48theanine that brings that back to a more
25:51um healthy a normal pH the population at
25:55large is deficient uh in ero theanine so
25:59that that plays a role in increased
26:02acidity um if you want to think about it
26:04in that way and that that then leads to
26:08you know greater health challenges in
26:09the general population yeah and that's
26:11one thing that I find absolutely
26:13fascinating about Ergo as well is this
26:15fact that you know some people will call
26:17it a vitamin right or or some scientists
26:19I know are trying to call it a vitamin
26:20saying that number one it's um you know
26:23it's essential for human health normal
26:25growth and development but number two
26:26it's not produced inside the body so it
26:28needs to be found in small amounts needs
26:30to be received from the diet but it's
26:32not found in that many things and I just
26:34think that is like pretty fascinating um
26:37it's found in mushrooms obviously in the
26:39highest amounts any thought to why that
26:42is like why it's so restricted in terms
26:44of where we can get it from in our diet
26:46it's an interesting question it takes us
26:47back to that
26:48evolutionary uh argument and humans
26:53animals in general and fungi have got
26:56this shared kind of ancestor that goes
26:58back you know like a 100 million years
27:02thousand million years and so we've got
27:05to a certain extent there's similar
27:07Arrangements in terms of our physiology
27:10at that cellular level so um some
27:13bacteria make Ergo theanine but it's
27:16predominantly a fungal thing and because
27:19of that shared history humans and and
27:22fungi share the same um aspect just like
27:26fungi got ergosterol humans have got
27:28cholesterol you know the they're very
27:30very similar you know molecules so we we
27:33we share that history and the question
27:36about whether it's a vitamin or not um
27:39is a good one Bruce ases uh was the
27:41first researcher to coin the term
27:44vitamin L and he was proposing that it
27:46should be called a vitamin but vitamin
27:49scientists are really the conventional
27:51ones are very strict with their
27:53definitions and you know if you've got a
27:55deficiency of vitamin C you get scurvy
27:57if you got a deficiency of vitamin D you
27:59get rickets if you've got a deficiency
28:01of Ergo theine you don't get a
28:04particular disease you get an increased
28:06risk of all sorts of diseases around
28:08oxidative stress so it's it doesn't kind
28:11of fit that definition but it's it's
28:14definitely conditionally essential
28:16there's there's compensatory mechanisms
28:18that the body has so if you have low
28:20levels of it um you know other things
28:22can play a role to help you out but I do
28:25think it is a vitamin I think that our
28:27definition are just a bit too tight to
28:29take into account something that's just
28:32so Global in terms of what it does it's
28:34doing so many things compared to vitamin
28:37C or you know vitamin D to use those two
28:40examples and it's it's probably more
28:42like vitamin D than anything else in
28:44terms of its pleotrophic actions in the
28:46body which interestingly is also found
28:50uh in mushrooms in mushrooms yeah yeah
28:53now is it fair to say that if you're not
28:56eating like in your opinion if you're
28:57not eating enough mushrooms you're
28:59probably not getting enough ergine is
29:01there enough of a correlation there yeah
29:03that's that's true um and much of the
29:06population don't consume mushroom so
29:09that that lowers their natural intake of
29:13of this important nutrient in in soil
29:16the soil fungi um deliver Ergo theanine
29:19to the plants um so you can get some
29:23Ergo theanine from Plants it's
29:26about about 100 times less than you
29:28would get from a mushroom and modern
29:31agricultural practices which which rely
29:33on fertilizers and this intensive
29:36farming disrupt those fungal communities
29:39in the soil so that further like reduces
29:43the amount of Ergo and then get that
29:45gets into plants and researchers like
29:47you know beelman for example you know
29:49they've they've looked at this and
29:51populations around the world have got
29:53different levels of Ergo theanine uh you
29:56know depending on their diets and the
29:58American population um is particularly
30:01low uh in erine and that that has got
30:04these associations with with increased
30:07mortality and increased cardiovascular
30:10and neurodegenerative diseases so
30:13associations aren't causations but when
30:15you understand how Ergo theanine works
30:17you know it's it's it seems to be quite
30:20a clearcut kind of direct relationship
30:23yeah I I did see that study that I think
30:25you're referring to and it had all these
30:26correlations with the mount of Ergo
30:28consumed and one of them was just life
30:31expectancy and it was like a pretty
30:33clear cut up and to the right life
30:35expectancy is correlated with increased
30:38consumption of Ergo thionine and again
30:40like you say correlation is not
30:41causation but uh you get enough of these
30:43and it definitely makes you think like
30:45maybe this is something we should be
30:46looking into yeah the evidence is
30:48clearly mounting yeah yeah for sure I I
30:51love to get into some of that research
30:53um in a bit but first of all I just
30:55wanted to ask like you mentioned some of
30:56the ways soil is being treated might
31:00affect the content of her goine but when
31:02it comes to mushrooms like if you're
31:03eating mushrooms is there any sort of
31:05cooking or Preparation methods that
31:07might either preserve or enhance or
31:09maybe detract from the amount of ergine
31:11content mushrooms like is it heat
31:13tolerant and all that kind of stuff yeah
31:15that that is a very good question um and
31:17that that was one of the questions I had
31:19when I first started you know getting my
31:21head around Ergo theine but it is a very
31:23robust molecule um and it's it survives
31:28um you know the cooking process so you
31:29don't have to be concerned about how you
31:31cook it um the the Ergo theanine will be
31:34retained but when you're thinking about
31:37consuming mushrooms from you know all
31:39all of the constituents that have got
31:42benefits um you know to get the beta
31:44glue cans out the longer you cook them
31:46the better so like as a soup for a
31:48couple of hours gives you the best
31:50outcomes but a lot of people don't cook
31:53anymore so talking about cooking uh is
31:57kind of a very narrow slice of the
31:59population so I think that you know
32:01because mushrooms are the dominant are
32:04the source of Ergo theine I think it
32:07makes sense for people to consider
32:08having a regular supplement um in that
32:11in their diet to um to to counteract the
32:15sporadic nature of of of mushroom
32:18consumption yeah I think that makes a
32:20lot of sense and yeah people do that
32:21with all sorts of nutrients I mean at
32:22the end of the day probably the best
32:24source to get a lot of stuff is just
32:27through high qu quality organic food but
32:29a lot of people don't get that which is
32:31why they supplement with all sorts of
32:32things everything from ergo like you
32:34mentioned but some people even
32:35supplement with protein for example
32:37because they're not getting enough of it
32:39through their normal diet so I think
32:42that makes a lot of sense and it's a lot
32:44easier way to kind of integrate that
32:45into your life than growing oyster
32:47mushrooms or getting oyster mushrooms
32:49all the time um another question I had
32:52though you talked a little bit about
32:54some of the research and it seems like
32:56there's more research that is more more
32:58recent that is starting to expose a lot
33:00of these potential benefits and the
33:01importance of ergothioneine can you talk
33:03a little bit about some of the research
33:05I know you mentioned that the
33:06correlation between longevity and ero
33:08thionine um but can you pinpoint some
33:11other kind of interesting research that
33:12is happening right now in in this
33:15realm yeah it's it's a tough question to
33:18answer that one because there's there's
33:20a bit of a lack of research in ero at
33:22the moment so the the bulk of the
33:25research on erine is epidemiological so
33:29researchers look at
33:32populations um so they they might look
33:34at a population and then follow that
33:36population for you know a number of
33:39years and then they'll measure Ergo
33:41theine at the start and then they'll
33:42measure it at the end and then they'll
33:44observe the changes in their health so
33:46there's there's a number of studies that
33:48have done that and Ergo theanine
33:51associated with reduced cardiovascular
33:53disease and it's associated with reduced
33:56cardiovascular mortality
33:58um the the strongest evidence is within
34:02the the neurodegenerative disease
34:04category so people with low levels of
34:08Ergo theanine have got higher risks of
34:11developing Alzheimer's disease cognitive
34:14impairment Parkinson's disease vascular
34:16dementia for example so there's quite a
34:19quite a you know significant amount of
34:22data like from that realm but they're
34:25not clinical trials and we really need
34:27clinical trials to kind of achieve the
34:30modern gold standard for what research
34:32can provide and that's just beginning to
34:35happen now with Ergo theing relatively
34:37recently there was a study published um
34:41by
34:42KATU uh a Japanese researcher I think it
34:45was um 2022 so relatively recently and
34:50they gave elderly people 20 milligrams
34:53of Ergo theanine a day and then observed
34:56changes in their sleep um quite a
35:00sophisticated study they looked at the
35:02oxidative environment of the body and
35:04measured particular molecules and there
35:06were quite profound in improvements in
35:10aspects of sleep in this aging
35:12population which aging people have
35:14issues with so there were aspects of
35:16deep sleep that were
35:18improved um which may link um ergine to
35:24the the cognitive stuff because if when
35:26when you have deep sleep that allows
35:29your brain to go through a cleansing
35:31program through the lymphatic system so
35:34that that was a very interesting study
35:36but that's about it you know there's
35:39there's a lowlevel study with with
35:41people with mild cognitive impairment
35:44where they showed these sort of minor
35:46improvements but we I'm kind of waiting
35:49with baited breath for more studies to
35:51um be be published yeah I did see one I
35:54think it's about four years old now and
35:55it was talking about these re
35:57researchers were looking at a whole
35:59array of different metabolites in Blood
36:01and they I think they looked at like 110
36:03different metabolites and the number one
36:06that was correlated with um lower rates
36:10of mortality I believe was Ergo like one
36:13out of whatever and that study by Smith
36:17I think it was um the lead author and uh
36:20it was conducted over like 18 or 20
36:22years so they they did a snapshot at the
36:24beginning and then again at the end um
36:27so you know even though it's a
36:30epidemiology you know it's kind of
36:33research it's pretty it's the Smoking
36:35Gun you know like there's there's a lot
36:37of credibility around that sort of stuff
36:39when you get you know such well done
36:41research and there's a number of studies
36:43that back that up you know Japanese
36:45researchers have done similar things
36:47other researchers have looked at
36:49different disease processes an ergo
36:51theine tends to pop out you know as one
36:53of the most highly correlated uh in
36:56nutrients that is is lo that is
36:59associated with these particular
37:01conditions yeah and you mentioned uh it
37:03seems to be helpful in the research for
37:07age Related Disorders and I almost kind
37:10of think of it as this I don't want to
37:11say anti-aging but it seems like it is
37:14pretty important in a healthy aging
37:17process is there anything particular
37:20about it that's a reason for that or or
37:22do you just think it's it's because it's
37:23so important for human health that um
37:25you know if we don't have enough of it
37:26as we age that's when more of these bad
37:29things start to happen and that's why
37:30it's correlated yeah well it's the
37:31Chicken and the Egg and you know there
37:34isn't enough research to kind of fully
37:36tease all of that out but my my
37:38perspective on it is that uh you know
37:40the the the diseases of
37:43Aging don't just happen when we're old
37:45you know like you don't get to 65 which
37:48is I'm 65 in a couple of months you
37:51don't get to 65 and then things just
37:53sort of fall apart you know the the the
37:56processes that underpin the development
37:58of these age related diseases and well
38:01cognitive impairment Alzheimer's disease
38:03are good examples um you know they're
38:05happening 20 years or so you know before
38:07the onset so it's it's very likely that
38:11you know in the middle of our life you
38:13know the the lack of antioxidant
38:17protection in the cells creates an
38:19environment that allows these diseases
38:23you know to develop um but there are
38:26some other unique factors is as we get
38:28older um it might be that we're less
38:31able to take Ergo theanine up so there
38:35might be an issue with Transporter
38:37production so when I say you know we
38:39still don't know there's a few of these
38:42like technical issues that haven't quite
38:44been resolved yet
38:46so as a clinician you know my approach
38:49to this you know with patients is you
38:51know as we get older we we we should be
38:55taking more ergo theanine uh and it
38:58should become a more regular aspect you
39:01know of of our daily kind of regime
39:04that's interesting though because if you
39:05say um you know one of the reasons why
39:07we're lacking in it as we get older is
39:09because your body might lose the ability
39:11to kind of take it up uh or I guess
39:13absorb it into the cells or whatever
39:15analogy we want to make could that be
39:18essentially solved by supplementing with
39:20more ergothioneine or do you think that
39:22there just kind of like a permanent
39:24disability in order to take that up and
39:25it just body I think it's solved by
39:28taking more ergine and these these
39:31studies that are starting to be done in
39:32aging populations you know demonstrate
39:35that you can move the dial uh you know
39:38when when you take Ergo theanine as a
39:40supplement and um the the daily need for
39:44it U you know According to some of the
39:46earlier research bman was suggesting
39:48that the American diet was deficient by
39:50about three to four milligrams a day so
39:53you know rounding that up you know five
39:55milligrams is a nice number you know per
39:58day um but then as you get older um you
40:01know the studies that are being done are
40:03looking at 20 milligrams a day so you
40:06know maybe 20
40:08milligrams um you know sounds like a lot
40:10but it is it isn't really um in terms of
40:14you know the taking a taking a
40:16supplement um you know there's plenty of
40:19plenty of supplements that that you need
40:21in much higher quantities like you know
40:23say Resveratrol and circumin you know
40:26there in the hundreds of milligrams a
40:29day now if you were to this is another
40:32reason why supplementation works so well
40:33is because um you can just figure out
40:35what the dose is and go with that but if
40:37you were to actually eat them say you
40:38were to eat oyster mushrooms is that a
40:40lot is that like a whole fist full of
40:42oyster mushrooms every single day or or
40:45how does that relate to the amount of
40:46mushrooms you'd actually have to eat to
40:47accomplish that that that that's a good
40:49question and the the amount of ergine
40:52varies um depending on the mushroom so
40:55mushrooms that are considered
40:57you know high in Ergo theing so you
40:59mentioned oyster mushroom but you could
41:01put um Lion Man in that category as well
41:06okay and I think Ergo theanine is a
41:08secret kind of in ingredient you know
41:12that makes Lions M so unique like in the
41:14cognitive realm so they have about one
41:17milligram per gram of dry
41:21mushroom um shitake is just a little bit
41:23on the lower side of that uh you know
41:26button and PTO Bell criminy they're
41:28around half half a milligram per dried
41:31gram so um in terms of fresh weights
41:35you'd multiply those by 10 so um if
41:38you're having an ounce of of you know a
41:42say a shitake or a lines man or an
41:44oyster mushroom um then you'd be getting
41:47around three
41:48milligrams um but yeah certain varieties
41:52will have higher level so the yellow
41:55oyster mushroom um
41:57which has got the the unpronouncable
42:00citrino polius species name I even have
42:04trouble with that um it can get up to 10
42:07milligrams per gram of dried mushroom so
42:11um V variations on the oyster mushroom
42:15theme can see uh increased levels so to
42:19answer your question directly and you
42:21know button mushrooms and portter Bellow
42:23are mostly what people eat if you're
42:25talking about the general population you
42:27know there's a lot of interest in the
42:29Exotic ones but you know that's a very
42:31small slice of the population that are
42:33eating those so you'd need around a 100
42:35grams a day um to get fresh ones to get
42:40you know a decent level of of Ergo
42:42theanine and that's that's that's been
42:45clinically trialed and if you do that
42:46with people they lose weight you know
42:49all sorts of health benefits but I just
42:52don't think it's practical to say that
42:54to the general population to eat that
42:56much you know mushroom a day so it
42:59clearly puts an emphasis on having a
43:02supplement a good quality supplement
43:04with yellow oyster uh where you can get
43:06you know really high levels you know
43:08just just in a single kind of capture
43:10yeah I think that's so cool I did not
43:11know that about yellow oyster and I
43:13guess the other thing that's interesting
43:14about yellow oysters is most people
43:16probably don't eat it ever because it
43:18travels so poorly so like unless you're
43:20growing it yourself or maybe get it from
43:22the farmers market that morning um
43:24you're probably not going to have any
43:25good quantities of yellow oyster I have
43:27seen them in the grocery store before
43:29and often they don't look so good the
43:31bigger oyster mushrooms tend to do so
43:33well but the yellows are delicate um but
43:35that's super interesting that they're so
43:36high in in Ergo thine um but I wanted to
43:41pick up on the other interesting thing
43:42that you said and you mentioned Lion's
43:43man which also I also didn't know that
43:46had a high concentration of it but I
43:47think it's so cool that you correlated
43:49to hey maybe that's one of the reasons
43:50why this thing is known as the brain
43:52mushroom or the cognitive mushroom um
43:54I've had that thought before about
43:56liines man but not for Ergo more so
43:59because of gut health because I know
44:01some people will like to use that mus
44:02for gut health and we know how the gut
44:04and the brain are related and it just
44:06goes back to this idea that like human
44:08physiology is complicated mushrooms are
44:10complicated when you put those two
44:12things together it becomes really
44:13complicated and you know there's
44:15probably more that we don't know than
44:17what we do know at this point um which
44:20makes it really exciting yeah it's just
44:23it really opens up the possibilities
44:25because like mushrooms are already so
44:26exciting but we're learning more and
44:27more over every day um which leads me to
44:30my next question is I'm wondering from
44:31your perspective like how do you foresee
44:33this new I put that in quotes air quotes
44:36new compound kind of taking over in in
44:39functional medicine and nutrition how do
44:41you see this evolving over the next
44:42decade are are we goingon to start to
44:43see a lot more of it yeah I think it's
44:45the next big thing Tony it's um it's
44:48kind of poised to to penetrate the
44:51Consciousness you know of the of the of
44:54the masses and uh the the thing thing
44:57that's holding it back at the moment is
44:58just the lack of human clinical trials
45:00and once we've got a few more human
45:02clinical trials uh that are that are
45:04positive and I'm sure they will be um
45:07then uh it'll kind of open up that
45:09Pandora's Box and I think it'll help to
45:13put mushrooms back on the agenda for the
45:15general population as a as a separate
45:18food group because currently it gets
45:20kind of lumped in under the under the
45:21vegetable
45:23category and uh you know food pyramids
45:26don't take it into account so I think
45:28that you know mushrooms will will take
45:31on much greater significance uh in terms
45:34of human diets and there'll be a much
45:37greater focus on having direct uh action
45:41around you know people consuming
45:43mushrooms on a regular basis to to get
45:46these benefits so I think it's going to
45:48be huge and you know you know we could
45:52if we're if we're surfing and we're
45:54looking for good waves you know like
45:56this this good wave of Ergo theing is
45:59out there in the distance and uh it's
46:02it's headed towards us and it's going to
46:03be a good one to catch that's yeah very
46:06exciting um absolute wealth of knowledge
46:09super happy to have you on the show I
46:11could probably talk for you to you for
46:12hours about mushrooms uh but we will
46:15have to wrap it up now before we go I'm
46:17just wondering is there anything else
46:19that you wanted to get in on this topic
46:21that we didn't get a chance to talk
46:22about um yeah I think an important thing
46:24to point out is that you know this
46:26discussion's been around um humans um
46:29but all vertebrates need erine it's not
46:32just humans
46:34so people need to be considering ergine
46:37for their pets so you know cats and dogs
46:40but any animals have a need for it so
46:43it's pretty hard to get a cat to eat a
46:45mushroom so supplement probably plays a
46:47role there but you can cook mushrooms
46:49and chop them up and put them in your
46:51dog's food um and they'll happily eat
46:54them so I think that's that's a really
46:56important point that it's for the it's
46:58for the whole family um you know not
47:00just the humans in the family that's a
47:02really good point and um yes I did get a
47:05chance this was maybe six months or so
47:07to talk to Dr Rob silver also from the
47:09real mushrooms team about this idea of
47:12uh mushrooms and pets it's another
47:14fascinating discussion I know my dogs
47:16love mushrooms um you know if I whatever
47:19if a Corps dried Corps drops on the
47:22floor or something like that they eat it
47:23right up um so you almost got to be
47:25careful because they eat a lot of them
47:27if you if you let them but uh it's great
47:30to be able to share the benefits of
47:32mushrooms with four-legged friends I
47:33think that's really cool well again Lee
47:35thank you so much for joining us on the
47:37mushroom show if people want to learn
47:38more about you where can they go and
47:40check that out well they can go to the
47:42the uh the real mushrooms website and
47:44I've got a bio there they can read about
47:46me um I do a a monthly ask Le anything
47:50with real mushrooms on Facebook so
47:52they've got the chance to interact
47:53directly but my personal website is um
47:56heram medari doom. and that's that's
48:00where I have my online school you know
48:02where I teach healthc Care Professionals
48:03how to use uh medicinal mushrooms
48:07functional mushrooms in a in a clinical
48:09setting once again Lee thank you so much
48:11for joining us today on the show my
48:13pleasure Tony it's been great look
48:14forward to to uh seeing it when it comes
48:16out I hope you enjoyed that chat Lee
48:18really is a wealth of knowledge so
48:20grateful to have them as part of the
48:21mushroom community and we'll definitely
48:23have to bring them back on the show to
48:25talk more about function mushrooms in
48:27general and that's it for this episode
48:29of the mushroom show thank you so much
48:30for being here thank you so much for
48:32watching again if you like mushrooms if
48:33you like the mushroom show please do go
48:35ahead and hit that like button it really
48:36helps the channel grow and if you want
48:38to see future episodes of the show make
48:39sure you go ahead and hit that subscribe
48:41Button as well thanks so much for
48:42watching and we'll see you in the next
48:43episode
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