Candela Obscura: Game Master Roundtable

Critical Role2024-06-27

Audio Drama#Candela Obscura#Occult#Sci-Fantasy#Critical Role#Sci-fi#Fantasy#Performing Arts#Improvisation#Fiction Podcast#Narrative Podcast#Matthew Mercer#Matt Mercer#Aabria Iyengar#Liam O'Brien#Spenser Starke

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💫 Short Summary

The video segment features insights and advice from GMs on creating a spooky atmosphere in tabletop role-playing games, aligning personal and campaign themes, and providing closure to player arcs. It emphasizes the importance of session zero, pacing, and narrative development, as well as player agency and engagement. The discussion also covers themes of healing, storytelling techniques, and embedding themes in character backstories. GMs are encouraged to empower players, balance agency and narrative progression, and use atmospheric triggers to enhance gameplay experiences. The segment concludes with discussions on societal themes in storytelling, research, and creating a safe and inclusive gaming environment.

✨ Highlights

📊 Transcript

✦

Discussion on establishing tone with players through session zeros, importance of silence in horror games, and transition point before starting the game.

01:46

Aabria shares technique of shaking out laughter and jokes before a moment of silence to create a shift in mood.

Emphasis on setting the table's mood to immerse players in the spooky style of the game.

✦

Importance of pacing, volume, and narration style in creating mood and atmosphere in storytelling.

03:30

Utilizing silence and quiet moments for intimacy and impact, adjusting music and lighting to enhance the experience.

The significance of deliberate spooky voices and maintaining a baseline tone to engage players effectively.

Suggestions for cultivating playlists and making simple lighting adjustments for horror games.

Discussion on running games in the evening for a better atmosphere.

✦

Creating a spooky atmosphere in tabletop role-playing games.

07:04

Aligning monsters with metaphors to evoke primal fears in players is crucial.

Self-reflection, internal struggle, and confronting one's worst enemy are key elements in crafting impactful campaigns.

Tapping into emotional landing points and avoiding superficial scares enhances the horror experience.

Participants aim to engage players in a deeper, more meaningful horror experience by exploring personal fears and inner demons.

✦

Importance of aligning personal and campaign themes in character building and storytelling.

08:50

Observing players build characters and explore thematic interests enhances engagement and collaboration.

Drawing inspiration from horror soundtracks and media helps set atmospheric tones in the game.

Engaging with spooky content like true crime and cryptids outside of gaming sparks creativity and adds depth to narratives.

Utilizing music and diverse media sources enhances the overall gaming experience.

✦

Discussion on fascination with bizarre and strange content on the internet.

12:11

Exploration of historical cryptids and creatures reflecting fears of different eras.

Concept of social hysteria and imagery related to uncanny valley and primal fears.

Mention of artist Beksiński and his eerie and unsettling art.

Emphasis on finding inspiration from unsettling art to create narrative lore and world-building aspects evoking primal fears.

✦

Urban legends surrounding bodies found in a graveyard being moved to make space for a field are discussed.

14:52

The bodies were rumored to have multiple limbs and heads due to mishandling during relocation.

Horror game inspirations are explored, with a participant sharing their original idea for a game based on dark historical moments.

The concept of institutional memory of trauma in a place, such as a razed Black neighborhood, is considered as a theme for storytelling and game development.

✦

Discussion on healing old wounds and moving forward by acknowledging and learning from past mistakes.

17:37

Emphasis on the importance of addressing historical mistakes rather than ignoring them.

Exploration of history and mistakes made in the past to avoid repeating them.

Highlighting the allure of exploring ancient states and the relevance of repeating mistakes in a modern context.

✦

Importance of Allowing Horror to Unfold Slowly.

22:42

Traumatized landscapes and supernatural spaces can hold emotional scars from history.

Horror can have a therapeutic aspect by allowing individuals to face their fears and learn from them.

The concept of personifying trauma is discussed, highlighting the choice between fighting it or helping it process.

Horror is portrayed as having a dual nature, being both scary and potentially beneficial.

✦

Importance of relatability and hope in storytelling.

24:04

Author uses example of characters facing extreme challenges and emerging stronger.

Discussion on D&D game scenario where players overcome obstacles for a positive outcome.

Themes of hope and character development in storytelling are explored.

Balance between player agency and narrative direction is discussed.

✦

Importance of Session Zero in Role-Playing Games

27:42

Session zero involves one-on-one conversations to uncover player motivations and preferences.

Asking the right questions helps reveal player excitement and fears, leading to a dynamic narrative.

Trust and communication are crucial for setting boundaries and ensuring player comfort, especially in horror games.

The Game Master plays a key role in guiding story development based on player input and reactions.

✦

Importance of Fun and Safety at the Table in Tabletop RPGs.

31:02

Players should have fun and feel safe, with tension created without traumatizing characters.

Setting up dramatic questions allows players to shape character arcs and achieve resolution.

Brennan's character arc, focused on saving his mom, demonstrates the impact of personal goals on character development.

Emphasis on nuanced storytelling elements and player agency in tabletop role-playing games.

✦

Tips for weaving individual sessions into an overarching story.

33:33

Vary threats beyond monsters, create breathing room for players, and balance anxiety with fun to prevent burnout.

Provide closure to player arcs, whether sad or happy, for a satisfying experience.

Building emotional weight through character losses can deepen player engagement and investment in the narrative.

Collaborative storytelling experiences are enhanced as players join forces to navigate challenges together.

✦

Planning the scope of a campaign is crucial for pacing and narrative development in tabletop RPGs.

36:55

The rule of three acts structures storytelling, with early establishment, mid-game twists, and big finales.

Setting up elements in early episodes that pay off later enhances player engagement.

GMs should ensure that the horror elements in the story make sense internally to immerse players effectively.

Having a clear idea of the campaign's endpoint allows for strategic storytelling decisions from the beginning, leading to a satisfying and cohesive narrative experience.

✦

Importance of planning a mystery with clues and Easter eggs that lead to the final moments.

38:51

All clues and directs should point towards one place, especially in a three-game series.

Planning clues and mysteries in a game setting involves establishing themes, introducing settings and moods, and creating multiple threads leading to a common threat.

The core theme focuses on people repeating past mistakes, capitalizing on the unknown, and unleashing horrors through exploitation and misuse.

✦

Importance of Providing Crucial Information to Players in Storytelling.

43:20

Confession about creating a bottleneck in the game, causing fear and uncertainty.

Chamber filled with powerful artifacts leads to a surprising discovery of a platform going even further down.

Cautionary tale about luring players into traps.

Flexibility in storytelling is necessary to maintain player engagement.

✦

Importance of embedding themes in characters' backstories and story elements.

46:02

Key themes need to be repeated multiple times for players to understand their significance.

Balancing player freedom with subtle guidance in tabletop games is crucial.

Consistency and direction are necessary in game narratives, similar to stage performances.

Creativity and spontaneity can coexist with constraints in game design.

✦

GM's role in guiding players through a dangerous place.

48:08

Narrative focuses on subtle nudges to keep players engaged without forcing them.

Modularity and gentle guidance help players navigate failures and ensure smooth story progression.

Taking breaks and allowing players to think helps access important parts of the mystery.

Collaborative storytelling and gentle guidance are key to guiding players without restricting their choices.

✦

Key highlights from the segment on player investigation in GMing mystery games.

51:10

Players indicate interests to guide GMs in highlighting areas of narrative importance.

Specific details prompt player investigation, akin to closeup magic, in mystery games.

All players investigate together, influencing clue distribution based on inquiries.

Clues can be tailored to player styles, such as seeking information from people or art.

✦

Strategies for guiding players in narrative-form games.

53:36

Importance of shifting narratives based on mixed successes and listening and responding as a GM.

Handling mixed successes by providing twists and consequences, asking questions to push the story forward, and creating dangerous scenarios.

Emphasis on understanding player desires, motivations, and consequences to advance the narrative effectively.

Encouragement for GMs to be flexible, allow for narrative turns, and create engaging action set pieces with time constraints and obstacles.

✦

Using atmospheric triggers and senses to create consequences and increase player anxiety in tabletop RPGs.

56:46

GMs should introduce complications on mixed success dice rolls, such as physical sensations like tingling or smelling things.

GMs transitioning to narrative-driven games may struggle with consistently coming up with complications for mixed success outcomes.

Easy options for complications include giving players brain marks or abruptly ending conversations.

Useful storytelling tools involve themes, narrative moments, and player indication.

✦

Narrative-focused gameplay system discussed in the video segment.

01:00:38

Success, failure, and mixed success are depicted as emotional states for characters, with outcomes determined by storytelling rather than game mechanics.

The system allows for unexpected plot twists, prioritizing character emotions and experiences over numerical results.

✦

Empowering players in tabletop games by balancing agency and narrative progression.

01:02:33

GMs can raise stakes to push player decision-making and maintain tension without removing agency.

Acting in narrative-driven games is emphasized over over-planning.

Creating high-stakes situations encourages player choices and drives the story forward.

Engaging all players, including those withdrawn, can provide valuable perspectives on unfolding events.

✦

Encouraging player initiative and choice in the game.

01:05:45

Some players may be more hesitant than others when making decisions.

Spotlighting moments for quieter players to shine and lead the group is important.

The GM should empower players to narrate and contribute in unexpected ways.

Dynamic energy between players and GM shapes the story, fostering freedom, respect, and trust at the table.

✦

Role-playing game session with seance or exorcism scene involving players and GM.

01:07:53

GM facilitates interaction, allowing players to explore character relationships.

Importance of balancing narrative pressure and player agency emphasized by GM.

GM creates challenging situations while providing support and guidance.

Fun of playing up conflicts and maintaining balance between antagonism and camaraderie discussed by participants.

✦

Inspiration for Candela Obscura

01:10:57

Drawing from Victorian era and post-World War society to create a turn of the century setting with societal issues.

Emphasis on research and learning to avoid cultural insensitivity in game development.

Removal of crystal balls as they were identified as a blind spot in the game.

Encouraging open conversations at the table and welcoming diverse perspectives while maintaining a safe and inclusive environment for all players.

✦

Importance of societal themes in storytelling and conducting research.

01:14:41

Building a world together with a group, even with a rule book, for investment and understanding.

Engaging with historical issues in a safe space at the table for exploration of horror narratives.

Conflict and contention as essential textures for storytelling, emphasizing the need for communication and collaboration in world-building.

✦

Importance of creating a comfortable and engaging gaming environment.

01:17:40

Knowing the game's setting and NPCs is crucial for a successful gaming experience.

Addressing uncomfortable situations at the table with grace and a willingness to learn is key.

Continuous evolution and adaptation are necessary for a positive and inclusive gaming experience.

Expressing gratitude to participants and promoting Candela Obscura game and accessories online and in local stores.

00:00MATT: Hello, everyone, and welcome

00:01to this very special Candela Obscura GM Roundtable.

00:05AABRIA: Ooh.

00:06MATT: I'm joined by my fellow series GMs,

00:09Spenser Starke. AABRIA: Ow!

00:10MATT: Aabria Iyengar and Liam O'Brien.

00:13LIAM: Cheers, dears.

00:14MATT: For those who are coming in with us

00:16and are unfamiliar,

00:17Candela Obscure is an investigative horror

00:20tabletop RPG by Darrington Press.

00:22It's actually out now in the world as a game, a book,

00:26multiple series on Critical Role,

00:28and your own actual play series.

00:31We've also seen on top of that,

00:33fantastic new assignments

00:34and other content coming out using

00:36the Darrington Press Community Gaming License.

00:38We're super thrilled that more folks are growing the world

00:41of Candela Obscura and the Illuminated Worlds System

00:44at their table and in published content,

00:46which is incredible.

00:47We're so excited about that.

00:49But this is about the GM roundtable.

00:52AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Each of us

00:54have our own game mastering style

00:56and tools that we use when running Candela Obscura.

00:59So today we're going to bring you our best insights

01:02and advice and general conversational fuckery

01:06to inspire your own game mastery.

01:10In case you're just trying out Candela Obscura,

01:12note that there's a free quick start guide,

01:14a full core rule book, dice, accessories,

01:16and more available to you right now

01:18to play the game if you'd like.

01:20So look for them at your friendly local game store

01:22or Darrington Press Guild stores

01:24and Critical Role shops.

01:26So, without further ado, shall we begin?

01:28SPENSER: Let's do it. AABRIA: Let's do it.

01:29LIAM: Let's talk. MATT: Beautiful.

01:31LIAM: Let's talk creepy deepy.

01:32MATT: Well, speaking of creepy deepy--

01:33AABRIA: Creepy deepy! Yeah.

01:34MATT: Speaking of creepy deepy--

01:35AABRIA: What?!

01:36Please, that's the best transition I've ever heard.

01:38(laughter)

01:39MATT: A big thing about horror games is mood, setting it,

01:44setting the table's mood, getting everyone invested.

01:46Just to kick this off, what are some of the tricks

01:49that you use to guide your players

01:52into that head space, to both actively

01:55and subconsciously pull them into this

01:58spooky style of the game?

02:00LIAM: I just re-skin "Goosebumps" episodes.

02:02(laughter)

02:03MATT: Also viable. SPENSER: So viable.

02:04AABRIA: That makes sense now.

02:06MATT: Use what you know. AABRIA: I see it.

02:08SPENSER: I think that session zeros are really important

02:10to establishing tone with players.

02:13If everybody's showing up and knows what they're in for,

02:15I think it's a lot easier to get that transition in.

02:17I also think that, especially in horror games,

02:20that silence is really important.

02:22MATT: Yeah. SPENSER: Just allowing

02:23for there to be a moment of silence

02:24before everything gets started.

02:26I remember when we were,

02:27I don't think anybody here was playing in the campaign

02:29that I did, but when we did it,

02:32before we started shooting,

02:33we would all shake everything out

02:35and then we'd all go silent

02:36for a couple of moments.

02:38AABRIA: Ooh. SPENSER: Then we would start

02:40and that little bit of letting go,

02:42because we were laughing and joking

02:44and having fun right before,

02:45but then we shook all of that out

02:47and then just let that moment of silence

02:49be our transition point

02:50before I jumped into the opening of the show.

02:53AABRIA: Nice. SPENSER: That was-- Yeah.

02:54MATT: Awesome. AABRIA: That's really good.

02:55You should have shared that note.

02:56That's a great idea. (laughter)

02:59LIAM: I think the method of one's narration

03:02goes a long way to doing that too.

03:04If you're doing high fantasy or something cyberpunky,

03:07you're probably doing a little more action-adventure vibes

03:11to what you're narrating,

03:13but this isn't even like that schmacting thing,

03:16it's just the nature of the audio book

03:18you're inviting your players into.

03:20So in addition to silence,

03:22there's a lot more room for quiet

03:23and way more intimacy overall.

03:26SPENSER: For sure. MATT: Yeah,

03:27I'd say pacing and volume are two knobs

03:29that you can continuously use

03:30to change and shift the mood.

03:34To your point, taking those quiet moments, keeping it down

03:37and still, setting that baseline,

03:39and then being able to leave those gaps

03:43and slow the pace,

03:45so when you ramp it up suddenly,

03:46it catches them off guard and helps--

03:47AABRIA: That's too spooky. MATT: -- build that--

03:49(laughter)

03:51MATT: That's the end of the panel. Yeah.

03:52(laughter) AABRIA: We did it.

03:53MATT: We did it. No. AABRIA: I do think

03:54there's something there

03:56with being very deliberate with your spooky voice,

04:01that scary narrator voice,

04:03and using that to re-enter groups.

04:06You can't expect a table, especially when you're like:

04:08We're all friends having fun with each other.

04:10You're going to break the tone a little bit,

04:12usually just above game

04:14because you can't live inside of anxiety forever.

04:16But having that baseline tone

04:18and the tenor you can drop into

04:23gets everyone back with you.

04:24You get quiet and low and methodical again

04:27and it feels like the music changing behind the scenes

04:31and you're like: Oh, we're getting back to it.

04:33All right, cool, that was a fun diversion to baseball.

04:36LIAM: Baseball. AABRIA: Baseball.

04:38LIAM: Pronunciation. AABRIA: Sorry.

04:40I always mispronounce it. MATT: (laughs)

04:42AABRIA: Getting back to the spooky.

04:43LIAM: It's great sport.

04:44MATT: You mentioned music, that's

04:45actually another great tool.

04:46I mean, for most games in general,

04:47but especially for horror games

04:49where the atmosphere is so important,

04:51cultivating a playlist that you've either found online

04:56or built yourself of movie soundtracks

04:58that fit a similar vibe and theme,

05:01either separating it into different moods

05:02or having something that lends itself

05:04to that creepy atmosphere that you want to set,

05:07whether it be a time period you want to evoke,

05:10or the mood you want to keep at the table.

05:12Even simple lighting adjustments

05:14in the space that you're playing if you can.

05:15SPENSER: Totally.

05:16LIAM: Probably better to run your games in the evening.

05:19(laughter)

05:20MATT: A brunch Candela just doesn't quite

05:21have the same spark.

05:22AABRIA: Brunch Candela is so great.

05:24You're like: I'm eating a frittata. Let's be sad.

05:27(laughter)

05:28MATT: But, by all means,

05:29please do if you're inspired by it.

05:30AABRIA: Yeah. (laughs) MATT: Don't let us stop you.

05:32I love a spooky frittata.

05:34AABRIA: Spooky frittata!

05:35Please change my lower third that doesn't exist

05:37to Aabria Iyengar,

05:39Spooky Frittata. SPENSER: Spooky Frittata.

05:40(laughter) AABRIA: Thank you.

05:41LIAM: Candela Obscura, chapter five.

05:43(laughter)

05:44LIAM and AABRIA: Circle of the Spooky Frittata.

05:46(laughter)

05:49MATT: (laughing) Oh no! We're already off the rails.

05:51This is beautiful. AABRIA: Done.

05:52SPENSER: What's the existential horror version

05:55of a bottomless mimosa?

05:56It's an endless, like the void--

05:58AABRIA: Ooh.

05:59It's like getting too much of what you want.

06:01It's like-- SPENSER: Yeah.

06:03AABRIA: It's the "Se7en"--

06:04Or sorry, "Se7en" but--

06:06MATT: The glutton? AABRIA: Yeah, you get it.

06:08MATT: I knew it. AABRIA: Yeah.

06:09SPENSER: (laughs) AABRIA: Yeah.

06:10I want to die like that.

06:11SPENSER: (laughs)

06:13AABRIA: Hey, when I die-- MATT: You heard it here, folks.

06:15(laughter)

06:17AABRIA: Hey Matt, you want to do a really weird

06:18death pact with me?

06:20MATT: Honestly? Throw it on the pile.

06:22AABRIA: Yes! (laughter)

06:23MATT: I got seven, let them fight it out when I'm done.

06:24AABRIA: (laughs) MATT: (laughs)

06:26Not my responsibility.

06:27LIAM: Why is the hot tub

06:28full of orange juice and champagne?

06:29(laughter)

06:31MATT: Oh no. (laughs)

06:34AABRIA: I'd do it.

06:35MATT: (laughs)

06:36AABRIA: What were we talking about?

06:37MATT: We're talking about-- SPENSER: Whatever.

06:38AABRIA: Scary. LIAM: Setting mood.

06:40MATT: Mood and themes. AABRIA: Yes.

06:42MATT: Well, that's also very GM-facing

06:44or person who's hosting a game.

06:46AABRIA: Yeah.

06:48MATT: As far as preparation goes

06:49for the mood of your players, that's one thing.

06:51How about the mood for you as a GM?

06:53What helps each of you get into the mindset to begin

06:56to create a campaign for your players,

06:58to really get you in the mindset of starting

07:01to build in this spooky space?

07:04AABRIA: I definitely abide by horror conventions now,

07:09which are like, what am I specifically,

07:12and maybe we as a society or a group

07:14afraid of right now?

07:17Taking that, I always tend to build theme first,

07:20and once you land on, for our chapter,

07:24leaning very much into what if you're

07:26the most monstrous thing you'll ever encounter?

07:29That idea of the thing in the mirror.

07:32No one's ever been meaner to me than I am in my own head.

07:36What if I'm my worst enemy

07:37and what does that mean for the people around me,

07:39and what does that mean for a group

07:40that has a purpose of fighting monsters?

07:44that has a purpose of fighting monsters?

07:47So I think there's something inside of what terrifies you,

07:50what feels creepy, what feels spooky?

07:52Because you can always come back

07:53to that emotional landing point.

07:56Then the monsters that you bring into the world,

07:58the monsters are supposed to be a metaphor.

08:01So being able to line up a shot

08:03and say here's how the monster serves this idea,

08:06because when you see in your player's face

08:08that all of it's into alignment

08:10on something that's a primal fear

08:12and not just like it's a spider with eight butts

08:14and 19 stingers.

08:16If that means something more than the visceral fear

08:19in your player's ability to imagine a thing that's scary,

08:23then it lands in them in a good way

08:25and everyone's now playing a horror game.

08:28MATT: I dig that. AABRIA: I talked for too long.

08:29MATT: No, no, no. SPENSER: No, no.

08:31MATT: That's what this is about.

08:32AABRIA: Ripcord out!

08:33SPENSER: On the topic of themes,

08:34one of the things that I find really valuable

08:36for me as a GM is watching the players

08:39build their characters-- AABRIA: Yes.

08:40SPENSER: -- and figuring out

08:41what themes are they interested in,

08:43and then how do I take the themes that I'm interested in

08:45and either find a common ground--

08:47LIAM: Throw them together. SPENSER: -- or smash them together,

08:48right, and take all these different pieces.

08:50So I will literally lay out the themes of the campaign.

08:54AABRIA: Same. SPENSER: It's even in the book

08:56because the book was developed

08:57as we were making the show, as we were making the game,

09:00so laying out what are the themes,

09:03and then whenever I, as a GM, have a question about

09:05what it is I should go to in a moment,

09:07either in preparation

09:09or at the table when we're improving stuff,

09:13looking at those themes and being able

09:14to pull something from one of those four or five options

09:18makes it a lot easier to decide how to take the story.

09:22SPENSER: So, yeah.

09:22So infusing that and including the players in that process

09:26is really fun. AABRIA: Yeah. Oh, absolutely.

09:28LIAM: On a totally different angle,

09:30when I was prepping my chapter,

09:32I liked creeping the shit out of myself.

09:34I wanted to make myself feel as uncomfortable

09:37as I was aiming for with the table.

09:39So my days spent in my office alone,

09:42obsessing about the initial ideas

09:44and how I was going to have to them change things

09:46and move them around,

09:47I would play lots of horror soundtracks

09:50just so that I could feel bad. AABRIA: Yeah.

09:54SPENSER: (laughs) AABRIA: What was your go-to?

09:56What gave the the most spooky?

09:58LIAM: (contemplative) Oh.

09:59What's the movie, "The Witch." MATT: Mm-hmm.

10:02AABRIA: "The Vvitch?" SPENSER: Yeah, "The Vvitch."

10:03AABRIA: Hell, yeah. SPENSER: It's so good.

10:05LIAM: That was a big one. AABRIA: Love that.

10:06LIAM: I don't know. I'm going to blank on you now.

10:08MATT: That's fine, that's okay.

10:09SPENSER: There's a really cool series

10:11of albums online on Spotify or wherever

10:14called Atrium Carceri and they're like drone--

10:18Do you know those? MATT: I know them

10:19because they show up on other playlists

10:21that I have for atmospheric spooky

10:22and they're on the playlist. SPENSER: So I click

10:24one of those albums-- AABRIA: Yeah.

10:25SPENSER: -- and it is like gold.

10:26It's so good, yeah. MATT: That's stuff's really good.

10:28I use that for a lot of writing background stuff.

10:30Outside of Candela, but really helpful in Candela.

10:32Music for atmosphere is really good.

10:34Pulling from media, that's inspiring, to that point.

10:39It's funny, before Candela I was accidentally preparing

10:41because me and Marisha are weird people

10:43and when we go to bed at night,

10:44we'll find macabre YouTube rabbit holes,

10:47like true crime stuff and weird mythological beasts

10:51and cryptids and odd disappearances

10:54and people getting lost in tiny caves and getting wedged.

10:57Terrifying things. AABRIA and SPENSER: (laugh)

10:59MATT: Look, YouTube has a plethora

11:00of terrifying topics out there

11:02and a great thing to sleep to,

11:03because your dreams are awesome.

11:05AABRIA: (laughs) Oh my god.

11:05MATT: I have problems. SPENSER: (laughs)

11:06MATT: But you can use that-- (laughs)

11:09LIAM: If you didn't know-- MATT: Self-inflicted trauma.

11:10AABRIA: I'm so happy. LIAM: For anyone who

11:11didn't know, Matt has a real strange,

11:14lesser known fascination with the bizarre

11:19and strange on the internet.

11:20It is his background noise at all times.

11:24AABRIA: I didn't mean to throw you under the bus

11:25by laughing the whole time, but it was great! (laughs)

11:28MATT: Oh, I wouldn't have said it if I didn't expect it.

11:30(laughter)

11:31SPENSER: What have you pulled from, what can you remember

11:33that you pulled from, from those kinds of bits?

11:36MATT: A lot of various historical

11:38cryptids and creatures

11:40were reflections of fears of the time,

11:42to what you were implying too,

11:43and were often people's either imaginations

11:46and fears mingling with eras

11:48in which there wasn't a lot of light.

11:50There was a lot of,

11:53also a lot of, historically, periods of time

11:55where food went bad and no one knew

11:56and people were mildly hallucinating

11:58without understanding it. AABRIA: Right. Oh my god.

11:59MATT: And there might actually be terrible creatures

12:01we don't understand out there.

12:03But so all these different aspects

12:05of these mythological creatures

12:08and these cryptids and stuff

12:09to me, created one, ideas of

12:11what social hysteria was, as well as imagery.

12:16It's funny, giant monsters are awful.

12:19Humanity wrong is more intrinsically terrifying.

12:24Things that push into the uncanny valley.

12:25If you're looking at yourself in the mirror

12:26and seeing something look back that's not you.

12:28AABRIA: (shudders) MATT: All these different facets.

12:30The more it's recognizable but wrong,

12:33the more it hits that primal fear,

12:36which is why the uncanny valley is so terrifying

12:38and you see a lot of these cryptids are human-like.

12:41So you hear a lot of these stories

12:43and that was a lot of inspiration there,

12:46and a lot of it too was finding creepy art.

12:49Many real incredible artists out there

12:50that draw incredible creatures.

12:53I can never pronounce his name, Belinski.

12:55He's incredible.

12:57I'm going to look it up so I don't mess up his name,

13:00but he's this amazing, I want to say Polish artist

13:03who did this incredible hellscape art of creatures.

13:06AABRIA: Dope! SPENSER: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

13:07I think we were talking about this during the first season.

13:10MATT: Yeah, Belinski. SPENSER: Belinski, yeah.

13:12MATT: Or sorry, Beksiński, who has just--

13:16AABRIA: Beksiński. MATT: Beksiński. Beskin-ski--

13:18You get it. Google it. SPENSER: I remember you

13:19sending it to me. MATT: It'll fix it for you.

13:20AABRIA: Put it in Matt's lower thirds that don't exist.

13:22(laughter) MATT: Sorry, I'm bad at this.

13:23AABRIA: No, you're good. MATT: I'm bad at this.

13:24Also, I find incredible art out there

13:28from some incredible artists

13:29to be great points of inspiration.

13:30When you go through and go: Oh, that unsettles me.

13:34What about that unsettles me?

13:35And taking that down

13:37and seeing what narrative lore,

13:39world-building aspect can make a reason for this existing

13:42and why it scares me on a primal level,

13:44and then adapting that in a unique way

13:46within the setting works really well.

13:48LIAM: Now Spenser, you just eat too many Red Vines

13:50when you're prepping. SPENSER: It's true.

13:51AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: (laughs)

13:52AABRIA: (spews) SPENSER: (spews)

13:52AABRIA: This is the monster.

13:53(laughter)

13:57SPENSER: I was wondering,

13:58because I know for me pulling from,

14:01to jump off what you're talking about,

14:02pulling from real life phenomena,

14:05things that actually happened and then going:

14:07What's the one step removed,

14:11is oftentimes a fun way to find a real mystery.

14:13I know one of them,

14:14and I don't think it impacted the season we did,

14:17but it was one of the games that we played,

14:20at least I know you and I played together

14:22when we were play testing.

14:23AABRIA: I've never played game with you. SPENSER: You've never played the game--

14:24Yeah, we've never played the game together

14:25ever in our lives. AABRIA: Ever, not ever.

14:27SPENSER: I think Aabria is probably the person

14:28I've played the most games with in my life.

14:29AABRIA: Look, if you've ever noted--

14:32Occasionally, I get credit for like, oh, a cinematic thing.

14:35I was like, "Watch Spenser. That's where I stole it."

14:38You can hear the yoink as it happened.

14:41You're incredible. SPENSER: Oh, thank you.

14:42I know, we played early early on there.

14:44AABRIA: Early days, sorry. SPENSER: But when we were playing,

14:47there was this thing that happened in a graveyard,

14:48and forgive me, I don't remember where this was,

14:50but they essentially wanted to

14:52clear a space that was originally a graveyard

14:56to be a field for kids to play in,

14:59or something like that,

15:00and so they have this undertaker move the bodies

15:03from one place to another place,

15:05so they dig up all the bodies and move them.

15:08But what that resulted in is that the new graveyard,

15:12when they exhumed some of the bodies down the road,

15:16there were coffins that were open that

15:19were full of legs, they weren't full of people.

15:21They had like six legs or like three heads.

15:25It was these weird,

15:27like the coffins were all messed up.

15:28And it was that the undertaker,

15:30the person who was responsible for digging,

15:32they dug everything up and threw it all into a pile

15:35and then moved everything

15:36and then put everything back into coffins

15:38to do it as fast as possible.

15:40AABRIA: Bruh, you sorting 200 some odd bones? Naur.

15:43SPENSER: I know. LIAM: They're all going to

15:44turn back into an array of atoms.

15:46SPENSER: Right, and that was probably their thought process

15:49would be my assumption. MATT: No one's going to

15:50go look these up later.

15:51SPENSER: Right, but then when people did look them,

15:54it became this urban legend, right,

15:57that these bodies were, somehow,

16:00these people of this area

16:02had six legs or had three heads or something.

16:06So pulling from that, there were games

16:08where these bodies were, we found this coffin

16:11that was full of a body that had eight arms

16:14and you know, two heads, and six different joints

16:19for their elbows and stuff.

16:20So pulling from that was a cool inspiration.

16:23I was wondering if there's anything

16:23that you all have pulled from for this game,

16:26or horror games in general.

16:28AABRIA: My original idea for Tide & Bone

16:31was actually pretty close to that.

16:34I'm obsessed with the ways in which modernity

16:38has plastered over dark moments in history.

16:41I think thematically that still stayed through,

16:43but there was going to be more of a through line to--

16:47Central Park in New York City

16:48used to be a thriving Black neighborhood,

16:51and they razed it so they could have

16:53a beautiful park in the middle of Manhattan.

16:55That idea of these, it's not generational trauma,

17:00just the institutional memory of trauma in a place

17:04where you have not put the wrongness to rest.

17:09So that was going to be a big thing

17:11that came through in other ways.

17:12But yeah, pulling from things from the headlines.

17:15The more we learn about our history

17:16and the more we seek to rectify it or justify it

17:20or just interact with it in some way

17:22instead of simply ignoring it now.

17:24That idea of trying to heal old wounds is a thing

17:26that I constantly come back to in horror

17:29because there is something horrifying about

17:30having to go: A wrong thing happened here

17:34and we have to apologize and move forward,

17:37and we can't keep holding onto old pain,

17:40you have to really release old pain,

17:42is just a thing that, it's not scary,

17:46it's difficult and sits next to emotions

17:49that feel so close to horror for me

17:51that it feels like a good theme

17:52to always pluck at while you're going:

17:54I don't know, a spider with 19 butts.

17:56SPENSER: Right. (laughs) MATT: In a similar vein,

17:58mistakes that are intentionally forgotten

18:01and never learned from. AABRIA: Yeah.

18:02MATT: To where the pattern repeats itself.

18:04AABRIA: Ooh. MATT: In dark, spooky spaces

18:06like Candela, it's a ripe environment

18:08for forgotten history, forgotten mistakes,

18:11things that exist because of human arrogance,

18:15and as opposed to dealing with it,

18:18just bearing it and hoping it never creeps up again

18:19until I'm dead and the next generations can deal with it.

18:22There's a lot of that in our history.

18:24SPENSER and MATT: (laugh) AABRIA: Probably not, though.

18:25LIAM: The setting in the book,

18:27as well as history, and in all of our chapters really,

18:30I think that we see Oldfaire in its ancient state.

18:33AABRIA: I didn't say it first. LIAM: We're repeating--

18:34AABRIA: I've been waiting to talk about Oldfaire,

18:35but I didn't say the word first. MATT: We'll get there,

18:37we'll get there! AABRIA: Ah!

18:37(laughter)

18:39AABRIA: Go ahead. LIAM: I'm just as deep

18:40on Oldfaire. AABRIA: (hyperventilating)

18:42MATT: It's okay.

18:42LIAM: I love the lore and the history

18:45that you guys created in the book,

18:46and I fell in love with it,

18:47starting with Tide & Bone and into mine.

18:49But obviously with the modernity of war in Newfaire,

18:54it is just repeating the mistakes of Oldfaire

18:56in a new and exciting way.

19:03I think we all touched on that

19:04in different ways. AABRIA: Yeah.

19:05LIAM: The book, it's hard not to

19:08with the setting as it is.

19:10SPENSER: Us coming out of war-- LIAM: Yeah.

19:12SPENSER: -- and having this technology, yeah.

19:15LIAM: On a different angle, to answer your question,

19:18I had two things that I wanted to explore in mine.

19:22One was touching on what you were saying about

19:24when things are mostly normal but just slightly off.

19:30When I was approached, when Marisha asked me

19:32about running some Candela a million years ago,

19:35my first thought was I want to do

19:37something connected to Ireland.

19:39AABRIA: Why does Ireland scare you so much?

19:40LIAM: Because it is so-- (laughter)

19:43LIAM: It's hard to look at myself. SPENSER: It's so green.

19:46LIAM: Because it's a lot of desolate landscape

19:48and quiet and wind and odd folk, sorry.

19:55I had fun

19:57with the opening game of my chapter

20:00of trying to get the players to relax

20:02and go, "Oh, they're just a little quirky."

20:07AABRIA: Yeah. LIAM: "It's fine,"

20:07and just lulling things, lulling everyone

20:10into a place of a false sense of security

20:12and then opening up the 20 butts.

20:17AABRIA: I have to give you so many props for that

20:21because we had talked about it a little bit before

20:23you filmed and I was like, "Shit, that's a really good idea.

20:27"I want to take it."

20:29But watching it, you do something

20:31that I think is really important when

20:32we talk about living in horror and treating it right,

20:35which is give it enough time. SPENSER: Yeah.

20:38AABRIA: I can see the ways

20:41even I would have been like, "Ah, they're not relaxing.

20:43"Maybe I just move forward."

20:45You stuck with it and I felt myself go, "Well, hold on.

20:50"I know what's coming and yet I'm going to calm down."

20:53And watching the entire table settle

20:56and then you hit them was so good.

20:59That was a masterclass.

21:01I was just like, "Liam's fucked up, actually."

21:03(laughter) AABRIA: Jesus.

21:05LIAM: "Look, I have food." AABRIA: Yeah.

21:07LIAM: "Come eat it." (chomp) (laughter)

21:10SPENSER: The little angler fish. AABRIA: So good.

21:13MATT: Oh. SPENSER: Yeah, so cool.

21:13AABRIA: We're going to keep calling that one girl a bitch

21:15and I'm like, "Yeah, that's my little angler thing,"

21:17of like, "(laughs) We don't like one girl."

21:19LIAM: The other thing I wanted to play with was

21:21the only two things that I knew for mine

21:23were the beginning in Not-Ireland,

21:25which became the island of Serenity,

21:27which is just two lines in the book

21:28and I was like, "There it is, it's right there,"

21:31was to end in a place where people couldn't trust

21:35their senses because many of us have been there

21:39and it is terrifying even if there is not some

21:42greater power warping and twisting you

21:45and it's one thing if you can see the landscape

21:48around you and you can see the monster with its 20 butts

21:51and how do I get away from its butts?

21:53But when you're not sure,

21:54I wanted to see what would happen after following

21:57you guys setting the pace for Candela on the channel

22:04if I took away

22:07the tangible world to see,

22:09what could you even do? AABRIA: Yeah.

22:11LIAM: It just seemed like another way

22:12to make them feel more hopeless.

22:14SPENSER: Yeah, really. MATT: It's cool, too,

22:15because we talk about being

22:18barely off what's normal and recognizable.

22:21We talked about historical trauma,

22:24people carrying trauma from previous generations.

22:27The cool thing about supernatural spaces

22:29is more so than-- it exists, it's real--

22:32the land itself holds trauma.

22:34AABRIA: Oof. MATT: You know?

22:35That's what the idea of haunting is.

22:36The idea that even those that are long passed,

22:39the actual landscape itself carries those scars

22:41and how does that change the land?

22:42How does that change the energy of the land and the nature

22:44that surrounds it? LIAM: Holds emotion.

22:45MATT: Yeah, and you can feel it to this day.

22:47You go to some places in this world

22:48that have had traumatic history

22:50and as beautiful as it might be today,

22:52you can't help but feel that history when you arrive

22:55and in settings like this, you can tweak that even further.

22:58You can personify that beyond the setting

23:01and sometimes give it an actual entity,

23:03give it a figure that represents that trauma

23:06and then is it up to you to fight it

23:07or is it up to you to put it to rest?

23:09Is it up to you to help it process?

23:12Horror is scary, but horror is also therapeutic.

23:16AABRIA: Yeah.

23:17MATT: As long as you survive. (laughs)

23:19AABRIA: You'll learn something, even in death.

23:21MATT: It's true. LIAM: "My 20 butts have suffered,

23:23"and now you will, too!" (laughter)

23:26SPENSER: I went to the guy who wrote Fight Club.

23:29AABRIA: Chuck Pal...

23:30MATT: Chuck Palahniuk.

23:31SPENSER: Palahniuk. AABRIA: Thank you.

23:32SPENSER: Went to his book signing in LA a couple of--

23:34AABRIA: Yes!

23:36SPENSER: Maybe a year ago at this point

23:37and he said something that stuck with me.

23:39He's an awesomely strange dude.

23:41MATT: I can imagine. SPENSER: Yeah.

23:42But he said something that stuck with me.

23:44AABRIA: Bottoms of pools still freak me out.

23:45SPENSER: In the middle of the-- yeah--

23:47There was a Q&A section and they were asking him,

23:50somebody asked him, "Are you ever worried that people

23:52"will judge you based on how fucked up your characters are?

23:56"How fucked up your books are

23:57"and what do you do about that?

23:59"How do you still keep people interested

24:02"in these characters even though they're fucked up?"

24:04And he stopped

24:06the whole thing. LIAM: Because they're relatable.

24:08(laughter)

24:09SPENSER: He stopped the whole Q&A

24:11and he took a water bottle and he opened

24:12his pants and he poured the water bottle

24:14down his pants, the whole thing

24:16and then he put the water bottle down and he said,

24:20"People want to watch characters go through

24:24"the worst possible thing they could ever imagine

24:28"and make it out the other side.

24:30"For me, the worst possible thing I could ever

24:33"go through would be peeing myself on stage.

24:36"This is my worst nightmare.

24:39"I'm still going to finish the presentation

24:41"and I'm going to go home and I'm going to be just fine.

24:44"People want to watch people go through that

24:47"and then come out and still be okay

24:50"and that's what gives them hope.

24:52"So as long as you give, in some way,

24:54"give the audience hope despite all the darkness,

24:59"that's what they're going to love you for."

25:01I thought that was a really weird and interesting way

25:04of getting across the point of horror, right?

25:06It's like we are scaring them,

25:08we are showing that we're pushing them to the edge

25:10and even if our members of Candela Obscura don't make it,

25:13the whole party's gone,

25:14did they do a thing-- AABRIA: My dream.

25:16SPENSER: Dream. (laughter)

25:18SPENSER: Did they do a thing that keeps the world safe?

25:21LIAM: Yeah. AABRIA: Yeah.

25:22SPENSER: They stopped a thing.

25:24AABRIA: Was it worth it? SPENSER: Was it worth it?

25:25LIAM: I learned that in my chapter.

25:27I came in beforehand going,

25:28"I'm going to kill every one of these motherfuckers."

25:30AABRIA: Yeah. LIAM: You watch, I'll be the one.

25:32The other three were too scared.

25:34Here I come. SPENSER: (laughs)

25:35LIAM: But halfway through, I was like--

25:36AABRIA: I did great. LIAM: I don't know if that's

25:37what it is.

25:40I allowed for that to be the case,

25:41but my players rolled real well.

25:44AABRIA: They rolled lots of Candelas.

25:45LIAM: Rolled real well. MATT: Yeah.

25:47Imari, forever.

25:48LIAM: But-- AABRIA and SPENSER: (laugh)

25:50LIAM: -- the outcome was just right.

25:53AABRIA: Yeah. LIAM: Because

25:56as an audience member and even from my seat,

26:00I worked so hard to grind them into dust

26:02that I wanted there to have been something earned for it

26:06and so the ending was just where it should have been.

26:09MATT: To a similar point,

26:11bring it back to the game in session zero.

26:16How much of your theme and game's

26:22beacons or goals of hope

26:24are taken from the players at the table

26:26as they develop their characters

26:28or it's something you find partway through the story?

26:30Is that something you consider at the outset

26:32or do you just focus on theme and dangers

26:34and let it evolve as you play?

26:37AABRIA: I think the way we did our session zero

26:41involved one-on-one conversations

26:42when we got everyone's question and catalyst

26:46and there was a lot of pushback on, "Okay,

26:48"here's your question about what you think your character

26:51"is turning around, the big idea behind them,"

26:54and I found it very, very helpful to ask,

26:57"What is the worst version of that answer for you?"

27:00And then "What do you hope the answer is?"

27:03It's a very easy binary for a shorter session.

27:06There's only three of them,

27:08so there's not a lot of time

27:09to tease and let it build over time.

27:11SPENSER: Yeah. AABRIA: But having those two,

27:14that bit of directionality means that now you and I as

27:19the world and the character

27:21know the poles that you're moving between

27:23as we move through the space

27:25and it becomes that much easier to throw things

27:27to not quite corral you in a direction,

27:30but to make both results equally tempting

27:34and have you arrive somewhere.

27:36So I think it's the themes I walk in the door with,

27:40the story and the motivations the players walk in

27:42and then the plot unfolds from the intersection

27:45of our two things and how the dice go.

27:47MATT: That's solid.

27:48I like that idea and I think

27:50most GMs who have a little bit of experience

27:51do it subconsciously to a point, but--

27:53AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: It's finding

27:54the right questions to ask the players

27:56that tricks them into revealing the things

27:58they're excited to engage with.

27:59AABRIA: Yes! SPENSER: Yeah.

28:00MATT: Without going, "Tell me what you want your endgame to be."

28:03AABRIA: Yeah. (laughs) MATT: You know?

28:04"What ending are you looking for here, kid?"

28:06Where you can just in talking about their character,

28:08finding the right questions like that--

28:11MATT: -- to make them unintentionally talk out loud

28:14about what they're thinking about.

28:16AABRIA: Yes. MATT: And how to

28:16incorporate the things they're excited for

28:18because as players, you want to engage with the things

28:19that make you excited and then finding ways to turn it

28:21around on them and really make them afraid and wanting

28:25to get there or missing that opportunity or worse.

28:27LIAM: That's something that you have honed as a skill

28:29and I've been gaming with you for a decade,

28:32so maybe you were doing it to some degree beforehand, but--

28:36AABRIA: He's talking about you.

28:37LIAM: Getting a little bit of information out of us

28:39and then just doing rug yanks.

28:43AABRIA: Yeah.

28:44LIAM: Even the last couple years,

28:45I'm like, "Fuck, he did it to me again!"

28:46SPENSER: (laughs)

28:48AABRIA: Getting to watch you do it up close,

28:49I'm like, "Goddamn, clinical, rough."

28:53Glad to just be a guest.

28:55MATT and AABRIA: (laugh)

28:56MATT: It's fun, but to bring it back to the game table, too,

29:00it's important to know that your players

29:02are comfortable before you do that.

29:03AABRIA: Yes, 100%. SPENSER: Yeah.

29:04MATT: That's another important part of the session zero,

29:06especially in a horror game is the lines and veils,

29:08having really strong conversations about

29:11how far players are willing to go in the story.

29:14At what points they're not willing to go

29:17and build a safe space of trust

29:20to where I can yank that rug. LIAM: Yeah.

29:22MATT: To where I know that I can do up

29:24to this point and you will be here for it.

29:27AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Because the bottom line

29:28is you're all still having fun at the table.

29:30You're scared, but scared can be fun

29:31as long as you feel safe as players there.

29:33LIAM: Yeah. AABRIA: Don't traumatize your players.

29:35SPENSER: Yeah. (laughs)

29:36LIAM: You get an individual-- AABRIA: Traumatize the characters.

29:38LIAM: Traumatize them the right amount.

29:40Yeah, that's right. The characters

29:41MATT: That's a good distinction.

29:42LIAM: But your players will give off an energy.

29:44I could tell from Aimee Carrero that she,

29:47even as a player, had a lot of hope

29:49and she really wanted to figure out how to dance

29:52between the raindrops and come out the other side.

29:54MATT: You don't know anything about that.

29:55AABRIA: Nothing, I know nothing! (laughter)

29:56LIAM: I warned her that it was not going to be a happy thing.

30:00AABRIA: I was screaming at the TV, going "Yeah, yeah!

30:04"She be that way." (laughter)

30:06AABRIA: "Go off, queen."

30:06LIAM: Alex Ward, on the other hand,

30:08just radiated "Eviscerate me."

30:11AABRIA: Yes! SPENSER: Yeah.

30:12LIAM: From the top and so I knew--

30:14MATT: Just channeling Edward Gorey

30:15at the table the entire time. LIAM: Yeah.

30:16I wasn't planning on it, but when we got to our ending

30:19and I wanted somebody to get absorbed

30:23by what they were dealing with

30:24and I knew that Alex wasn't a worry

30:26if it was him and luckily, it was him.

30:29SPENSER: I think it's interesting because we can set up these,

30:32and the question in Candela does this to some extent.

30:36AABRIA: Yes. SPENSER: But I think as GMs,

30:37we can set up dramatic questions for our players.

30:40AABRIA: Oh, sure.

30:42SPENSER: To touch on what you were saying,

30:45for me in shaping that, I want to figure out

30:47what that dramatic question is,

30:49what they want to know by the end

30:51and that is a shortcut to understanding

30:55what that character's arc might be.

30:58AABRIA: Yes.

30:59SPENSER: If I can get them to the other side of that arc,

31:02at least get some semblance of resolve,

31:07even if it didn't answer it the way that

31:09they wanted it to be or even if it wasn't perfect, right?

31:12LIAM: Which is like life. SPENSER: Which is like life.

31:14If we can get an answer, I think of Brennan in this, right?

31:17AABRIA: Who?

31:19LIAM: Not familiar. SPENSER: Red-- Not familiar? That's fine.

31:22Brennan is brilliant in so many ways. (laughs)

31:26Are you still thinking about who Brennan is?

31:27MATT: I'm like, "I don't know if I've met that guy."

31:28SPENSER: Yeah. (laughter)

31:30AABRIA: He's Irish, I think he was on that Serenity.

31:32MATT: Oh, got it. SPENSER: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

31:33Brennan's brilliant. MATT: You all know each other.

31:35AABRIA: (squeak laughs)

31:37SPENSER: Brennan is brilliant in so many ways.

31:39AABRIA: Yes.

31:39SPENSER: But one of the things that was really fun

31:41about Brennan's character was that

31:44the arc for him, the question was,

31:49"Can I save my mom?"

31:52That was his whole question, right?

31:54It didn't matter what and it wasn't Candela-related.

31:58He was playing in that space, but that was his whole thing

32:00and so every time there was a question about

32:02what do I give this person,

32:03what situation do I put this person in,

32:05it was always in opposition

32:09with the goal that he wanted

32:11or in harmony with the goal that he wanted.

32:15MATT: Yeah.

32:17SPENSER: So that was fascinating to watch

32:19how he took the reins there when I gave him

32:23freedom in the middle of episode two

32:25to watch him then take that and run himself

32:29or I guess episode three.

32:32But knowing what that is is so key

32:34to being able to give the player the satisfaction

32:38that they've reached the end of their character

32:41by the end of the campaign or whatever you're running

32:44so that when they die, it isn't for nothing, you know?

32:49AABRIA: It's very funny in a game

32:50that involves a lot of ghosts,

32:51you don't want to make a ghost out of your players' arcs.

32:55You want them to finish with closure.

32:59Whether or not that's a sad ending

33:01or a happy ending is immaterial

33:03as long as they feel like they went through a thing

33:06and explored something and got to the other side of it

33:10with their pants wet. That's great.

33:11(laughter)

33:12MATT: That is viable. AABRIA: It's great.

33:13MATT: Even if the character doesn't get to complete

33:15their arc per se, if you can find a way

33:18with that player as part of that story's end

33:21to bring that weight onto another player

33:24who's still around-- AABRIA: Oh god, yeah.

33:26MATT: -- then both the players

33:27join your side a little bit as a GM

33:29because now their loss is haunting

33:31and adding to the weight on the shoulders of those

33:33that still remain. SPENSER: That's such a good point.

33:34AABRIA: God, I love haunting the narrative.

33:36MATT: It's good times. AABRIA: So fun.

33:37MATT: So we've talked a little bit about

33:40character arcs, session zero,

33:42and building and playing the story

33:43towards character back stories

33:44and bringing that all together,

33:47but a large part of this can be,

33:49especially session to session in Candela,

33:51kind of a monster of the week feel,

33:54which can be easy to set from session to session,

33:56but for those of us that want to try

33:57and weave it together into an overarching story

34:00where each of these solitary-ish stories

34:04can be threaded together,

34:05what are some general tips that you use

34:07or processes that you go through to help

34:10prepare yourself to thread those together?

34:14LIAM: Well, I don't know if this is the exact answer

34:16you're looking for, but I'll kick us off.

34:17One thing is we each ran a three-part story, right?

34:21MATT: Mm-hmm.

34:22LIAM: I felt that if there were a monster

34:24every single game

34:26that I would fatigue my players

34:28and anyone watching as well.

34:29The people in this world are certainly as scary,

34:31if not scarier, than the monsters,

34:34so I looked for different,

34:36there's so many ways to endanger your players.

34:38It doesn't always have to be, you know,

34:40a supernatural creature, so

34:43I kicked off with facing the elements

34:46and then it was

34:49murderers in a small town

34:52to a full episode of breather

34:55where they all just talked to each other

34:57and explored their stories

34:58and their histories and then went to a party

35:00because Taliesin needed to Oscar Wilde.

35:03(laughter)

35:04MATT: You can't stop the boy. AABRIA: Give the people

35:06what they want. SPENSER: (laughs)

35:07AABRIA: Yes.

35:10LIAM: I think you said it at one point, you can't have

35:12your players in a constant state of anxiety

35:14the entire game every game

35:15because they'll get burnt out, they'll get fatigued.

35:17So you do want to find different colors

35:19and breathing room

35:20and fun as well, so that when you do drop the hammer,

35:25they can summon all their energy to handle that anxiety

35:27and then afterwards (sighs), it's out.

35:30So, you know, you're picking your moments,

35:32and I wouldn't make it a 20-butted monster every time.

35:36SPENSER: I think knowing what kind of scope you're going for

35:41in your campaign,

35:42or at least in this chapter that you're running,

35:45really helps for me.

35:48Any game, I'll say we're doing 10 sessions

35:51and then let's see after that 10 sessions

35:53where that takes us, right? AABRIA: Yeah.

35:54SPENSER: But knowing,

35:55especially in a game like Candela,

35:57knowing, hey, we're doing a five-session campaign,

36:00we're doing a 10-session campaign,

36:02or in our case a three session campaign,

36:04which is pretty fast.

36:05So knowing that we have that time,

36:07I can ramp up and down how many marks I'm giving,

36:11I can ramp up and down how fast the narrative is moving

36:14or how quickly I need to move people through their scenes.

36:18But I think also, it tells me

36:21structurally generally where to put things.

36:24AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: If we're doing

36:26three episodes,

36:27I'm probably going to introduce something early on

36:30in episode one

36:31that will come back by episode three.

36:35You get some preview of whatever the thing is early,

36:39so we set that up and then we pay it off later.

36:42Knowing that I have three episodes,

36:44I know I need to do it by episode one.

36:45AABRIA: Yep.

36:47It's really nice that it's three,

36:49because there's so many things around storytelling that are

36:52that rule of three, three act structures.

36:55Even down to improv where you're like,

36:57episode one, you're establishing a concept.

36:59Here's a fear, here's a theme,

37:00here's a thing we're going to do.

37:02Two is usually your twist for it,

37:04so right around your mid game

37:05when everyone's comfortable with

37:08what the board state is,

37:09you do something and pivot and go like,

37:11"Well, what if it's actually about this?

37:12"What if--?"

37:13For Tide & Bone, it was that early idea of

37:17we're dealing with someone's personal horror story.

37:19We were inside of

37:21Raj's personal backstory maw monster.

37:25You get to the second one,

37:27and now it's: What's the turn here?

37:28You're like, oh, the monster is now

37:30something tied to the society.

37:32The scope's gotten a little wider.

37:33Then you get that third act,

37:35bring it all home, big blow out of like, no, no, no,

37:37this is something about the history of this place.

37:39So having three and knowing you can have an arc

37:43and a ramp up,

37:44it's that exact idea.

37:47Establish something early, play with it,

37:50give your players time to understand what's going on,

37:54twist it, and then blow it up for the big finale

37:58so everything feels like: This is exactly what I want.

38:01I'm overwhelmed by the theme and the vibe

38:04and the feeling and the monster

38:05and the hopelessness and the horror of it all,

38:07but it all makes sense.

38:09I think that's the thing that we have to strive for

38:12as GMs for this.

38:13Let the horror make sense internally

38:15and then your players are inside of it with you.

38:18LIAM: It can be helpful to have,

38:21sometimes you're going to run a game, you know,

38:22if you're running a game for your friends at home,

38:24you could change in the middle of what you're doing,

38:26but usually, and I did and I think

38:29you're saying the same thing is that

38:30you know where you're ending,

38:31you know what the ending is, so you can be laying stuff out

38:35right from the jump

38:36that seemingly has nothing to do with anything,

38:38and it's pointing towards your final moments.

38:41So that's one of the fun things

38:44for planning a mystery is leaving little Easter eggs

38:48and clues just sitting in plain sight

38:50that seemingly mean nothing.

38:51But if you know your ending, you know where you're going,

38:53everything, all your clues, all your directs and everything

38:56are all pointing to one place.

38:58Especially in a three game series

39:01because you don't have a lot of time,

39:02so everything is pointing, even though they can't tell,

39:06towards one direction, the band.

39:08SPENSER: Yeah. (laughs)

39:10Speaking of that, Matt, I'd love to know from you,

39:13you spearheaded our first season.

39:15AABRIA: (laughs)

39:17SPENSER: So-- MATT: No pressure.

39:17AABRIA: Way to set the fucking tone!

39:19It was beautiful.

39:21SPENSER: Starting off with episode one,

39:24how did you plan

39:27your clues out?

39:29How did you plan your mystery out?

39:32And how would you recommend people do that

39:35as they move into their own games?

39:37MATT: I had built my first three episodes

39:40to be equal parts a horror story,

39:43but also an introduction to the setting and the mood.

39:47So it means that the themes maybe weren't as strong

39:51as some of the later seasons,

39:53because it was-- AABRIA: Yes, they were.

39:55I'm going to yell at you about that.

39:56SPENSER: (laughs) AABRIA: (laughs)

39:57MATT: Well, I mean in the sense that it was

39:59running dual purpose for this,

40:01and so it had to have tandem-- LIAM: You had to have two.

40:03Multiple, yeah.

40:04MATT: Had tandem points here.

40:05I was just trying to establish it as

40:06a monster of the week is a thread,

40:09but there is a common thread through them all,

40:11and the larger threat actually is a societal threat

40:14than it is a particular creature threat.

40:16LIAM and AABRIA: Yeah.

40:17MATT: Exposing the audience as well as

40:19hopefully new players to Candela that

40:21there are many factions in this world

40:23and many people and many things

40:25that are working against the greater good

40:27and the dangers through the history.

40:29So for me, a lot of it was knowing that I wanted to end

40:32with the Red Hand and their involvement,

40:34and that the real horror here is people

40:37repeating the mistakes of the past,

40:39trying to capitalize on things they don't understand,

40:43and what horrors are unleashed in that process.

40:46The exploitation of what isn't fully understood,

40:50the misuse of technology,

40:52not that we know anything about that.

40:53AABRIA: Probably not. SPENSER: (laughs)

40:54MATT: So that was the core theme.

40:57I knew where I wanted it to end, to what you were saying,

41:00and then in that space, telling myself

41:02what are the important facets of this mystery?

41:04What's the information that will lead them

41:06to the next thing I want them to get to?

41:07What's the information that's going to lead them

41:09from that to the next thing?

41:11What different pieces must they know

41:14to put together this mystery?

41:16Then making sure

41:18that I have some ideas of where they will go,

41:19but make sure they're modular.

41:21AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Make it so that,

41:22oh, they missed talking to that guy.

41:23well, oh god, he's the only guy that would know.

41:26That puts you in a really bad position as a GM.

41:28AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: Yeah, yeah.

41:28MATT: So he might know, but who else might know?

41:30Or where else can they discover this information?

41:32Can what this person know also be found

41:33in a drawer in someone's desk?

41:36Can this also be delivered by someone on their dying breath

41:38as they come running out of a scuffle in the street?

41:41Keeping in mind that the very important information

41:44to help the players un--

41:45pardon, unravel this mystery can be

41:49recovered by the players at multiple points in the story

41:52and in places where you don't expect them to go

41:54in ways you don't expect them to have it handed to them.

41:57Because then you don't end up in

41:58that terrible position that many of us GMs end up doing

42:01where you build this mystery and the players go

42:02in a completely different direction and you're like,

42:06"How do I fix this now?

42:07"We're completely off the rails

42:08"and how am I going to get back to this ending?"

42:10So you have to have a little bit of forethought to that

42:12and how you build that mystery out

42:14and be flexible with how you present that to the players.

42:16LIAM: I have to make a confession

42:19about my chapter now,

42:20because you're absolutely right,

42:22and yet--

42:23I did that for many aspects of my chapter,

42:26and yet, I made a bottleneck for myself

42:31with no other option.

42:32They had to go through this one point,

42:36and I was terrified of it the entire way up to the moment,

42:40and everything that happened in that moment

42:42bore my fears out to be true,

42:44and I still somehow threaded the needle.

42:47In my last game, they end up in Oldfaire,

42:51and then they find

42:55what I loosely was thinking of

42:56as a vault of powerful artifacts

42:59that Calinus had created in Oldfaire.

43:02There was a room where another circle lay dead.

43:08But it wasn't a room, it was a platform to go down

43:13even further than Oldfaire.

43:15So that was another thing I wanted to do with my chapter

43:16was have my party get as low as possible and be like,

43:19"God, we couldn't go any lower than this,"

43:20and then drop them the same amount.

43:22AABRIA: Ugh! MATT: Hmm.

43:24But I didn't have any backup passageways or anything else.

43:27I was like, I have to lure them into this.

43:29It's a little box trap

43:32with a piece of food underneath,

43:33and I had to get the raccoon to go under the box

43:36and then pull the string.

43:38I was like, man. I mean, I guess I could improvise.

43:40I'll figure something out,

43:41but I really just want them to go

43:43for the food under my box trap.

43:46They got into this chamber,

43:48and there I was describing the room,

43:50and I'm not sure who it was because I was disassociating.

43:53(laughter)

43:54AABRIA: That's so real. SPENSER: That's so--

43:55MATT: Uh-huh. AABRIA: Yeah.

43:56LIAM: I think it was Alex, but I'm not sure.

43:59MATT: Oh, Liam's just so into the story.

44:00(laughter)

44:02LIAM: I'm describing what's going on around them,

44:03and I think Alex maybe said,

44:05"We got to get the fuck out of here,"

44:06and all the (sirens blare).

44:08I got to pull the string

44:10before you get out from under my box trap.

44:12I think I just went, "Look over here!

44:14"Look over here!" with my description

44:16for something for another 15 seconds

44:18to stop them from saying,

44:20"Let's get out of here now," to trigger them going down.

44:23So don't do that.

44:25Don't do what I did. AABRIA: No, it's okay.

44:26MATT: No, no, no! I disagree. AABRIA: It's okay.

44:27LIAM: It was such a gamble. AABRIA: We're going to fight

44:28and be like, it's a gamble, but

44:32my recommendation would be if you know

44:35you have to get them to follow a tasty morsel,

44:38you seed the tasty morsel in their backstory.

44:41All of you had ties to Oldfaire

44:42that you came up with on your own

44:44that I got delighted by and kept developing.

44:46So if you see the tasty morsel before,

44:49but that's my favorite secret for mysteries.

44:51Which is, put it in their backstory

44:53so then all of a sudden they remember and care.

44:54Sometimes they don't remember, and that's okay, too.

44:56MATT: (laughs) SPENSER: (laughs)

44:57AABRIA: Both things happen. MATT: I'll say also, too,

44:59if you have those linchpin parts of the story

45:02that you've built, it's okay to remind yourself

45:05that you know everything and the players know nothing.

45:07AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Often, I'll say this

45:09whenever I'm a player, we'll be oblivious to a lot of the--

45:12AABRIA: (laughs) MATT: -- things you say.

45:14Sometimes, you have to be overt.

45:16AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Sometimes you

45:16have to be a little more forceful

45:19with the important information

45:21than you might think is comfortable.

45:23But honestly, most of time,

45:25the players don't see it that way,

45:26and it helps them go, "Oh, maybe that is important."

45:29AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Or you end up

45:30finding a chair in the room

45:31that your players obsess over the entire episode.

45:34SPENSER: I was going to say, it's crazy

45:35because I feel like sometimes I'm hitting the theme

45:39over the head so hard,

45:42and yet when I go back and watch it,

45:45and I'm not in my own head, I'm like, oh,

45:47I actually didn't-- AABRIA: Oh, it's true!

45:48MATT: Yeah, it feels so much louder in your own head

45:50than it does to players. SPENSER: Yes!

45:51Because I know what I'm doing

45:53and everybody else is just observing

45:54what the effects of that are.

45:56So even just taking it back to themes,

45:59not being afraid to hit the theme twice,

46:02three times, four times. AABRIA: Yes.

46:04SPENSER: If you have a question

46:06about how an NPC might react,

46:08and you have a theme that you know you're trying to hit

46:09for that character, mirror that theme back to them,

46:12hit it over the head because it's going to take

46:15three or four times for it to come through in full.

46:17LIAM: I would argue, maybe not for all players,

46:19certainly for me,

46:21and I think for many players, is you really,

46:23maybe it's contradictory, but you really want both.

46:25You want that sense of freedom to be able to do anything.

46:27But also, at times I'm like,

46:30"Where are we going?"

46:32I don't mind subtle little nudges

46:35because I'm like, "Oh, I got you,"

46:36and then I start moving with it.

46:37Then, I always liken it to both for running these games

46:40and being a player in tabletop games to

46:43if you're doing the same show on stage

46:44for three months, right,

46:45you still have to stand at the table.

46:47You still have to go and pull open the door the same way.

46:49You still have to yell specific lines

46:51because you've been directed to do as such,

46:53but it doesn't mean it's going to be the same every time.

46:56There is still, it's not a perfect analogy,

46:58but even though in a three game structure

47:01where there's not too much time to go all over the map

47:05and wander about because we're on a train and it's moving,

47:10there's still a world of creativity and randomness

47:14and surprise within those confines.

47:18MATT: It's finding where to nudge and find those bumpers.

47:21If you need them to go to this particular place

47:23where the floor is going to fall out from under them

47:24and carry them into a space,

47:26and all of a sudden, the players are like,

47:28"I don't, that place seems dangerous.

47:29"We don't want to go,"

47:30that's where you know,

47:32you quickly go, "Someone runs that direction saying,

47:35"'I saw something glowing in that chamber.

47:36"'Go call the police.

47:37"'There's a mystery afoot,'" and they're like,

47:39"Hmm, maybe we should go check out that room."

47:41Or you know, if there's an object

47:44they need to touch in your narrative that you've built

47:47to trigger a vision of the past,

47:49but they go, "All right,

47:51"if this room seems clear, we can leave."

47:53You can come in and be like, "As you're about to leave,

47:55"you turn over your shoulder,

47:56"and you feel this tugging sensation,

47:57"like a whisper in your ear,

47:59"and as you glance back in the shadow,

48:00"this gem seems to glow a little brighter

48:02"than the rest of the darkness around it."

48:04You know, it still feels narrative-focused,

48:06and it's just a little gentle nudge

48:07that tells the players

48:08the story here that's interesting isn't done yet,

48:11and it doesn't force them into that,

48:13but it also lets you know,

48:15"Hey, I built something cool for you,

48:16"you might want to check it out."

48:17LIAM: That's essentially what I did, which was

48:19"It's at that moment that you notice one detail that pops

48:23"that you hadn't noticed before,"

48:24and it made everybody slow down long enough for me

48:27to drop the floor out from under them.

48:28AABRIA: It is one of those things that

48:29if you're doing your job right, your table is scared,

48:33and I don't know, I don't have access to my whole brain

48:36whenever I feel any strong emotion,

48:38so I think there's a moment to advocate

48:41for player grace here where you're like,

48:42"I've fully freaked you out.

48:44"You're probably not picking up all the clues

48:46"I'm putting down because you're scared

48:48"of the 21-butted spider just outside the door."

48:51MATT: I had a monster with a lot of butts in my story.

48:53I feel like this is kind of pointed, at this point.

48:55(laughter)

48:56AABRIA: And it's the scariest thing that's ever existed.

48:59Could you imagine all the poop?

49:00MATT: Yeah, yeah. AABRIA: Terrifying.

49:02MATT: That's pretty scary.

49:03AABRIA: But yeah, having that sense of

49:06if you're worried that you're like,

49:07"I feel like I'm dropping a million clues,"

49:08and you're like, "Your players are thinking about

49:11"30,000 things right now and trying to do right

49:14"by their characterization and the story

49:16"and they might not be thinking with the full faculties

49:20"that you as the GM currently have access to."

49:22MATT: Yeah, and the modularity and gentle bumper concept

49:27helps a lot when players have terrible rolls

49:30and the things that you want them to get to,

49:32they make really weird choices

49:34or the dice say, "Nah, you're going to fail repeatedly,"

49:38to the point where the logic of the story at the moment

49:41doesn't allow them to access that part of the mystery

49:44that you think is important for it to continue.

49:47Then you let them rest a bit.

49:48If you have to, take a break, everyone,

49:50eat and think on it to the side

49:51and think of where else they can acquire this knowledge.

49:53Who else can come into the story--

49:54LIAM: Yeah, it's a hot potato. MATT: -- and guide them back on.

49:56SPENSER: Well, I think to something that all of you

49:58touched on is one of the ways you can guide players

50:02in a gentle GM way that doesn't restrict their

50:07ability to do whatever they want,

50:09but gives them guidance on like:

50:10Hey, this is where our story is interesting to me as the GM.

50:15Because players do that all the time, right?

50:17They tell you what they're interested in all the time

50:18by what they do, so as a GM, it's our job

50:20to also indicate what's interesting to us

50:22and to showcase like: Hey, this is the area

50:25that the narrative is pointing you to

50:28is describing something specific in detail, right?

50:33is describing something specific in detail, right?

50:34I know I've watched all of you do this

50:35in a really cool way. MATT: For better or for worse.

50:37(laughter) MATT: Sometimes accidentally.

50:39SPENSER: But it's what you were just talking about, right,

50:40where you're like, "I'm drawing their attention to a thing,

50:42"but I'm describing--"

50:43I remember, for me, one of those moments was

50:46when they walked into the room

50:50when they walked into the room

50:52of one of the characters in the chapter that I did was in

50:55and they were like, "Is there anything off here?"

50:57They rolled and they rolled a mixed success

50:59and it was everything seems normal,

51:02but there's a lamp that's just slightly askew.

51:06And just by giving that morsel,

51:08that doesn't tell them everything,

51:10but it does give them enough doubt--

51:12AABRIA: Yes. SPENSER: That they then go,

51:14"Oh, we'll stay here for another beat."

51:16AABRIA: Yeah.

51:17SPENSER: So by using those pinpoint--

51:19If you describe everything very vague

51:22and then one brick in a brick wall

51:24as being of a particular color,

51:26players are going to go investigate that.

51:27LIAM: I've always felt it's a little bit like closeup magic,

51:29like sleight of hand magic. AABRIA: Yeah.

51:31MATT: Very much so. SPENSER: I want you to look here.

51:32LIAM and AABRIA: Yeah.

51:33MATT: Sleight of word.

51:34AABRIA: I will say, that brought me to a thing

51:37I wanted to mention earlier so thank you for reminding me.

51:39In a game with a mystery, everyone's an investigator,

51:42so you don't really have the plot hound person

51:46at a normal fantasy game table where you're like,

51:49there's one guy, he's always here with a high investigation

51:52and he wants to go investigate every room

51:54before you get in there.

51:55I'm trying not to look at Liam.

51:56(laughter)

51:58LIAM: Is it me? I don't have a book full of notes.

52:00AABRIA: Orym's 31 perception means nothing is ever missed.

52:04But the idea-- LIAM: It's 33.

52:05AABRIA: I'm so sorry, that's on me.

52:08God, that's insane, yeah, drink more.

52:11MATT: I spilled. I'm a messy baby.

52:13(laughter)

52:14AABRIA: No.

52:16But there is something inside of like,

52:18since everyone's investigating together,

52:21hearing the way your players ask to investigate a room,

52:24if everyone's walking in and they have to find the clues,

52:26listen to how your players ask about the information there

52:30and you can feed clues based on the style

52:33of what they look for. MATT: Yeah.

52:35AABRIA: So if you're like, "How do I feed them this mystery?"

52:37If someone comes in and goes, "I'm going to go find a person,"

52:41and if that's their first impulse, you're like:

52:42Great, I know that I just have to put a person

52:45with a clue in any room

52:47where I need to get you information

52:48and my one interpersonal person

52:50will always go run to talk to them first.

52:52If there's someone that's always going to be like,

52:54"I'm going to go look at the art

52:56and see if I can see anything there."

52:57You're like: Great, you tell me how to give you clues

53:00based on walking into a room

53:02that's been vaguely described,

53:03if you tell me how you look for something,

53:05I'll learn to feed you clues

53:07and it becomes that much easier to get you down the path.

53:10MATT: On the same topic of feeding players

53:12what they're looking for,

53:14also shifting the narrative based on mixed successes.

53:18AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Which is,

53:19especially for players who aren't familiar

53:20with a lot of narrative-form games,

53:23to get used to the idea of what kind of consequences

53:26you can introduce during these stories.

53:28What are some of your favorite inspirations in the moment

53:32to explain to players what the consequences are

53:36for a mixed success in Candela?

53:38AABRIA: You have to answer this first. (laughs)

53:40SPENSER: So I love

53:44listening and responding as my main GM move,

53:48ask questions and build on the answers,

53:50listen and respond, and that is the scariest way

53:54to do mixed successes

53:55because you just can't plan for them, right?

53:57But listening to the situation and them describe

54:01what they want to do,

54:02and then thinking about a way that I can give them

54:04what they want, but there is some twist

54:08that either doesn't give it to them fully,

54:10or gives it to them in a way that sets them up

54:12to actually be in a worse position now,

54:14even though they have the info,

54:16and so it's hard to quantify what that is,

54:18but I think the biggest tool is doing your work as the GM

54:23on the front side to be able to go like: What do they want?

54:28What are they willing to do to get it?

54:29AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: What is this situation

54:31asking of them?

54:33What do the other people

54:34that are maybe opposed to them want here?

54:37And how can I give them, how can I push the story forward,

54:43advance the narrative, and also put them

54:46in a more dangerous spot because of it?

54:48All of those questions have to be processed pretty quick

54:50and that can be intimidating

54:52and so oftentimes you can step back and go like:

54:58What do you want and what are you willing to get?

55:00What are you willing to do for it?

55:01AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: Like that is

55:02the basic of that

55:04and sometimes I will even, I don't think I did it here,

55:06but in home games,

55:08sometimes I'll even ask them for that.

55:10AABRIA: Oh yeah, I love asking for that.

55:13SPENSER: Right? AABRIA: They're like,

55:14"Don't hand me the rope, no!"

55:16SPENSER: Because they will-- AABRIA: You tell me.

55:18SPENSER: Yeah, in specific moments, if you're drawing a blank,

55:22they will give you something

55:23worse than you would ever do to them.

55:25MATT: Oh yeah. AABRIA: It is true.

55:26MATT: My mom, whenever I got in trouble, she'd be like,

55:29"And what do you think your punishment should be?"

55:32"Two weeks grounded?"

55:33She'd be like, "I was going to ground you for one week, but sure."

55:34I'm like, "God dang it!" AABRIA: No!

55:36MATT: That actually happened to me a few times.

55:38SPENSER: So maybe that's not as actionable of advice

55:41because it's a little more esoteric, a little more vague,

55:43but like, allowing yourself the freedom

55:47to be able to go, "Okay, how can the narrative turn here

55:50"in an interesting way for all of us?"

55:52MATT: Yeah, especially when you're in spaces,

55:54I find that that's easier to come up with

55:56in action set pieces in which there's--

56:00people are already pushing towards something

56:01in which time is very much a fluid resource that is fading

56:06and so you can put obstacles in the way,

56:08you can have people get hurt,

56:09you could have things they're searching for

56:11be blocked from them.

56:11You could have things they're chasing get further away.

56:15Action set pieces, I think, naturally are easier to go with.

56:18It's the the quiet spaces where it can get challenging,

56:21in which case, I love using atmospheric triggers

56:24that start a timer. AABRIA: Ooh.

56:25MATT: If you're investigating a scene

56:27and they roll a mixed success, but you find it,

56:29but you hear a door slam in the distance

56:31and you don't know what that is and you're like,

56:32"Fuck, fuck, okay, we got to go."

56:33You don't even might know what that door is,

56:35but already you've, that this is a consequence,

56:38an ethereal consequence

56:40that already ups their personal anxiety

56:43and puts them on an imaginary timer.

56:46SPENSER: It's an indicate coming danger GM move

56:48that we talk about.

56:49MATT: So using the atmosphere outside of their periphery,

56:54using their senses, all of a sudden you grab something,

56:56as you pick it up, suddenly you smell something

56:58very iron-like in the air that wasn't there before,

57:00but it's sourceless,

57:02playing with the senses as part of a consequence

57:04that can eventually tie into what the overall threat

57:08or mounting dark danger that surrounds them could be from

57:11is a fun way to do it without having to be specific,

57:14but you can always tie that in with whatever the danger

57:16is that's coming closer and here's how you express that.

57:19AABRIA: 100%. SPENSER: Yeah, it's that

57:22make a move offscreen

57:24where you are doing a thing as the GM,

57:27but you go, "You're fine for now."

57:29That's another one if you can't think of something

57:30in the moment, think about how you could advance

57:33a future scene, a future moment and then--

57:35MATT: Indicate it to the players--

57:37SPENSER: Indicate to players. MATT: In the same time.

57:37It's something like, "You're fine for now."

57:41But then how can you also goose that a little bit?

57:44Rick mixed success, what happened?

57:45Nothing, but for some reason your left hand

57:48just got a little tingly.

57:49You can't really feel your fingertips.

57:51AABRIA: Am I having a heart attack?

57:52MATT: I mean, I guess you could do that, too.

57:54AABRIA: You've given me heart disease. LIAM: You smell toast.

57:56AABRIA: (laughs) You smell toast!

57:58(laughter)

57:59AABRIA: I'm going to use that from now on.

58:00Mixed success? Eggs?

58:02MATT: (laughs) AABRIA: You smell eggs.

58:05SPENSER: I think it is the biggest challenge for GMs

58:08in coming from more binary kinds of games

58:11to these kinds of games is how do I

58:14constantly come up with complications

58:15because the mixed success

58:17is the most common result on the dice, right,

58:20so that's the muscle that has to be learned of--

58:25Easy ways, I could give them a brain mark

58:27because it's stressful what they're doing.

58:29Those are easy go-tos.

58:32I could have the person they're talking to be like,

58:34"I'm going to give you this information,"

58:36and then cut off, but we're done here and walk away.

58:39There are go-tos that you can have happen

58:41that are a little bit easier to quantify

58:45or put in a list. AABRIA: Yeah.

58:46SPENSER: But I think that the ones that are the most useful

58:49and powerful for us as storytellers are the things

58:51that come out of all those things you talked about,

58:53the theme, the moment, the narrative,

58:55where we hope the story is going

58:56and how to indicate that to the players.

58:58AABRIA: I think, oh sorry. I was just going to say--

59:01LIAM: Let's all apologize to each other.

59:02MATT: Sorry, guys. SPENSER: I'm sorry.

59:03MATT: I'm sorry. AABRIA: I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry.

59:05LIAM: Never done anything wrong in my life.

59:07(laughter)

59:10AABRIA: Sort of weighing what you all have said.

59:13I always, I think of it as the want versus need.

59:16What do you want in this moment?

59:16That's why you're rolling.

59:18What do you need longer term and long scale,

59:20is as simple as often it is my health or sanity

59:24or the things that you can easily mark up,

59:27but a lot of times it's time

59:29and that's where you start to play

59:30with that atmospheric things.

59:32You can start to bring in character things, too,

59:33where you're like, "You want something that is good

59:36"for the party right now,

59:37"but the cost is something you need in your arc."

59:40If you're playing with Brennan

59:42who wants to have his character save his mom,

59:45the thing that you lose is some tether

59:47to that bigger question where you're like,

59:50"There's something about your mom here

59:51"and that is closed to you now.

59:53"Anyway, keep going."

59:55That's the calculus I came up with when I started running

59:58a bunch of PBTA games back in the day where you're like:

01:00:01Another hard move. What does that mean?

01:00:03MATT: Yeah. LIAM: What I was going to say,

01:00:05I was going to talk about why I like the system

01:00:08that you guys built for this because it's very different

01:00:10than another tabletop or say,

01:00:13if you're playing "Final Fantasy VII"

01:00:15or any video game--

01:00:16MATT: Don't you talk bad about "Final Fantasy VII."

01:00:18LIAM: It's a lovely game,

01:00:20but it's one kind of game. AABRIA: "It's a lovely game."

01:00:21LIAM: Where you have

01:00:23an enemy or a monster or a whatever with a stat block

01:00:26and your hero has a stat block

01:00:28and there's some randomization,

01:00:29but you're throwing stat block versus stat block

01:00:31and see what comes out on the other side.

01:00:32That's not really what this is.

01:00:34It's really just a temperature read

01:00:37for what's going on in the story.

01:00:38This is a very story-centric system,

01:00:42and at least my interpretation of it is

01:00:43that all the rolls and the failures and the successes

01:00:46are not like, "I've taken away 25% of the monster's life,

01:00:50"50% of the monster's life."

01:00:51It is really just upbeat in the story, downbeat.

01:00:54And you're being surprised moment to moment to moment

01:00:56and going with whichever direction

01:01:00a dice roll takes you,

01:01:01it's just, is the character feeling up?

01:01:03Is the character feeling down?

01:01:04Are they safe or do they just get hurt?

01:01:07Are they feeling good vibes

01:01:08or are they feeling bad vibes moment to moment to moment?

01:01:10And at the end of it, there's a story.

01:01:12MATT: Yeah, I think that's a good way to put it

01:01:13because success, failure, and mixed success

01:01:16can feel like three separate things

01:01:19and the challenge is people who are used to binary RPGs

01:01:21often is, what's this third option?

01:01:25Which, with experience, you begin to build

01:01:27a bag of tricks for that,

01:01:28but also you can consider it as opposed to three options,

01:01:30it's just a scale. AABRIA: Yes.

01:01:32MATT: You have success, you have failure,

01:01:33and the mixed success is in the middle

01:01:36to the point where it's like success,

01:01:37they get what they want.

01:01:38Failure, they do not get what they want

01:01:40and bad things happen.

01:01:41The mixed successes, they get what they want

01:01:44and bad things come at the same time.

01:01:47You're just mixing the two.

01:01:48You're finding that in between. LIAM: Fucking Imari, sorry.

01:01:50(laughter)

01:01:53MATT: We love you, Imari.

01:01:54AABRIA: Unfortunately, Liam has no idea what a mixed success is

01:01:56because they rolled out-- MATT: I know.

01:01:57AABRIA: -- crazy.

01:01:59MATT: You'll get 'em next time, buddy.

01:02:00LIAM: Yeah. AABRIA: Aw, that's rough.

01:02:03Getting the, "That's rough, buddy"

01:02:04from the GM Roundtable (laughs) is crazy!

01:02:08LIAM: I got 'em in the end.

01:02:10MATT: You did it, you did! AABRIA: You did!

01:02:11MATT: I'm proud of you. LIAM: Didn't make it easy, though.

01:02:12MATT: They never do. They never do.

01:02:15Well, to that point, we have a lot of agency as GMs

01:02:18and we want to empower the players.

01:02:20Some players can be shyer,

01:02:22some players can be more outgoing.

01:02:24Especially in tense moments,

01:02:26people might be very invested.

01:02:28How do you speed up the narrative

01:02:33along with the players without stepping on their toes,

01:02:35without feeling like you've taken

01:02:38a little bit of the agency away from them,

01:02:40or how do you keep it player-driven,

01:02:42especially in moments of high action and tension?

01:02:45SPENSER: Well, to touch on something

01:02:46that maybe would be applicable

01:02:49to the last conversation and this conversation,

01:02:51one of the moves that you can make as a GM

01:02:54is to raise the stakes. AABRIA: Yeah.

01:02:56SPENSER: So in a mixed success,

01:02:58they get what they want, but the stakes are raised.

01:03:00In this system, we specifically have standard,

01:03:03and low, and high stakes, right?

01:03:05So I can take a situation and think about how as a GM

01:03:08I can push it from standard to high,

01:03:12as a move to showcase why that success was mixed.

01:03:16In this situation also, where a player is like I--

01:03:19There's a little bit of reticence to action, right?

01:03:21It's like we don't quite know where we're going.

01:03:24We're having a hard time making a decision.

01:03:26By ramping up the stakes of the situation,

01:03:28making that move as a GM,

01:03:29you can force them into,

01:03:31"We have to make a decision now."

01:03:32MATT: Yeah. SPENSER: That's something

01:03:33that we see happen often I think at all of our tables

01:03:36of they want to think about things

01:03:38the longest they possibly can,

01:03:39but because we are playing a narrative-focused game,

01:03:41it's not about planning, it's about acting.

01:03:44So how do we give them the opportunity to do that?

01:03:48It's a balance of not taking away

01:03:49too much agency and being like,

01:03:51"I'm putting you in a bad situation

01:03:53"because you guys didn't do something."

01:03:54It's like: "I'm taking the--

01:03:57"I am using my position as the GM to showcase for you

01:04:02"what happens when you don't act."

01:04:04MATT: Yeah, you heard the door slam off in the distance earlier,

01:04:06now you're hearing it slamming into the door behind you

01:04:09and the wood's starting to splinter.

01:04:10SPENSER: Exactly. MATT: Yeah.

01:04:11AABRIA: I think those are those important beats

01:04:15where you're like: Great, you have a new thing,

01:04:17the stakes are even higher

01:04:19in order to keep people from worrying too much about,

01:04:22Oh, the stakes are raised,

01:04:23we have to make the perfect choice

01:04:24or everything will be bad.

01:04:26I definitely love taking those opportunities

01:04:30as an edit in improv, but focusing down on one person,

01:04:34usually the person

01:04:35that is a little withdrawn from a given situation

01:04:39and going: It's not that you're withdrawn,

01:04:42but you have the best eyes on everything that's going on

01:04:44because you're not inside of

01:04:46whatever big moment is happening

01:04:47that's keeping us inside of a scene or inside of an energy.

01:04:50So you, in your head, in your heart,

01:04:53something needs to change.

01:04:54I'm going to ask you to be our edit here.

01:04:57What do you want to do?

01:04:58MATT: Yeah.

01:04:59AABRIA: Using that to piggyback:

01:05:01Great, you've made a choice,

01:05:03now we're all going to follow it or splinter away from it,

01:05:06but action has been asked for and delivered.

01:05:08MATT: Yeah, finding a quiet moment of focus

01:05:10in the midst of the chaos.

01:05:11In a very cinematic way, be like--

01:05:13AABRIA: Yeah! MATT: -- as everything's crazy,

01:05:14shift over to this one player

01:05:15and be like: Right now,

01:05:16you can feel your heart beating in your ears.

01:05:19All of a sudden, you have a moment of clarity here.

01:05:21What do you want to do?

01:05:22AABRIA: Yeah, and it's this beautiful spotlighting moment

01:05:24for players that may hang back a little bit

01:05:27inside of big moments to go: It's a feature, not a bug.

01:05:31What you've done is actually super important

01:05:33to this moment right now

01:05:34because you're unique in your ability

01:05:36to make a choice for the group.

01:05:38You're all leaders,

01:05:39make the choice here and we'll all follow it.

01:05:41I think it's good praxis for the table to be like,

01:05:45"Everyone makes decisions,

01:05:46"and we're going to spotlight and share focus,

01:05:48"and scoot along from an energy

01:05:50"into the next thing that's going to happen."

01:05:52MATT: Oh yeah. LIAM: I also,

01:05:52outside of the game, encouraged everybody--

01:05:55I like it when players step up

01:05:56as sort of Deputy GM for chunks of time,

01:05:59and telling Taliesin,

01:06:01"Tell me what you're wearing, go nuts."

01:06:03I know I'm going to just listen for 10 minutes.

01:06:04AABRIA: (laughs)

01:06:05LIAM: And I love that.

01:06:06There's nothing wrong with that.

01:06:09So I encouraged everyone to, you know,

01:06:11if you're comfortable and you want to,

01:06:12and you have a scene or a moment

01:06:14or something you want to pursue,

01:06:16you don't need my permission,

01:06:17go ahead and I'll come along with you.

01:06:19AABRIA: Yeah. LIAM: But,

01:06:21every player is different,

01:06:22and some people are happy to leap in and do that

01:06:24and some people are way more reticent.

01:06:27So I would also have ideas for things

01:06:31that I could toss at that reticent player,

01:06:34like you're saying about zeroing in on them

01:06:36if they are hesitant

01:06:37and aren't going to jump into the ring on their own.

01:06:41Oh, and sometimes, they'll surprise me and do it anyway.

01:06:43So having an option in my back pocket is nice,

01:06:45but not being married to it,

01:06:47to just go with wherever the energy

01:06:51between you and that one specific player is.

01:06:53AABRIA: Yeah. LIAM: Then you throw it all

01:06:54out the window anyway, so.

01:06:55AABRIA: I mean, that's the secret to all of this.

01:06:57We can talk all day long about here's all your tools.

01:06:59You're like: I've got a case full of cards and I'm Gambit,

01:07:04and eventually you'll let me throw one of these.

01:07:06It's mostly you're chasing your friends

01:07:08down a spooky story

01:07:09and being like: Yeah, there's a monster!

01:07:11Keep going! Why are you going that way?

01:07:12Sure, okay!

01:07:13(laughter)

01:07:15SPENSER: Well, and I love-- AABRIA: Yeet! (laughs)

01:07:17SPENSER: Like you were talking about, I love

01:07:18empowering players,

01:07:19and I think there's a really interesting

01:07:22freedom and respect

01:07:24and trust that can be born out of a table

01:07:29where you as the GM give them the ability

01:07:31to narrate sometimes

01:07:33in a way that they wouldn't typically expect.

01:07:36I remember there was a scene, Zehra,

01:07:38who was fairly new to tabletop role playing games,

01:07:41an incredible player.

01:07:42There was a scene where Luis

01:07:45was playing himself when he was younger

01:07:48and was being--

01:07:51Zehra's character, Jean's father,

01:07:53was coming to do essentially a seance or exorcism

01:07:56was coming to do essentially a seance or exorcism

01:07:59or something on him. MATT: Mm-hmm.

01:08:00SPENSER: So I just let Zehra and Luis

01:08:02do that scene together. AABRIA: Oh yeah.

01:08:03SPENSER: Zehra playing her father, right?

01:08:05I could have played her father, but I was like,

01:08:06"I don't know your father."

01:08:08That also was born out of "We're playing three sessions,

01:08:10"I don't know your father like you do,"

01:08:12and I also know thematically

01:08:13that the father figure in her backstory

01:08:16was really important to her.

01:08:17I didn't want to mess it up, right,

01:08:18I didn't want to step on toes.

01:08:20But then, they did a scene for 10 minutes together

01:08:23and we all got to, at the table,

01:08:26just got to hang out-- AABRIA: So fun.

01:08:26SPENSER: -- and watch the movie that was happening.

01:08:27MATT: I love those moments so much.

01:08:28AABRIA: Bro, when you get to be fan

01:08:30and audience member one,

01:08:32the best. SPENSER: It's so good.

01:08:34But it also gave them

01:08:37the feeling of agency in a way

01:08:41that I really enjoyed seeing them open up after that.

01:08:45So I think it's a powerful technique

01:08:47and obviously we can't do it all the time as GMs,

01:08:49but if we can find those certain moments

01:08:52to gift them that time

01:08:55for them to run with some agency

01:08:59in a way that maybe they wouldn't have typically.

01:09:02I think also to piggyback on that,

01:09:05there's a difference for me

01:09:08in a group of characters trying to scramble

01:09:13to figure out what to do in a high stakes moment,

01:09:15and you as the GM putting pressure on them

01:09:17in the narrative to make a choice,

01:09:20and a player who you need to have

01:09:22a little more patience with

01:09:23because they are overwhelmed by the system

01:09:26or overwhelmed by role playing games in general.

01:09:29I think being able to differentiate as the GM

01:09:32how much pressure can I put on them via the narrative

01:09:37versus how much patience

01:09:38and guidance do I need to give them

01:09:40as their friend and their guide,

01:09:43essentially, to this game.

01:09:46Being able to make those calls I think is really important.

01:09:48To be frank,

01:09:49I was worried when I gave Zehra

01:09:50the opportunity to do that,

01:09:51that she would feel overwhelmed, right?

01:09:53So it was this--

01:09:55I was there to support her if she was like,

01:09:57"Oh, I don't know how to do that."

01:09:59But being there as a support pillar for your friends

01:10:02But being there as a support pillar for your friends

01:10:05and also putting them in bad situations

01:10:08is the bread and butter of a GM.

01:10:10We are the heel in wrestling. AABRIA: (laughs)

01:10:11MATT: Yeah. SPENSER: Right?

01:10:12AABRIA: God, yes. MATT: Yep.

01:10:13SPENSER: We're doing kayfabe. AABRIA: All day long.

01:10:15MATT: It's fun to play it up, too.

01:10:16SPENSER: Yeah. AABRIA: It's my

01:10:17favorite thing to do. MATT: In our hearts,

01:10:19we are like, "I love you all so much."

01:10:21On the face:

01:10:22"Ugh, you ruined my stuff I was trying to kill you with!

01:10:26"But I love you

01:10:26"and I'm so proud of you." AABRIA: Yeah! (laughs)

01:10:28MATT: That's the whole secret. AABRIA: "You did a good job

01:10:29"fighting it!

01:10:30"I mean, aw shucks. Next time."

01:10:32SPENSER: (laughs) MATT: Yeah, exactly.

01:10:33AABRIA: Getting to go-- MATT: That's the best part of it.

01:10:34AABRIA: You foiled my plan.

01:10:35You get to constantly be the like, "You meddling kids!"

01:10:38It's the best!

01:10:40MATT: This is actually a good question, too.

01:10:42Candela Obscura as a world

01:10:46draws a lot of its inspiration

01:10:47from Victorian era, spirituality and spiritualism,

01:10:52turn of the 20th century, post-World War society.

01:10:57Taking all the facets of this genre of horror

01:11:01into this new world

01:11:04for players that are wanting to build their own mysteries,

01:11:07and their own creatures,

01:11:08and their own horror in this space,

01:11:11what are your recommendations for these players

01:11:14to pull from their inspirations in history,

01:11:18but without bringing in the colonial baggage

01:11:21or historical problematic elements

01:11:23that come along with our culture

01:11:24at those periods of time?

01:11:25SPENSER: Yeah. AABRIA: (laughs)

01:11:27SPENSER: I think that was one of the big reasons

01:11:28why we made Newfaire and the Fairelands as they are,

01:11:32which is this is aesthetically a turn of the century place,

01:11:37but we wanted it to be a place

01:11:38that the problems lie in other aspects of society.

01:11:42(laughs) AABRIA: Yeah.

01:11:44SPENSER: We aren't living in a world

01:11:45where somebody like Zehra couldn't be a doctor.

01:11:48AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Right.

01:11:48SPENSER: Right? Jean couldn't be a doctor.

01:11:52I think that we can do our due diligence as GMs,

01:11:56as storytellers, to go and do the research

01:12:00and to do our best to put into practice

01:12:03and to do our best to put into practice

01:12:07the kinds of things from that world that we find interesting

01:12:08the kinds of things from that world that we find interesting

01:12:12without bringing with it the baggage

01:12:15of the terrible parts of that society

01:12:18that we all are highly aware of.

01:12:24The other bit that I think is so important

01:12:27is that we're going to get it wrong sometimes.

01:12:29MATT: Mm-hmm.

01:12:33SPENSER: There has to be grace for failure,

01:12:35but there also has to be space for learning, right?

01:12:38If we fail and we learn, that's what's important.

01:12:40So in building the game, that was a big factor.

01:12:45We had a lot of things that we failed and learned from

01:12:47with cultural consultants and sensitivity consultants

01:12:49and all these people that came in and were like,

01:12:50"Hey, this thing, actually--"

01:12:52For example,

01:12:53something that was a blind spot for me in particular,

01:12:56I didn't know that crystal balls were an issue.

01:13:03So that's something that I learned as we did it.

01:13:08You'll notice in Candela, there are no crystal balls.

01:13:11AABRIA: Yeah. SPENSER: That's just not

01:13:11in the artwork and stuff.

01:13:13MATT: Yeah.

01:13:14SPENSER: Now, if you want to bring that

01:13:15into your own home game, that's up to you

01:13:17to figure out how you grapple with all of that.

01:13:20But yeah, I think just doing your best to be able to go,

01:13:24everybody is welcome here.

01:13:25If there's anything that pings on anybody,

01:13:27making sure you as a GM and even as a player at the table

01:13:30have an open enough conversation with the table

01:13:33that they can go, "Hey, I'm uncomfortable with this,

01:13:35"can we change it?"

01:13:36MATT: I think it's also a good thing to talk about, too.

01:13:39You are also welcome to explore these themes

01:13:41if they're important to you as a player at the table,

01:13:43and you are in a place where you can or you have the--

01:13:48You are able to speak on these things.

01:13:50AABRIA: Yeah. MATT: Being like,

01:13:52you and the people at the table want to discuss this

01:13:53and feel what's a safe space for you to explore a story

01:13:56that can deal with societal prejudice

01:13:58that could exist in the Fairelands

01:13:59that's not prescriptive in the book,

01:14:00but that's important to you for you to explore

01:14:03in this world as part of the story, you can do that.

01:14:06But it's also doing the research, doing the care,

01:14:09and making sure that everyone at the table

01:14:10is on the same page and everyone's comfortable

01:14:12with exploring these themes as well.

01:14:13AABRIA: 1,000%.

01:14:14I think it's so important to note up top

01:14:17that a vibe is a shorthand,

01:14:20and shorthand is always a launching off point.

01:14:22It is not the be-all end-all the moment you start going:

01:14:25Gaslamp, Victorian, great.

01:14:28I'm going to map on everything I know about a time period.

01:14:32You're unfortunately porting in

01:14:36all the societal stuff around it,

01:14:37that maybe doesn't ping as inherently problematic

01:14:40but the moment you start digging.

01:14:41So, take a vibe up top as a beginning.

01:14:46Then I think there's always value,

01:14:48especially if you're coming into something with a group

01:14:50that you're like, we want to be aware of what we're doing

01:14:53and build something that is specifically for us.

01:14:55Spend a little extra time,

01:14:57the vibes that are put forth in the book are immaculate.

01:15:02Do some world building with your table.

01:15:04MATT: Mm-hmm. AABRIA: Figure out

01:15:05what you guys want, where you build,

01:15:07where you diverge, and what you want to deal with.

01:15:10Having a gorgeously written

01:15:12and aesthetically very pleasing

01:15:14rule book and core system book is not an excuse

01:15:18to not do a little bit of that legwork yourself,

01:15:20both because it helps everyone be invested

01:15:23and understand the stakes and world of the story,

01:15:26and also it helps you build a world

01:15:27that has fidelity to your table

01:15:29and your table's priorities.

01:15:30LIAM: Yeah, and the human beings at your particular table

01:15:33are making that framework together.

01:15:34AABRIA: Exactly. MATT: Yes.

01:15:35LIAM: The book and the rule system's not saying--

01:15:37We want your players

01:15:39to be able to tell any kind of story

01:15:40they want in this world,

01:15:42and you don't want to be like,

01:15:43"Well, it's 1910, so you don't get to tell that story."

01:15:45AABRIA: Yep. MATT: Yeah.

01:15:46Or, Candela, in the book, it doesn't say

01:15:48we can talk about generational trauma,

01:15:49you know, or classism, or issues with authority,

01:15:52so we should avoid those themes.

01:15:54No, if those excite you as players

01:15:55and everyone at the table wants to explore those,

01:15:57then please do so.

01:15:59You know, this is just the setting

01:16:01in which we can build that space

01:16:04without baking those historical issues in.

01:16:07AABRIA: Yes. MATT: Then if you feel

01:16:08you want to engage with them as a player

01:16:10and process that as part of the horror narrative

01:16:12because a lot of these things in the world and in history

01:16:14are horrifying in their own right,

01:16:16and can be explored at a table where it feels safe

01:16:18and there's trust there.

01:16:19Please, by all means, go for it.

01:16:21AABRIA: There simply isn't a setting--

01:16:24No one can build and present a setting

01:16:27that is clean from any conflict

01:16:30or point of contention, because that grit

01:16:33is the texture that a story is driven off of.

01:16:36MATT: Yes. AABRIA: So again,

01:16:38this isn't a bigger message beyond talk to your group,

01:16:43build your world with your group.

01:16:45Even if you have a book,

01:16:47build your world with your group.

01:16:49You don't hand off copies of Candela

01:16:51and go like, "I hope everyone has studied."

01:16:53(laughter) AABRIA: "You all have to

01:16:53"know exactly where you're from

01:16:56"and what all the deal is,

01:16:57"and you have to know all the NPCs in your location."

01:17:00That's not fun.

01:17:01But taking that as a launching off point

01:17:03to build the world you want to play in

01:17:04should always be a part of the building the game.

01:17:07MATT: Yeah. I mean, if there's ever something

01:17:08that you're not sure of,

01:17:09or you're like, "I wonder.

01:17:11"I don't see these things anymore.

01:17:13"I'll look up and see if there's

01:17:14"something wrong there." AABRIA: Google it!

01:17:15MATT: Then Google it and find out.

01:17:17AABRIA: (whispers) Google. MATT: Or as you play your game,

01:17:19if a player comes up to you and says,

01:17:20"Hey, just so you know,

01:17:22"that kind of makes me a little uncomfortable

01:17:23"about this thing," or maybe you didn't know this history.

01:17:25Be like, "Oh, okay.

01:17:27"Well, we're not going to go back to that again,"

01:17:28you know? AABRIA: Yeah.

01:17:29MATT: Pluck it out if it makes the table uncomfortable.

01:17:31LIAM: Yeah. MATT: You just evolve.

01:17:32Once again, you won't always get everything perfect,

01:17:35and as long as there's grace and the willingness to learn,

01:17:38then you continue on and everyone's gravy.

01:17:40And by gravy, I mean absolutely terrified

01:17:42and clinging for their life--

01:17:43AABRIA: Spooky gravy. MATT: -- and probably being

01:17:44devoured and eaten until nobody's left.

01:17:46So, yay. AABRIA: Yay.

01:17:48MATT: I think that's a great beat to finish up this topic.

01:17:51AABRIA: Yes.

01:17:52MATT: So thank you all so much for joining us

01:17:54for the Candela Obscura GM Roundtable.

01:17:57Thank you all so much for being part of the series

01:18:00and being part of this roundtable.

01:18:02Spenser Starke, Liam O'Brien, Aabria Iyengar,

01:18:05you are the apple of my eye, I love you all so much.

01:18:08Thank you for being here.

01:18:08AABRIA: Matthew Mercer. SPENSER: (laughs)

01:18:10MATT: Oh, I'm here, too.

01:18:11(laughter)

01:18:14MATT: Mwah! AABRIA: I love you!

01:18:15(laughter)

01:18:16MATT: Do not perceive me!

01:18:18I'm put here because I have to be!

01:18:19(laughter)

01:18:21AABRIA: We don't let him out the building.

01:18:22SPENSER: Yeah, he sleeps here. MATT: I'm know, I live here.

01:18:24But no, if you haven't checked that out yet,

01:18:26Candela Obscura's Core Rulebook,

01:18:27along with the dice, accessories, more,

01:18:30are all available at the Critical Role online shops,

01:18:32the Darrington Press Guild stores,

01:18:33and of course your other friendly local game stores.

01:18:36You can learn more about the game

01:18:37at darringtonpress.com/candela.

01:18:40So please, go forth,

01:18:42and we hope your games bring you excellent

01:18:44and delightfully haunting tales in the Fairelands.

01:18:47Thank you all so much. Bye-bye!

01:18:49LIAM: Stop rolling sixes in this building!

01:18:51SPENSER: Ah! MATT: Oh god!

01:18:52ALL: (exclaiming)

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