Simon Sinek: The Number One Reason Why You’re Not Succeeding | E145
The Diary Of A CEO2022-05-23
The Diary Of A CEO#simon sinek#tedtalks#ted#leadership#leader#inspiration#action#inspire action#inspiring action#belief#cause#faith#trust#driven#communicate#communication#motivation#inspiring people#who is inspiring#inspiring leaders#inspiring organizations#how to be inspiring#challenge#innovation#advertising#good advertising#making choices#consumer choice#brain#psychology#decision making#success#marketing#business#The Number One Reason Why You’re Not Succeeding
3M views|2 years ago
💫 Short Summary
The video highlights the importance of finding purpose and fulfillment in life, emphasizing self-awareness, vulnerability, and genuine connections. It discusses the impact of trauma on motivation, the significance of setting broader goals beyond personal success, and the value of seeking feedback for personal growth. It also addresses ethical decision-making, the consequences of avoiding uncomfortable conversations, and the evolving nature of work environments. The speaker advocates for authenticity in communication and content creation, prioritizing impact over popularity. Additionally, there is a focus on building companies that prioritize longevity, culture, and innovation.
✨ Highlights
📊 Transcript
✦
Importance of Purpose in Driving Action.
01:25Knowing the 'why' behind our actions is crucial to maintaining passion and motivation.
Trauma can impact individuals' motivations and drive.
Our 'why' is often formed in adolescence and influences our decisions throughout life.
Successful athletes may experience depression post-achievement due to a disconnect between external success and inner fulfillment.
✦
Importance of broader goals for athletes like NFL player Curtis Martin.
10:06Individual athletes often prioritize personal success over relationships and personal fulfillment.
Curtis Martin's journey emphasizes giving back and using his platform for a greater purpose.
Emphasizes the value of a continuum approach to life rather than focusing solely on personal achievements.
Serving others leads to a more fulfilling and meaningful existence.
✦
Importance of self-awareness and vulnerability in personal growth and relationships.
12:47Identifying blind spots and knowledge gaps is crucial for self-improvement.
Vulnerability is essential for building genuine connections and resolving conflicts authentically.
Differentiating between true vulnerability and performative displays on social media is emphasized.
Technology's impact on human connection and societal shift towards self-service over pro-social behaviors is discussed.
✦
Importance of being present for others in relationships and personal growth.
21:55Emphasis on active listening, sacrificing for others, and practicing mindfulness and meditation.
Discussion on the balance between personal confidence and external appearance through working out for health and attractiveness.
Finding purpose and meaning in life through acts of kindness and consideration for others.
✦
Importance of self-awareness for personal growth and evolution.
25:48Seeking feedback from others and being open to self-assessment is crucial.
Building trust through asking for help and creating reciprocal relationships.
Accepting compliments graciously allows others the joy of giving.
Asking for help is a selfless act that benefits both parties in a relationship.
✦
Importance of Feedback Culture in Personal and Professional Development.
31:55Peer review is crucial in recognizing strengths and weaknesses to promote growth.
Implementation of a 360 review system for individual and team progress.
Emphasis on open communication and examples of growth through feedback.
Highlighting the value of community and support in relationships.
✦
Importance of feedback and gratitude in leadership.
38:51Leaders should replace judgment with curiosity and seek the truth before making assumptions.
Setting a tone of honesty within an organization is crucial for promoting integrity.
Approval of lies can lead to a culture of dishonesty in the workplace.
'Tree of Monkeys' concept illustrates different perspectives at various levels of hierarchy.
✦
Understanding Ethical Fading in Decision-Making.
44:45Ethical fading occurs when individuals think they are acting ethically but make unethical decisions, causing harm within organizations.
Rationalizing and the slippery slope are key factors that contribute to ethical fading.
Language is often used to minimize the impact of decisions, such as using euphemisms like 'enhanced interrogation' to justify unethical actions.
It is important for leaders to address ethical fading, prioritize ethical decision-making over short-term goals, and prevent detrimental effects on teams and individuals.
✦
Importance of addressing uncomfortable conversations in work and relationships.
47:01Avoiding uncomfortable conversations can lead to unethical behavior and negative consequences.
Employees may quit instead of asking for a raise, while individuals may lie to avoid conflict.
Avoidance can result in stress, damage to health, and strained relationships.
Younger generations may struggle with conflict avoidance, preferring to ghost or quit rather than have challenging discussions.
✦
Importance of teaching uncomfortable conversations and lack of focus on social interaction skills in education.
52:45Strengths and weaknesses are discussed with an emphasis on their contextual nature.
Characteristics of Generation Z are highlighted as activists and vocal about dissatisfaction with work.
Emphasis on understanding and navigating different generations in the workplace.
✦
Importance of approaching situations with empathy.
59:56Understanding root causes of actions, such as quitting before asking for a raise.
Impact of remote work on social connections and mental health, including rising rates of depression and anxiety.
Prediction of increased flexibility in work environments and the importance of office culture in retaining employees.
'Great Resignation' attributed to decades of poor corporate culture and leadership.
✦
The 'Great Resignation' is a result of employees seeking more than just a job for survival.
01:07:33Many employees are leaving for better opportunities and work-life balance.
Companies should focus on creating a positive corporate culture that values human skills and offers a sense of purpose to retain talent.
Tech companies with flashy perks may not necessarily have strong cultures.
Employees are looking for a greater cause to join and believe in, rather than just material benefits or fun workplace amenities.
✦
Reflection on the purpose and impact of the podcast.
01:12:51Importance of honesty and authenticity in communication highlighted.
Motivation for starting the podcast includes personal growth, building a personal brand, and providing a service to others.
Feedback from listeners expressing connection and gratitude reinforces the value of truthful and open discussions.
Contrasts the desire for fame and success with deeper satisfaction from genuine self-expression and helping others.
✦
Importance of maintaining purpose and truth-telling in content creation.
01:16:05Warning against unethical practices like gaming algorithms for popularity.
Advocacy for prioritizing cause and impact over superficial metrics.
Balancing striving for excellence with staying true to values.
Emphasizing the significance of authenticity and genuine impact in content creation.
✦
Speaker's work with Penguin Random House's optimism press and focus on publishing books that advance new ideas and societal progress.
01:20:48Speaker's involvement in police reform and driving innovation in large bureaucracies.
Emphasis on building infinite-minded companies that prioritize longevity and culture over immediate success or profit.
Desire to support and build companies with new business approaches for the benefit of the economy and the world.
✦
Importance of Learning and Challenging Perspectives.
01:27:32The speaker has difficulty reading books but has found alternative ways to acquire knowledge.
Emphasis is placed on understanding ideas and questioning the reasons behind how things work.
The speaker enjoys sharing knowledge and seeing the impact of challenging perspectives.
There is a desire to contribute to solving societal issues, particularly in police reform, for personal fulfillment.
✦
Importance of reinventing modern businesses and rejecting traditional structures.
01:32:41Emphasis on leaving behind tools and ideas for improvement by others, leading to a fulfilling life.
Value of sustainability and conscious choices in daily routines for a greener world.
Discussion on a brand focused on eco-friendly products sponsoring the promotion of sustainability.
00:00we don't teach leaders how to have
00:01uncomfortable conversations we don't
00:02teach students how to have uncomfortable
00:04conversations you tell me which is going
00:05to be more valuable for the rest of your
00:07life how to have a difficult
00:08conversation or trigonometry
00:10described as a visionary thinker with a
00:12rare intellect multiple time
00:14best-selling author science cynic
00:16every single one of us knows what we do
00:18some of us know how we do it but very
00:20very few of us can clearly articulate
00:21why we do what we do and i think one of
00:23the reasons most of us don't know who we
00:24are is because we're making decisions
00:26that are inconsistent with that true
00:28cause with that why there's a great
00:30irony in in all of this
00:32i had what a lot of people would be
00:34considered a good life and yet didn't
00:36want to wake up and go to work anymore
00:38why
00:39i
00:42we cannot do this thing called career or
00:44life alone we're just not that smart
00:46we're not that strong we're just not
00:47that good for anyone who wants to be a
00:49better version of themselves purpose
00:52comes from
00:55it's one of the best podcasts i've ever
00:57done
00:59so without further ado
01:00i'm stephen bartlett and this is the
01:02direva ceo usa edition i hope nobody's
01:06listening but if you are
01:08then please keep this yourself
01:10[Music]
01:17simon
01:19my introduction to you was this book
01:22start with why and it hung on the walls
01:24of some of my offices around the world
01:26for a long time and then my employees
01:28would come in after reading the book and
01:29evangelize about it and it would come up
01:31in meetings and in discussions and in
01:33creative brainstorms etc over and over
01:35and over again the question i wanted to
01:37ask you was
01:38was there a point in your life where
01:40you'd felt
01:41like you drifted so far from your why
01:44that you realized the importance of it
01:46for the first time
01:48well the simple answer is yes um it was
01:50that drifting
01:52that set me on the
01:54path to find it in the first place to to
01:57even articulate that idea
02:00i had what
02:02a lot of people would be considered
02:04sort of a good life as living the
02:06proverbial american dream
02:08you know i
02:09quit my job to start my own business the
02:12business was doing okay made an okay
02:15living had great clients did good work
02:18and yet i'd lost my passion for that and
02:21didn't want to wake up and go to go to
02:23work anymore
02:24which was embarrassing because
02:25superficially everything was just fine
02:28i was pretending that i was happier more
02:31in control and more successful than i
02:34was or felt
02:35um which is quite frankly pretty
02:37draining and pretty dark
02:39and it wasn't until a very very close
02:40friend of mine came to me and said
02:41something's wrong she was the first one
02:43to notice something
02:44and i came clean
02:45and i sort of
02:46let it all out
02:48and uh it was
02:50that catharsis that sort of lifted this
02:53heavy weight off my shoulders i was no
02:55longer alone it was no longer a secret
02:57um and all of the energy that was
02:59previously going into lying hiding and
03:00faking now went into finding a solution
03:03there
03:04was a confluence of events it's not you
03:05know all of these histories are
03:08perfectly neat and
03:09clean and that's not really how it is or
03:11was
03:12but
03:13to compress it and oversimplify it i
03:15made this discovery based on the biology
03:17of human decision making that every
03:18single one of us knows what we do
03:20some of us know how we do it but very
03:22very few of us can clearly articulate
03:24why we do what we do and i realized that
03:26was what i was missing so to answer your
03:30question
03:31yes 100 the realization of the why was
03:33my loss of it and i realized i knew what
03:36i did and i was good at it i knew how i
03:38was different or special or stood out
03:39from the crowd and that was my
03:40differentiating value proposition and i
03:42was articulate about it but i couldn't
03:44tell you why i was waking out of bed
03:45every day to do it you know and i would
03:48give some
03:49nonsense entrepreneur answer because i
03:50want to be my own boss and be like yeah
03:52sure but that's not a reason to get out
03:54of bed every day this got me thinking a
03:56lot about
03:57the guests that i have sit here and also
03:58my own story where
04:00sometimes
04:01i think people's why or the thing that's
04:04been driving them is in fact some kind
04:05of trauma or insecurity
04:08i think because you sit here with people
04:09in there
04:10whether it's
04:12israel arasanya the ufc champion who's
04:14the current
04:16maybe world's best ufc fighter he was
04:18battered and bullied as a kid being the
04:20only black kid in his school in new
04:21zealand and so it's no coincidence that
04:25he strived to be this fighter and in
04:27fact when he won the ufc title the next
04:29day he was he was depressed and he went
04:31to therapy
04:33that's made me question whether like our
04:35wise can sometimes be
04:36trauma or
04:38insecurity driven as opposed to being
04:42intentional in i don't know
04:44so a why
04:46is fully formed by the time we're in our
04:49mid to late teens the youngest person
04:51i've done at wide discovery 4 was 16 and
04:54it worked the process worked
04:56um
04:57and what i've learned from just doing
04:59hundreds of these over the years
05:01is that a y is always positive it's
05:03always striving for something so like
05:05we're not inspired against something
05:06we're not inspired to stop something
05:08we're inspired to build something or
05:10create something or advance something
05:13though it may have been born out of
05:16trauma
05:17there's usually a silver lining that
05:19gives us that cause especially trauma
05:22that happens in the middle of our lives
05:23you know september 11th is often looked
05:25to as you know people found purpose
05:27you know we are who we are
05:29like i said we're fully formed by the
05:31experiences we have when we're young
05:33you know at a pretty young age
05:35and now the opportunity life presents us
05:37is to make decisions that either keeps
05:38us in balance with who we really are or
05:40not and i think one of the reasons most
05:42of us feel discomfort or don't feel
05:44ourselves or don't know who we are is
05:47because we're making decisions that are
05:48inconsistent with that true cause with
05:50that why so you raise
05:53the case of
05:54um individual athletes who become
05:58champions and then suffer depression
05:59it's a
06:00fairly common story you hear this from
06:02olympians you know michael phelps
06:04becomes the most meddled you know
06:07uh olympian of all time immediately
06:09suffers depression andre agassi becomes
06:12the most storied you know tennis player
06:14of all time immediately becomes
06:16depressed
06:17and
06:19what i've learned from talking to some
06:20of these
06:21um
06:22these particularly athletes but i think
06:25it happens in the business world as well
06:26which is from a very young age
06:29they set themselves a goal
06:31that
06:32in my words would be a very selfish goal
06:35i want to be the best at x the best
06:37tennis player the best golfer the best
06:39whatever and you know the way olympians
06:41put it which i get a kick out of is i
06:42want to win the olympics like well
06:44no one wins the olympics like you can be
06:46a winner in your sport you know but
06:49that's an aside
06:50but and and their entire lives from
06:52pretty young ages
06:54every decision they're making
06:56is to help them advance this finite goal
07:02all of their relationships
07:04are can you
07:05help me achieve my goal
07:08right and if you can no longer help me
07:10achieve my goal i don't need you anymore
07:13as a coach
07:14or even a friend
07:16and there's huge sacrifices missing of
07:19birthdays missing of christmases you
07:21know missing of major life uh events
07:25because i have to practice so i can
07:27achieve my goal and when they get
07:29interviewed on the news
07:31you know or at the olympics or whatever
07:32you know why do you do it they'll say
07:34well i'm doing it to inspire the little
07:35kids which is complete [ __ ] you know
07:38if you look at all of their
07:40vision boards from when they were
07:41younger
07:42of pictures of podiums and medals and
07:45money and lamborghinis not a single
07:47little child on there of the people
07:49you're doing it for it's it's just a
07:50lucky strike extra i mean absolutely you
07:52do inspire children but that's not the
07:54reason you did it you just got that you
07:56know like i said it's sort of a it's a
07:57twofer
07:59and
08:00and then when they achieve or don't
08:01achieve this thing and then can no
08:03longer compete for it
08:05um
08:06they've set their entire path and all
08:07their relationships on this one these
08:09finite selfish goals and so when it's
08:11complete
08:12they realize they don't really have a
08:14lot of friends around them they don't
08:15really have a lot of close relationships
08:17they don't really even have a sense of
08:18purpose because they've been spent the
08:19past 20 years or so with one purpose
08:22which was this finite goal which now has
08:24run out
08:25and so the very purpose lists
08:27and i see this in broadway performers
08:30who set their whole life to be on the
08:31west end or be on broadway
08:33you know every class every tap dancing
08:35class every singing class they make it
08:37they get there and then
08:40depression or at least malaise
08:43or senior executive same thing if i just
08:45or if i just make a million dollars
08:47you know if i just become a millionaire
08:50then i'll feel
08:52and uh and the problem with all of those
08:54things is as i said before they are
08:56selfish
08:57uh it is your goal for your reasons
09:00which
09:00um
09:01is not fulfilling for any social animal
09:03for any human being
09:05you know our sense of joy and
09:07fulfillment and love
09:08and purpose
09:10comes
09:11from our ability to serve another human
09:13being have a child tell me how your life
09:15changes
09:16fall in love tell me how your life
09:18changes you know think about all the
09:19stupid things irrational things we've
09:22done for love we get on planes and
09:24travel around the world just to say i
09:26love you you know we do ridiculous
09:28things and it all feels worth it
09:31and the sacrifices we make for a child
09:33all feel worth it but these are no
09:35longer for us and these things will live
09:37on beyond our own lives they are not
09:39finite they are infinite
09:41and there's nothing wrong with personal
09:43achievement there's nothing wrong with
09:44setting goals
09:46but it has to be in the context of
09:47something even bigger
09:49in general
09:51team sports don't suffer this because
09:53you had to do it together you know it's
09:56usually individual athletes who suffer
09:57this more often uh and so there is a
10:00there's one of the athletes i would
10:02point to is a guy by the name of curtis
10:03martin
10:04curtis is a
10:06hall of fame nfl footballer um
10:10and
10:11he only started playing football
10:14basically to stay out of trouble
10:16he did it as a favor to his mom
10:18just so he wouldn't get into he grew up
10:19in a really bad neighborhood in
10:20philadelphia
10:22it basically kept him out of trouble it
10:23turns out he was really good at it and
10:25when he realized he was good at it he
10:26realized that by being good at something
10:28it will give him the power to actually
10:30give back later and
10:32he made this realization especially when
10:34he went to college on scholarship and
10:35then made it to the nfl he realized the
10:37better he was at the sport it wasn't
10:39about propelling his own career it was
10:41about when he leaves this career he has
10:44a platform
10:45that would be bigger than the platform
10:47he has now and so he was driven and
10:49driven and driven not so that he could
10:51be the best not that so that he could
10:52make the most money in fact he made a
10:53lot less money than a lot of other
10:54players of his rank
10:56not that he could uh
10:58be rich or famous or any of these things
11:00he did it so that he could build his
11:01platform so he could give back later so
11:03when he retired from the nfl
11:05he wasn't lost he wasn't searching
11:08he he knew exactly what the next step
11:10was because
11:11being in being an elite athlete to the
11:13highest level possible was only step one
11:16um and to see one's life as a continuum
11:18rather than a than an event
11:21um is much healthier
11:24on that point of seeing one's life as a
11:25continuum by the way you completely you
11:28call it atting someone where you
11:29describe their situation but you
11:30completely added me you completely
11:31described my situation in terms of
11:34the place of mind i was in at 25 when i
11:36had that offered to buy my company
11:38it was about me it was about filling
11:41some void that i had in me from
11:43being like the only black kid in an
11:44all-white school and thinking that i
11:46think
11:47success and
11:49accolades would fill that void in some
11:50ways but on that point of a continuum as
11:53a as a way to live your life the other
11:55moment in my life where i which i really
11:57struggled in terms of goal setting and
11:58motivation was when i was trying to get
12:00in shape and in like 2017 i said to
12:03myself i want to get a six-pack for
12:05summer that's the goal i set myself
12:09really what i was trying to find a way
12:11to stay fit forever but i set myself
12:13this goal of getting a six pack in
12:14summer that was my thing and then every
12:16single year my motivation would only
12:19last for like four or five months and i
12:21couldn't crack how people are
12:23continually motivated to work out
12:26i've cracked it now but what was wrong
12:28about that because i've heard you speak
12:29about arbitrary goals before what is the
12:32the flaw of creating arbitrary goals in
12:34our lives and how do we create goals
12:35that are more based on that idea of a
12:36continuum
12:38you know i i'm not a huge fan of the the
12:40term self-improvement right
12:43um but i do like
12:45the idea of awareness
12:47self-awareness
12:49you know we all live with blind spots
12:51we all
12:52live with missing gaps and pieces of
12:55information which will by the way last
12:56for the rest of our lives and there are
12:58some people who choose to live a life
13:00where
13:01living with those gaps is acceptable and
13:03they never fill them in and we would say
13:04that they remain stagnant
13:07and arguably
13:08either mentally or physically unhealthy
13:11or
13:12gaining
13:14you know getting unhealthier as they get
13:15older you know
13:17for someone for anyone who who wants to
13:20be a better version of themselves
13:23a more aware version of themselves you
13:25you
13:26we i seek out
13:29information
13:30and that comes in all kinds of forms
13:32right it can be in a relationship
13:35um so for example i went and took a
13:36listening class
13:38or actually i should pre preface with um
13:41i was dating someone
13:42and she accused me of being a bad
13:44listener
13:45and i was like
13:46you do know what i do for a living right
13:48like
13:49i'm a really good listener so i don't
13:51know what you're talking about you know
13:54and then i took this listening class
13:55turns out i'm an absolutely
13:57brilliant listener
13:59with people who i'll never see again for
14:01the rest of my life
14:02but amongst my friends and family
14:05appalling
14:06appalling
14:07so i had this basic skill set that i
14:09never applied
14:11with the people closest to me
14:13and gave myself an out because quote
14:14unquote i knew how to listen
14:17um and so i realized i was a terrible
14:19listener this was a blind spot this was
14:20a gap and having somebody love me tell
14:22me that didn't work
14:24didn't believe them
14:26until you know this objective outsider
14:28or at least i just took this class and
14:29came to this realization
14:31that was brilliant that awareness
14:34of the blind spot and the awareness of
14:35the skills that i need
14:37to be a better brother son boyfriend
14:41friend
14:41you know
14:42i had to learn how to hold space for
14:45someone
14:47and then practice
14:49um that's awareness
14:51and i think
14:52our health is awareness unfortunately
14:55some people wait for the
14:57breakup to learn that they're bad
14:58listeners some people wait for the heart
15:00attack to realize they're eating poorly
15:03you know that's awareness you get
15:04awareness by getting a punch in the face
15:06and i think i think it's a
15:08responsibility for every human being
15:10should they want to have value in the
15:12lives of others
15:15to seek awareness in how they show up in
15:18the world and and how the world impacts
15:20them
15:20their mental health their physical
15:21health their ability to maintain
15:23relationships and nurse relationships
15:26and you hear me what you i mean you
15:28heard me say this over again it's a sort
15:29of it's a it's a repeating pattern which
15:31is for those who want to show up better
15:33in the lives of others
15:35which is i see being healthy as a
15:37service to others
15:38i see being a better listener being a
15:40service i see everything in terms of
15:41service to others there are benefits to
15:43you as well of course
15:45but i i think we've neglected for
15:48decades
15:50the socialness of our animal and social
15:52media and cell phones and and the
15:56ubiquity of those technologies have
15:58complicated our ability to be human
16:00um
16:01there are others who comment on this as
16:02well brene brown talks about this
16:04where we have a young generation
16:07that has mistaken vulnerability and
16:09broadcast
16:11right
16:12where
16:13you sit in your room
16:15by yourself
16:16put your phone on record
16:19and make a video of yourself crying
16:21because of the loss of a relationship
16:23and then posting that on instagram or
16:26snapchat or youtube or
16:28tick tock or whatever your
16:30media of choices
16:31and
16:32the hashtag is just being vulnerable
16:35right and there's nothing vulnerable
16:36about that you're by yourself
16:38broadcasting to the world live or
16:40videoed it doesn't matter
16:43do that exact same thing
16:45with the person you hurt
16:48that is way more difficult
16:50don't leave a voice memo saying hey i'm
16:52really sorry just taking accountability
16:55call them or go visit them and look them
16:57in the eye and say that exact same
16:59sentence that you just left a voice memo
17:00for
17:01that's vulnerability that's really hard
17:04and requires practice and we avoid it
17:07because it's difficult
17:08we avoid it because it's uncomfortable
17:11we choose broadcast not because it's
17:13better it's because it's easier
17:15and then mistake the two
17:17and so
17:18the reason to learn to be vulnerable is
17:20not for ourselves it's for our service
17:22to others and i talk about this all the
17:23time which we've confused these things
17:25and once again going back to what we're
17:27talking about before we've weirdly taken
17:30these very pro-social activities and
17:32made them selfish
17:34like go us
17:38my biggest pet i'll give you my biggest
17:39pet peeve and i've talked about this one
17:40before but it drives me nuts
17:43i was at this me i was in this meeting
17:44once
17:45and there was a
17:46woman next to me who was this big timey
17:48yoga instructor apparently
17:50and the entire meeting was a
17:53big group of us she was on her phone
17:55under the under the desk under the table
17:58and i sort of sneaked over a look and
18:00it's not like she was like there was a
18:02family member in hospital and she wanted
18:03to just you know stay in touch
18:05she was on social media i could see
18:07right
18:08and at one point the conversation at the
18:10table turned to being present
18:12and she popped up her head and said
18:14that's why i love yoga because it helps
18:16me be present
18:17of which i'm thinking you're an idiot
18:19you know
18:21and i started to realize we've confused
18:23things here which is
18:25we don't get to decide when we're
18:27present we get to practice being present
18:30but you actually are not present until
18:32someone else says you are
18:34you know
18:35you don't get to sit with a friend and
18:36be like i feel present if they don't
18:38feel it that's like me saying i'm a
18:40great listener except i'm not
18:42right i don't get to self-assign
18:44these accolades
18:46especially when they're social
18:48they can only be assigned by another and
18:50so for anyone who's ever practiced
18:52meditation there are absolutely benefits
18:54to us without a doubt
18:56and it is in those are important
18:58mental and physical health benefits of
19:01meditation and mindfulness and we should
19:03practice those for sure
19:05but there's also that
19:07what i think is the primary reason some
19:08would consider secondary reason
19:10which is if you practice meditation for
19:12example you learn to focus on one thing
19:14your mantra a sound whatever it is you
19:17learn to your breath you learn to you
19:19don't nobody you don't think of nothing
19:20you think of one thing you focus on one
19:22thing right and if something interrupts
19:24that thing you have a thought
19:27can i leave the washing machine on
19:29you know
19:30you label it a thought
19:32and you push it out of your head and you
19:33say i'll deal with it later and that's
19:35the whole the whole idea his total focus
19:38and the ability to put your thoughts out
19:39of your head to stay focused on this one
19:41thing
19:42now think about when you're sitting
19:42listening with a friend who's going
19:44through a hard time
19:45are you listening are you waiting for
19:46your turn to speak
19:48right the whole meditation practice that
19:50you've been doing is now valuable in
19:52this moment where you're focused
19:53entirely on what they're saying to you
19:56every distraction every screech of a car
19:58tire outside everybody who's talking
20:00around you you don't hear any of it you
20:02only hear what they're saying to you are
20:04entirely focused on what they're saying
20:06to you and when you have your own
20:07thoughts of advice you'd like to give or
20:09things you want to tell them oh my god
20:11me too that happened to me as well right
20:13you say nope that's not important this
20:15moment and you put it out of your head
20:16and deal with it later
20:18and at the end of that conversation your
20:19friend will say thank you i feel heard
20:21or thank you for being there for me or
20:23thank you for holding space for me or
20:25thank you for listening
20:26and those are all
20:28uh uh indications that congratulations
20:30you've been present for another
20:33and i think what gives our lives purpose
20:35is not to wake up every morning to learn
20:36meditation so that we can be present for
20:38ourselves though that is valuable
20:40what gives our lives purpose is to do
20:43these things for another
20:45there's nothing wrong with doing things
20:46and enjoying the benefit of those things
20:48yourself by all means
20:50but the sense of the deep feeling sense
20:52of purpose and meaning to one's life or
20:54to one's work only
20:56comes when those things are for another
20:59and in my view primarily for another
21:02where our benefit is secondary
21:04you can't have equal there's no such
21:06thing as equal because at one point one
21:07of those things will have to be
21:08sacrificed for the other and do you
21:10sacrifice your spouse's love so that you
21:12can stay in love or do you sacrifice
21:14your comfort do you sacrifice as your
21:16girlfriend boyfriend's spouses
21:18comfort so that you can be better or do
21:20you sacrifice your comfort so they can
21:21feel better that's an obvious it's
21:23obvious well it's the same here it's the
21:25same analogy which is i choose to
21:27sacrifice my my happiness my joy my
21:30comfort my lamborghini
21:32in this moment not forever but in this
21:34moment
21:35for you
21:36for you my employee for you my friend
21:40you know
21:41um i will delay
21:43so that you can have and that's where
21:45the joy and love of business
21:47relationships friendships come from
21:50you know there's a great irony in all of
21:52this which is to sacrifice for another
21:55really is the most beautiful thing we
21:57can ever do i mean that's kind of what
21:59love is it's sacrificing for another
22:02um and all of these things whether it's
22:06learning to be a better communicator
22:08learning mindfulness and meditation
22:09being in shape if you can translate
22:11those things in for another
22:13all of those things start to have a
22:15higher purpose
22:16in the case of health doing it for
22:18another you're saying that it would be
22:20so that i can be here longer for my
22:22family would be a much more joyful if i
22:24had children for example sure
22:27as long as it's real
22:28it can't be generic you're right it
22:30can't you just cut you can't just put it
22:32out there just so it's fills the you
22:34know
22:34mad libs and you filled the gap yeah
22:36yeah you know it's gotta you gotta
22:37actually feel it that that ad actually
22:39is the purpose i'll give you one then so
22:41part i do think about this and i thought
22:42about this last night when i was in the
22:43gym was in part i think i work out
22:45because i want to be healthy and in
22:47shape for my for my girlfriend like i
22:49want to be i want our relationship to be
22:51good i want us to be able to be active
22:52together i want her to be
22:55attracted by me when i'm naked you know
22:57like and i i had a debate with my team
22:59as to like whether that's a noble reason
23:02to work out
23:03and should we have a feel and obligation
23:06or whatever to be in shape for our our
23:08other half
23:09i think to be healthy for our her for
23:11sure but you think the aesthetic stuff
23:12is a bit i think it's fine i mean i
23:14think the aesthetic stuff is about
23:15confidence right which is i'm sure
23:17she'll love you
23:18even if you're chubby you know i'm sure
23:20she'll love you even if you don't have a
23:21sex pack you know
23:23but if it makes you feel confident
23:26then
23:27it's like people have nose jobs you know
23:28like somebody says you can't have a nose
23:30job why are you well if it makes them
23:31feel better about themselves then
23:33how can we argue with it like if they if
23:34they went from being really really
23:36insecure and hiding their faces or bad
23:38teeth and they never wanted to smile to
23:40fixing their teeth and now they smile
23:41all the time
23:42like why why should we tell them they
23:44can't now of course there's a line
23:46getting addicted to plastic surgery is
23:48something different and there is a line
23:50but you know getting your teeth done or
23:52getting a nose job to make yourself feel
23:54better is
23:55it's fine if it builds your comfort so
23:57if it builds your confidence and then
23:59and it's a and you're doing it in a
24:00healthy way
24:01you know
24:02then you know it's like how can somebody
24:05argue that you shouldn't be exercising
24:07so it looks good now again there is a
24:08line there are some people who actually
24:10overdo it where if they stop exercising
24:12they gain a tiny bit of weight they
24:14actually spiral
24:16there is a line where they're actually
24:17not
24:18building confidence they're actually
24:19building in security
24:21but some of these things don't have to
24:22be big and lofty they can be
24:23ridiculously small like so for example
24:26for me
24:26you know
24:28i'm
24:29very good at um disappointing myself
24:31like i have no problem disappointing
24:33myself right like i wake up in the
24:35morning two hours before my alarm
24:38and i'll say to myself you should work
24:40out like
24:41you're up super early you've got a busy
24:42day and you just got an extra two hours
24:44you could like use 30 minutes of that to
24:46work out get out of bed i'm like
24:49i'll sit in bed for two hours and just
24:51like read the newspaper and play wordle
24:53you know
24:55and two hours will go by and i won't
24:56work out
24:57do i have any guilt
24:59none i'm just like oh you're an idiot
25:01simon right now if i'm meeting someone
25:04at the gym
25:05at 7 30 because we're gonna work out
25:07i'll be there i won't let somebody down
25:10i'm okay letting myself down but i won't
25:11let somebody else down so for me
25:13my purpose sometimes is very in the
25:15moment like i'm doing this for them it's
25:17like you know when i when i would run
25:19you know one of the reasons i stayed in
25:21good running shape is because when i ran
25:23with my running buddy i never wanted to
25:25ruin their run if they wanted to keep a
25:26slightly higher pace i could keep it
25:29so it doesn't always have to be big and
25:30lofty sometimes it can be
25:32in the moment
25:33when you talked about awareness there
25:35and the importance of trying to become
25:36more aware about ourselves and one of
25:38the things that made you aware was that
25:39conversation with your partner yeah
25:40where they said you don't listen you're
25:42a shitty listener yeah um self-awareness
25:44what i don't know if that's a real thing
25:46but self-awareness um
25:48seems to be the foundation of
25:50personal growth right so becoming aware
25:52about something in our lives and people
25:54can read as i always say that people can
25:55read as many books as they like but if
25:57they're unable to read themselves
25:58they'll never really learn a thing
25:59for me and i i wrote that a couple of
26:01years ago and i had a guy in my office
26:03who read every single he was actually
26:04one of the people that always came in
26:05with your books right he read every
26:07single book i've ever seen him he knew
26:09every book
26:10but he never changed yeah and and he and
26:13there was things within him that he
26:15wasn't self-aware about
26:17that i believe were the reason why he
26:18couldn't evolve even though he was
26:20taking in so much information how does
26:21warning go about what are the the key
26:23ways we can go about increasing our
26:25sense of self-awareness so that we can
26:27grow and evolve
26:28such a good question you know it's kind
26:30of like people like that are a little
26:32bit like yo-yo dieters you know
26:35they do every diet but they're not
26:36healthy people
26:37i read every book but i'm not growing
26:40and
26:41you can't assess yourself
26:44you know it's like can you i mean you
26:45know this from work right which is at
26:47some point somebody's gonna have to give
26:49you feedback at some point you have to
26:52give somebody else feedback like
26:53self-assessment is a thing but it's not
26:55the only thing it's a thing it's a data
26:58point and i'm a huge believer in
26:59self-assessment but you have to have
27:01that
27:02buttressed
27:03with the
27:05assessments of others because we are
27:06blind very often we're social animals we
27:09cannot do this thing called career or
27:11life alone we're just not that smart
27:13we're not that strong we're not that
27:14aware we're just not that good
27:16as social animals we actually need each
27:18other to watch our backs and tell us
27:19what's working and what's not working
27:21and i think
27:22for somebody who goes through life and
27:23reads those books all the books you know
27:27i get good on them i guess but are they
27:29asking for help are they asking for
27:32insight from others as opposed to just
27:33reading it and agreeing with it and
27:35thinking they're making the changes
27:37i know my own personal journey and i try
27:39and i do think of myself as
27:42i i work hard to be self-aware and i
27:44work hard to
27:45self-evaluate but i i have seen in my
27:48own life my ability to truly
27:50demonstrate real
27:52awareness
27:54um and
27:56move further down the the journey and
27:59path called life
28:01as opposed to staying stagnant
28:03came when i let others help me you know
28:05we we don't build trust by offering help
28:07we build trust by asking for it
28:09because it's a vulnerable thing to ask
28:11for help
28:12will you help me is a very very very
28:14vulnerable statement can i help you
28:16not so much an act of service
28:19but the act of service really comes from
28:20allowing somebody else to serve you
28:23which it becomes this whole
28:25weird twisted circular thing
28:28you know it's like i mean i'll give you
28:30a silly example
28:33people who are bad at taking compliments
28:35right
28:37you're so smart no no no no no no right
28:41we downplay it because we're embarrassed
28:42by the compliment right but a compliment
28:45is a gift
28:46somebody's paying you a gift now if
28:48somebody handed you a present you
28:49wouldn't push it back
28:51because it would be rude
28:52right you would accept it whether you
28:54like it or not or whether it makes you
28:55comfortable or not you accept it with
28:57gratitude and then you go evaluate it
28:59later
29:00no that's an ugly sweater you know
29:03but you're still grateful for the
29:04thought and the gift and the
29:05compliment's the same and i think all of
29:06these things the willingness to you know
29:08to deny someone else the joy of giving
29:11you the gift of the compliment and to
29:13deny someone else
29:15the intensity and joy of being there for
29:16someone else again i think is selfish
29:19never asking for help is selfish
29:21asking for help is a great act of
29:23service because you allow someone else
29:24to have the joy of sacrifice and it goes
29:27backwards and forwards it's not
29:28one-sided and this is where i think
29:30great relationships work which is we
29:32take turns
29:34and
29:35sometimes it's really difficult when
29:37both of us are in need at the same time
29:39that gets really difficult good thing we
29:41have friends
29:42so
29:43you know the height of kovid
29:45um
29:47i have a couple of my friends they're
29:49sort of
29:50remarkable high performing individuals
29:52both of them
29:53and
29:54one of them called me out of the blue
29:57and she went for a long walk she says
29:59i'm
30:00doing really badly
30:02and i need to talk to you
30:04and i don't want to talk to my husband
30:06because he's doing really badly as well
30:08and i fear that if i talk to him he
30:10doesn't have the energy for me but i
30:12know he want to be there for me which
30:13will make it worse for him we're both
30:15really struggling
30:17can you have some time to talk
30:19you know
30:21and i mean
30:23a the willingness to ask for help
30:25b
30:26the willingness to
30:28understand that asking her husband for
30:30help would made it even more difficult
30:32for him it was just a very sophisticated
30:34and beautiful moment and to this day we
30:37became not only did we become closer for
30:39it but her husband and i became closer
30:41for it as well because i was there for
30:42her when he knew he couldn't be
30:44and this is why we have friends
30:46like again we can't do this alone not
30:48only are we social animals we're tribal
30:50animals
30:51you know it's more than a friend it
30:53takes a community
30:54um
30:55and i think one of the you know we're
30:57always talking about what we're eating
30:58and we're talking about what we're you
30:59know what
31:01you know what
31:02supplement we're taking or we're always
31:03talking about those kinds of things or
31:05what book we're reading
31:07but we we don't do enough talking about
31:09how we are nursing
31:11[Music]
31:12our close personal relationships how
31:14we're taking care of those closest to us
31:16and making sure that the tribe is strong
31:20um the crew is taken care of you know
31:25um and i think there's a lot more work
31:27that we can do in that arena
31:29is there practical things that you do
31:31with colleagues
31:33partners friends to create that culture
31:36of
31:37seeking feedback being open being truly
31:39vulnerable you know some people say oh
31:41we'll have
31:42we'll sit down with our diary and we'll
31:44write we'll do this exercise or you
31:46might have seen in organizations where
31:47they do like 360 feedback things is
31:49there is there practical things we can
31:51do to
31:52create a culture of seeking out that
31:53feedback and creating a safe space well
31:55the simple answer is of course um
31:57the there's no such thing as a single
32:00silver bullet it's a combination of
32:01things it's like what's the one thing i
32:03can do to happy have a happy
32:04relationship well i can't i can tell you
32:06a important thing but i can't tell you
32:07the important thing so it's the same
32:10um and everybody's a little different
32:11you know and each culture is a little
32:12different so there's there's not even a
32:14set list i can give but there's some
32:16things that people can choose from you
32:18know one thing is one of the ways we
32:20create space is how we react right if
32:22someone gives you feedback and you deny
32:23it
32:24well that's a problem
32:26if somebody gives you hard feedback and
32:28you thank them for it it's a very
32:30different
32:31environment it creates so i i i'll give
32:34you two
32:35uh examples one
32:37a lesson the other one a practical
32:38example that someone can use
32:40so i had the opportunity to visit the
32:41army rangers uh ranger school in
32:43particular and i where they make
32:46they make army rangers and one of the
32:50troubles they had a a bunch of years ago
32:53was they had these folks that they
32:54called spotlight rangers
32:56which was they were really good at their
32:58job like they were brilliant at all the
33:00tasks that were set to them strong
33:04their the teachers the instructors loved
33:06them they stood out they were great they
33:08were motivated
33:09but as soon as the spotlight was turned
33:10off when the instructor wasn't there and
33:12they were back in barracks they were
33:14[ __ ]
33:15and the only person who the only people
33:16who knew were there were their friends
33:18and colleagues because the spotlight was
33:19turned off
33:21and so the army rangers implemented a
33:24system of peer review
33:26in order to identify spotlight rangers
33:28and in now
33:30by the way they started this 40 years
33:31ago which i find incredibly advanced
33:34but to advance through ranger school you
33:36need to pass three tests you need your
33:39instructor to say yep you're ready to go
33:41to the next level you need to physically
33:43actually perform all the tasks required
33:44of you and you need to pass your peer
33:46review
33:47um
33:48and if you fail any one of those three
33:50you don't make it to the next level
33:51interesting and so that becomes
33:54an equally weighted component of
33:55advancement in the army rangers which is
33:57what kind of team player are you
33:59which i love
34:01so
34:02we implemented a system of 360 review
34:06um
34:07which was sort of a bit of an
34:08amalgamation of things we'd taken from
34:10other groups and made our own
34:13where what we
34:14the way it works is um
34:17you take the group of people you have
34:18regular interaction with and
34:21you
34:22um
34:23[Music]
34:25fill out
34:26uh your top three
34:28weaknesses
34:30or the places you believe you need to
34:31grow the most
34:34with a specific example for each so top
34:36three specific
34:37weaknesses or places you need to grow
34:39the most and then
34:41top three specific strengths
34:43or the places you believe
34:45three examples of the places you believe
34:47you've grown the most they have to be
34:48specific
34:49not like oh i'm a much better time
34:51keeper now no that
34:52got to give some specific examples
34:55they're collated and distributed amongst
34:57the team
34:58and then you come together as a group
35:00and
35:01you take turns
35:03reading them
35:04so first you read your own
35:06weaknesses
35:08and then the group has the opportunity
35:10to add to that list
35:12and here's the best part we give a
35:13little speech before the whole exercise
35:15starts that the people who are going to
35:17give you this feedback
35:19really don't want to
35:20it's really uncomfortable for them
35:22it's going to be
35:24uh
35:25they would just rather not do this
35:26exercise at all
35:28but they're going to do it because they
35:30want to see you and help you grow
35:32and so what they're giving you is a gift
35:34and so you have to receive it as a gift
35:35which means you say thank you
35:38you don't have to agree with it
35:39if you don't agree with it say thank you
35:41and just dismiss it it's fine but if it
35:44has an emotional impact if it makes you
35:46angry
35:48or frustrated
35:49it's probably true
35:52right
35:53and we go around the room and somebody
35:54tell every people can add to this list
35:56of these weaknesses in any way that
35:58there's no format they can do it in any
36:00way they want and you sit there and you
36:01look them in the eye and you generally
36:02say thank you you're not allowed to say
36:04a word except thank you
36:07then you do your strengths and you read
36:09your threat strengths and anyone can add
36:10to the list and just as you discovered
36:13you have blind spots you didn't know you
36:14have you discovered that you have
36:15strengths that you didn't know you had
36:16that you're having a positive impact in
36:18the lives of others that you didn't know
36:19you were
36:20and it's a magical experience there's
36:21usually tears at some point
36:23because it's powerful and it's a safe
36:25environment i wouldn't recommend an
36:27organization start there i would
36:29recommend you build towards that because
36:30you're going to put very senior people
36:32and very junior people in the same room
36:33and they're going to have very blunt
36:34conversations with each other and it's
36:36it's real
36:37right it's not a place to start but it
36:38is a place to get to i mean there are
36:40variations for it that one takes a lot
36:42of time you know we've we've very we
36:44varied as where everybody's responsible
36:46to do it and you can you have two people
36:47assigned and you can choose one or two
36:49people to join and you just have a
36:51smaller a smaller group when you want to
36:53do it you know and it's just for you so
36:56the others don't do it in that moment
36:57it's it's a little more efficient to do
36:59it that way um but there's no right or
37:01wrong way i really love that idea of the
37:03promotion being contingent on not just
37:05the your manager
37:07or you're the ceo
37:08believing that you are x y and z but
37:10getting peer reviewed by the colleagues
37:12around you because one of the things i
37:13noticed in my company we had and when i
37:15left there was about 700 people but
37:17i would have i would hear reports about
37:20a particular team member
37:22and the reports i would get back about
37:23their character and their conduct never
37:25matched the way they treated me
37:28so they would always treat me of course
37:30amazingly right of course right and then
37:31i'd hear that they treated this person
37:33like this and they did this and i'd go
37:35really and they'd go yeah really
37:38they were always so nice to me and
37:40obviously on that basis i would have
37:41promoted that individual and thought
37:42they were great so that's definitely
37:44something i'll implement that's called a
37:45tree of monkeys by the way it's called
37:46the tree of monkeys which is um
37:49all the people at the top looking down
37:51see only smiles but all the people at
37:52the bottom looking up see on the air
37:55oh [ __ ] yeah that makes perfect sense
38:00and again you there's you don't have to
38:01do you don't have to i mean there's
38:02again there's different cultures can
38:04accept different you know there's no
38:06right or wrong here
38:07you know and some cultures may want to
38:10implement a peer review that gets
38:12included in a promotion package but it
38:14doesn't have to be that
38:16good leadership helps there as well
38:18which is every senior person knows that
38:20they don't get the truth
38:22i mean even if your people are wonderful
38:24and fantastic
38:25people want to tell you the right answer
38:26not because they're trying to lie to you
38:27but they want to please you like you you
38:29knew the more senior you got it was
38:30harder and harder to get the truth and
38:31every senior leader knows that it's hard
38:33to get the truth every great senior
38:35leader also has spies
38:37somebody that maybe you started you were
38:39friends with that people don't know
38:40you're friends with or you came up
38:42through the ranks of the organization
38:43together but your career went a little
38:44further a little quicker
38:46you know that you have these trusted
38:48relationships that you can just get a
38:49little inside scoop as to what's really
38:50going on
38:51um
38:52also this is the hardest one
38:55is or at least it's a hard one learning
38:57to replace
38:58judgment with curiosity
39:01so somebody comes to you and says
39:02that person is a problem
39:05and all of a sudden we create a
39:06narrative based on the story that they
39:08tell us that they are a problem that
39:09person's stupid that person's lazy
39:10whatever it is now they're labeled as
39:12lazy now we treat them as lazy now
39:14everything that they do or don't do
39:16because they're lazy
39:17right
39:18um but as a good leader we want to we
39:20can take those reports
39:22we can take that hearsay
39:24we can take those direct stories that
39:26people have and we can say thank you i
39:29appreciate that i'll look into it i'm
39:31going to find out more
39:32and you go on a little journey to
39:34discover what's really happening
39:36it absolutely may be
39:38that they're lazy that could 100 be it
39:41or maybe they're distracted for a reason
39:43or maybe they're having trouble at home
39:45or maybe we've given them a job that
39:46they're ill qualified for or maybe
39:48they're having a personality conflict
39:50with somebody that they work with like
39:51the list goes on and on and on and on
39:53and the good leader
39:54is finding that out and by the way by
39:57leader i don't mean the senior person i
39:58mean any person in the organization
40:01um
40:02to replace that judgment with curiosity
40:03and i think that's what creates those
40:05environments but the reality is is with
40:07rank you do set the tone
40:10so for example um no lying that seems
40:13like a pretty simple one inside a
40:15company we don't tell lies okay phone
40:17rings
40:18your assistant picks up
40:20uh
40:21they put the person on hold and they
40:24call out to you
40:25uh
40:26david's on the phone
40:28and you go tell him i'm not here
40:31you've just sanctioned a lie
40:33you've just sanctioned a lie
40:35right and that little lie then now that
40:37person who was told to lie
40:41approvingly now they can tell a lie
40:43right because it came from the boss and
40:45all of a sudden you find out you have an
40:47organization that tells lies all over
40:49the place and some of those lies grow
40:50it happened to me once where
40:52um
40:54i had a very very senior phone call with
40:56the top leaders of a really big
40:58organization
41:00like and i forgot
41:02i just didn't show up on the call i just
41:04i have no no excuse i just
41:06i forgot to check my calendar and
41:08i forgot
41:10and
41:11my assistant at the time of course
41:14wanted to protect my reputation
41:16and she wrote to them and said terribly
41:19sorry simon had another meeting that ran
41:21long
41:23and i took her aside and it was the
41:24hardest feedback i had to give because
41:26she did it with such good intention i
41:28said i am so grateful i'm so grateful
41:29that you're protecting me and you're
41:31protecting my reputation
41:33and i want you to do that
41:35but you have to do that without lying
41:38we cannot lie you can say i'm sorry he's
41:40late i'm sorry he missed the call
41:43but you cannot say
41:45it's because he was in another meeting
41:47because that's not true
41:49and so you it's this you know i mean
41:51i'll challenge you you try this right
41:53let's look at the time right now right
41:54it's it's noon okay it's noon on i don't
41:57know what day it is monday right
41:59you and your entire crew here's the
42:01challenge for all of you okay
42:03you may not tell a single lie
42:06for the next 48 hours i mean
42:08nothing
42:10and you'll be amazed how difficult it is
42:12you'll be amazed how many little white
42:14lies we tell
42:15like
42:16the waiter comes over
42:18and five minutes before you're saying oh
42:19this food is so salty
42:22and the way it comes to goes how is
42:23everything you go it's fine everything's
42:25fine yeah thank you it's fine that is a
42:27lie
42:28right now you don't have to be mean
42:31there's nothing that says truth has to
42:33be brutal it just has to be true
42:36try for the next 48 hours and see how
42:38hard it is not to tell a single lie
42:41everyone's going to be walking around
42:42asking each other what they think of
42:43each other
42:45now simon says you've got to be honest
42:46right but there's ways of doing it right
42:48like so
42:49um do these genes make me look fat
42:54i like the other genes much better
42:55they're way more flattering
42:58right you don't have to hurt people
42:59also timing
43:02right
43:02so a true story so i went to see a
43:05friend's
43:06play
43:08and uh
43:10i i could not wait for this thing to end
43:13it was so bad
43:15and i went out you know
43:17to say hi to her after the performance
43:19and she came out
43:21she was still in costume and makeup
43:24and she knows i'm an honest broker
43:26she cares about what i she knows i'll
43:28always tell her the truth and these
43:30kinds of things and she says to me what
43:32did you think
43:34now
43:34now is not the time and place she's
43:37pumped up full of adrenaline
43:39and
43:40now is not the time for me to give her a
43:42critical evaluation of of this god-awful
43:44performance
43:45and so
43:46i sidestepped the question but said
43:48something true i said ah it was such a
43:50treat to be here to see you do your
43:52thing
43:53you know i've been wanting to see you on
43:55a stage forever and it was so much fun
43:58to see you on the stage all of that was
44:00true
44:02the next day when the adrenaline had
44:04come down and
44:05i called her up and said can i tell you
44:08what i thought about the play she goes
44:10yeah of course and i told her critically
44:12piece by piece what i thought about it
44:13and how bad it was we had a perfectly
44:15rational conversation about it didn't
44:16hurt her feelings the day before it
44:18would have really hurt her feelings so
44:20not everything has to be we mistake
44:21being honest with being honest now
44:23no i can't lie
44:25and i have to answer the question
44:27but it can answer it tomorrow when the
44:29conditions are better
44:30for that message to be received what is
44:32so insidious or what is so harmful what
44:35is the long-term negative impact of
44:37creating that culture of lying within
44:39teams and within ourselves
44:41well there's a there's this there's this
44:43psychological uh
44:45phenomenon i guess called ethical fading
44:49which can
44:50grip an organization's culture
44:53where
44:53people within that culture become
44:55capable of making highly highly
44:57unethical decisions believing they were
44:59well within their own ethical frameworks
45:01right
45:02so extreme examples
45:06are things like pharmaceutical companies
45:09who have a patent on an essential drug
45:11and in order to meet or beat some
45:13financial projection they raise the
45:15price of that essential drug 100 500
45:181000
45:201500
45:22totally legal there's nothing illegal
45:24about that
45:25really unethical
45:26right
45:27and
45:28in organizations that suffer ethical
45:30fading it almost always if not always
45:34starts from the top it's usually a
45:35leadership problem
45:37it comes from excessive amounts of
45:39pressure to hit certain short-term goals
45:41to the point where
45:43doing it ethically becomes more and more
45:45difficult
45:46and so what creates ethical fading is a
45:48series of things one of those things is
45:50we we rationalize
45:52right we look for ways to distance
45:54ourselves from the impact of our
45:57decisions we say things like it's what
45:59you got to do to get ahead
46:01it's what my boss wants
46:03um everyone's doing it
46:05it's the system i don't have a choice
46:08right
46:09um and there are ways we can
46:10disassociate our responsibility right so
46:13rationalizing is a big part of it
46:15another part is the old slippery slope
46:17you did it once you did it a little bit
46:19it worked we raised the price 10 nobody
46:21even noticed great do it again do 20
46:23this time try 100
46:25and it just keeps going and going and
46:26going and going before you have
46:27full-blown ethical fading
46:29and
46:30some of the things are excessive use of
46:31euphemisms again we're using language to
46:34disassociate ourselves from the impact
46:35of our decisions so for example you know
46:39we in the united states would never
46:41torture but enhanced interrogation that
46:43sounds very appealing
46:45right or companies would never spy on
46:47their customers but data mining yeah i
46:49know we're really into that
46:51right
46:52um
46:53we're just using different language to
46:54mask the insidiousness of our real
46:57decisions like everybody talks about
46:58managing externalities
47:00but we don't talk about the damage we're
47:01doing to the people and cultures
47:03environments of the places where our
47:04offices and factories are located why
47:06don't you have that conversation
47:08and so when you have enough of those
47:09things
47:11ethical fading shows up where you now
47:13have
47:14real issues and in the extreme you have
47:17massive scandals sometimes it leads to
47:19illegal activity but usually it's just
47:21unethical scandals
47:22and when those things happen management
47:24is dragged out and they talk to the
47:26newspaper to the law and they always say
47:27the same thing which is we broke no laws
47:29everything we do is legal no we don't
47:30have an issue with the law we have an
47:32issue with your ethics
47:34but when you don't have when it's not
47:36full-blown it just becomes an incredibly
47:37uncomfortable and a horrible place to
47:39work
47:39that increases stress to the point where
47:41you'll do damage to your own health and
47:42you'll do damage to the way you treat
47:44your family because when you're into
47:46that kind of stress to violate your own
47:48ethics
47:49at work um you're gonna come home you're
47:51gonna take it out in your your spouse
47:53and your kids you're gonna kick the dog
47:55um you're not gonna be motivated to do
47:57much except sit and sit on the couch and
47:59watch tv
48:00you know
48:01so it has it's had some pretty insidious
48:03uh impact in the lives of human beings i
48:06was thinking of it as well in terms of
48:08romantic relationships
48:10one little white lie becomes another
48:12little white lie and then a couple of
48:15you know a year passes and you're so
48:18unaligned and so far from your truth
48:19that you're resentful that you're having
48:21to keep up with this
48:23set of lies i mean we've talked about it
48:25with a guest on this podcast before one
48:26of the mistakes i made in my
48:27relationship at the start was i would
48:29say yes to things that i didn't like
48:30doing yeah so i created this culture and
48:34there's also this like expectation when
48:35my partner thought i loved doing
48:38x activity at six a.m in the morning
48:41because i'd always said yes and i'd
48:42always pretended to like it now i have
48:44to live out that life of something i do
48:46not enjoy doing because i lied at the
48:48start
48:49and the journey back is not always so
48:50easy when you've
48:51i i i've made the same mistake on the
48:54other side which is
48:56after i broke up with someone when we
48:58maintained a friendship
49:00and i started dating somebody or at
49:02least started dating
49:04but i didn't want to hurt the feelings
49:05of this person i still care about that
49:07we broke up you know a couple months
49:09before
49:10um and so if i would avoid the
49:12conversation but if she said are you
49:14dating anybody i'd say no not really
49:17and it's not because i wanted a lies
49:18because i don't want to hurt her like
49:20the intention of course is positive
49:22but what i learned later is all of those
49:24little lies
49:25meant that
49:26she was holding out hope that wasn't
49:28there and by the way it's been done to
49:30me as well i'm holding out hope that's
49:32not there because someone didn't want to
49:33hurt my feelings and i would rather just
49:35have the uncomfortable conversation
49:37are you dating somebody you are
49:39okay well that hurts but i can heal
49:42i can move on
49:44and you know again
49:47this young
49:48generation because of all the reasons
49:49we've talked about
49:51and more
49:53seems to exhibit
49:55the traits of being very conflict
49:57avoidant
49:58very uncomfortable with uncomfortable
50:02that has some
50:06impact that are
50:08sometimes
50:09funny
50:10quote unquote but always
50:13tend to make somebody feel more lonely
50:15so for example and i've seen this happen
50:18i've heard about these stories so many
50:20times
50:21a young employee
50:23who
50:23may feel they're in line for a raise
50:26but it's so uncomfortable to go to their
50:28boss
50:29and ask for a raise
50:31that they just quit
50:33that they would rather quit and have an
50:34uncomfortable conversation
50:36and then
50:37sometimes
50:39it is followed by a
50:40an angry email that says i'm undervalued
50:43you don't appreciate me you underpay me
50:46you know
50:48and and i've i've heard it happen so
50:50many times where
50:51the leadership is like
50:53what we would have happily
50:54like i'm sorry we were either planning
50:56on giving you a raise we'd happen to
50:58give you a raise you know and
51:00it's really uncomfortable to walk in
51:02your boss's office and be like hey i'm
51:03working really hard can i have a raise
51:04please now the time you do get to quit
51:07is when you've had this conversation
51:08four five six times and you've seen
51:10nothing and had no feedback and had no
51:11impact then absolutely you quit and
51:15absolutely you say you undervalue me you
51:16under appreciate we've under under
51:18appreciate me we've had this
51:19conversation five or six times then it's
51:21their fault
51:23because they had all the information
51:25but again it's really funny how many
51:27young kids would were they they would
51:29rather quit than have a difficult
51:30conversation or they'd rather break up
51:32than have a difficult conversation or
51:34worse they'd rather ghost someone than
51:36break up with them
51:38because it's really uncomfortable to
51:39have a fight and a breakup
51:42and call each other names
51:44it's much easier to just turn off all
51:46the social media un unfollow everywhere
51:49i know we've been dating for six months
51:51but i'm just going to now ignore every
51:53text ignore all your calls and think
51:55about it from the we talk about service
51:58think about the service or disservice we
51:59do the other person for their their
52:01point of view
52:03it's like you got in a car accident it's
52:05like you were just killed it's like you
52:07just disappeared off the planet that is
52:09trauma
52:11because you're uncomfortable to have an
52:12uncomfortable conversation you would do
52:14that to someone another person so
52:15service goes both ways which is i will
52:19make myself
52:20uncomfortable and have a difficult
52:22conversation even if i bumble it and
52:24screw it up and it ends up being a
52:25screaming match
52:27because that is a better option
52:29than traumatizing a person where they
52:30have to believe that i've first of all
52:33that i've died because they can't get
52:34hold of me in the panic and then when
52:36they realize i'm alive because they see
52:38me on instagram
52:39that now i've destroyed their
52:41self-confidence
52:44how dare somebody do that to another
52:45human being because you're just a little
52:46uncomfortable of having an uncomfortable
52:48conversation where we can help
52:50is we can teach people how to have
52:51uncomfortable conversations that is a
52:53skill set
52:55we don't teach leaders how to have
52:56uncomfortable conversations we don't
52:58teach students how to have uncomfortable
52:59conversations we don't teach you know we
53:01can teach these things all over the
53:03place
53:05and i think it's i think it's a big
53:06gaping hole in curriculum we teach you
53:09know maths and we teach english but we
53:11don't teach social interaction we don't
53:13teach listening we don't we don't teach
53:15how to have uncomfortable conversations
53:16we don't teach how to give and receive
53:18feedback
53:19you know now you tell me which is going
53:21to be more valuable for the rest of your
53:23life how to have a difficult
53:24conversation or trigonometry
53:27yeah
53:28and shouldn't we be you know isn't this
53:30shouldn't we be preparing people for
53:32life
53:35i had a few words to say about one of my
53:36sponsors on this podcast as the seasons
53:38have begun to change so has my diet and
53:41um right now i'm going to be completely
53:43honest with you i'm starting to think a
53:44lot about
53:46slimming down a little bit because over
53:48the last couple of probably the last
53:50four or five months my diet has been
53:51pretty bad um and it started to show a
53:53little bit really over the last two
53:55months i go to the gym about 80 percent
53:56of the time so i track it with 10 of my
53:58friends in a whatsapp group and this
54:00tracker online that we all use together
54:02we call it fitness blockchain and i'm
54:04currently at 81
54:07so 81 of the days i've done a workout in
54:09the last 150 days right so i'm going to
54:13the gym about six times a week
54:15that's been a little bit impacted by the
54:17derivative live tour but i'm trying to
54:18stick to it
54:19and so one of the things i'm doing now
54:21to reduce my calorie intake and trying
54:23to get back to being nutritionally
54:24complete and all i eat is i'm having the
54:28heel protein shake thank you hill for
54:30making a product that i actually like
54:31the salted caramel is my favorite i've
54:33got the banana one here which is the one
54:34my girlfriend likes but for me salted
54:36caramel is the one
54:39on that point of that new generation in
54:41the workplace and how they're they're
54:42exhibiting traits of being a little bit
54:44more cowardly
54:46in terms of having those difficult
54:48conversations you made a video about
54:50millennials in the workplace that did
54:51probably hundreds of millions of views
54:53yeah i remember seeing it on facebook
54:55maybe five years ago and it i think it
54:57had 50 million views on that one video
54:59but across youtube it's got tens of
55:00millions of views on many many different
55:02videos
55:03but i'm thinking now about that new
55:05generation that you've described that
55:06younger generation that gen's their
55:07generation that are emerging into the
55:09like postcovid world
55:12what is the workplace for them what how
55:14do i as a leader make sure that if i'm
55:16hiring gen z and i've got a couple even
55:17in this room that work in my company
55:20what have we got to know about them and
55:22do to make sure that they thrive stay
55:23motivated and achieve their goals
55:27this is my own bias
55:30i don't like the conversation
55:31of
55:33strengths and weaknesses
55:36um you know it's the famous question you
55:37know in an interview what's your biggest
55:39weakness well i'm a perfectionist you
55:41know
55:42uh
55:43i don't like the conversations of
55:45strengths and weaknesses because
55:47strengths often have liability
55:50i'm really confident okay in the wrong
55:52context you're arrogant
55:54right
55:54but weaknesses also have
55:57silver linings so for me i'm chronically
55:59disorganized i'm terrible right every
56:02system app
56:04works for like a week and then i'm back
56:05to being disorganized
56:07is that a good thing or a bad thing now
56:08for years i used to beat myself up for
56:09it and say it's a bad thing it's a
56:11terrible weakness but the reality is
56:13it's context so i was as a young
56:15entrepreneur i was at this networking
56:16event
56:17and i met this guy who's like really
56:20impressed with what i had to say with my
56:21pitch and he's like simon we have to do
56:22work together here's my business card
56:24call me let's do this
56:25and i lost the business card basically
56:27as soon as he gave it to me so anybody
56:29who was organized would be sending a
56:30text from the taxi or at least sending
56:32an email the next day not yahoo over
56:34here i lost the business card there was
56:36no way for me to find out what this
56:38important piece of business would have
56:39led to because i lost the card
56:41two weeks later i found the business
56:42card at the bottom of a briefcase
56:44so i emailed him and said hey remember
56:46we met two weeks ago you know i'd love
56:48to reconnect and see if we can work
56:49together still he wanted to work with me
56:50more because he thought i was busy
56:54so strength or weakness the answer is it
56:56depends now in general yes it is a
56:58weakness it's a liability and it causes
57:00me great stress but not always is the
57:02point and so yes it's important for us
57:05to understand our characteristics
57:07that we exhibit of which some of them in
57:09the con in certain contexts are huge
57:11strengths and some of the exact same
57:13characteristics in the wrong context are
57:14huge weaknesses
57:15right so it's very it's we have to be
57:18very careful when we label people or
57:20generations as being strong or weak
57:21because the answer is it depends
57:25okay so that's the preface so we talk
57:27about this young generation
57:30the the gen z generation they exhibit
57:33many of the same characteristics as the
57:34previous generation but they're quite
57:36different in the sense that they're very
57:38activist right so for example in the
57:411950s and 60s people hated their jobs
57:44back then too they just went to work
57:46every day and just suffered in silence
57:48you know by the time you get to the 80s
57:50and 90s people hated their jobs but then
57:52they'd at least start talking around
57:54about it around the office saying you
57:55know this this job kind of sucks a
57:56little bit you know and then by the time
57:59you get sort of the 2000s people start
58:01speaking up to their bosses saying i
58:03think we should make it better to work
58:04here you know and now you in this young
58:07generation and they're just like
58:09they're like standing up and quitting
58:10and like and i love it right and and and
58:13they organize they're much more you know
58:15the previous generation would like
58:17hashtag tweet my discontent as i'm
58:20sitting in my uber on my way to brunch
58:22you know but this young generation gets
58:23out and organizes and comes together
58:26plus or minus it depends sometimes it's
58:29a huge strength the fact that they have
58:31that kind of energy but sometimes as
58:32we've talked about as well they also
58:34have the energy to quit instead of
58:35having an uncomfortable conversation so
58:37strength or weakness it depends and so i
58:39think the way we have to approach all of
58:40these things is with empathy which is
58:42instead of
58:43uh
58:44deciding if it's a strength or weakness
58:46to try and understand where it comes
58:47from because i can say this generation
58:50is irresponsible and will quit before
58:52they ask for a a raise
58:54or i can say
58:56why is it that they're quitting before
58:58they get a when they just need a raise
59:01what's mis what's what's what happened
59:02between a and b and that thought in
59:04those two actions you know and i'm like
59:06oh they just missed the skill set oh we
59:07can totally figure that one out that
59:09one's an easy fix so i'm not labeling a
59:11whole person or a whole generation i'm
59:12not rather recognizing that there's gaps
59:14of
59:15skills which we all have so when you ask
59:18me about any of the generations
59:20and they all have strengths they all
59:22have liabilities
59:24and depending on the time frame and the
59:25context sometimes sometimes those
59:27strengths also
59:28become old-fashioned
59:30no longer necessary you know they can
59:32still cause frustration they can still
59:33cause confusion
59:35you know we're still looking through
59:36them at our through our own prisms of
59:38our own generation i've definitely
59:39caught myself doing it you know i do do
59:42it my goodness we never did that when we
59:43were kids you know when i was their age
59:46i'm actually saying that now
59:48but um i think the the
59:51the trial
59:53the the the test
59:56is the practice of empathy which is
59:57another skill that we can teach that's
59:59missing how is this the coveted
01:00:01experiment on the workforce and the
01:00:04workplace
01:00:05so how do like business leaders or
01:00:06business owners need to adjust in order
01:00:08to
01:00:09make sure we don't
01:00:12lose people and become an
01:00:15un
01:00:16compelling unattractive place to work in
01:00:18this post-coveted era
01:00:20and also on the point you talked about
01:00:21earlier about the importance of like
01:00:22we're social animals we need that social
01:00:24connection and we're being kind of we're
01:00:25optimizing that out of our lives it
01:00:27feels to me like this remote working
01:00:29thing has has exacerbated the
01:00:31issue because we're you know for young
01:00:34people you know i think that the office
01:00:36is one of the few institutions we have
01:00:38left where we are in person we no longer
01:00:40get dating we do that on apps that's
01:00:42right food we don't go to restaurants
01:00:43anymore we just order ubereats and our
01:00:45work they're telling us is going to be
01:00:47done from zoom i'm like what do we have
01:00:48left they're lonely
01:00:50we're going to be lonely
01:00:52and it's not a coincidence that we see
01:00:53rising rates of depression anxiety
01:00:55suicide you know especially in younger
01:00:57generations so
01:00:58you know
01:00:59it's not causal but it's there's
01:01:01definitely correlation
01:01:02you know it reminds me of when um
01:01:05and i'm old enough for this some of your
01:01:06listeners are not but i remember when
01:01:08the internet showed up
01:01:12and e-commerce started
01:01:14and i remember some of the people who
01:01:16are really into the tech
01:01:18running around thinking this is the
01:01:19death of bricks and mortars they will
01:01:20never be stores again
01:01:22and now amazon opens stores and
01:01:25rent the runway open stores and
01:01:27turns out it's
01:01:28the extremes are not great places you
01:01:30know it's not the death it's live
01:01:32alongside they become different animals
01:01:34they become different reasons we go to
01:01:36shops not to get the best deal
01:01:38you go to you go to you go to websites
01:01:40to get the best deal
01:01:42you go to shops because it's fun
01:01:43you go to shops to try stuff on you go
01:01:46to shops because it's an activity
01:01:47because we our hunter gatherer instincts
01:01:50we like foraging and looking for things
01:01:52it's entertainment
01:01:54we enjoy the service aspect you know
01:01:56it's with our friends sometimes it's not
01:01:58about the shops at all it's just a place
01:02:00something to do with our friends it
01:02:02plays a different role
01:02:04and the smart retailers know that
01:02:07and so when we talk about work it's the
01:02:08same
01:02:09it's the death of the corporate
01:02:10headquarters the death of the office i'm
01:02:12like
01:02:13is it though
01:02:15you know
01:02:16the reality is
01:02:17this is going to be somewhere in the
01:02:18middle and i think one thing with all
01:02:20the predictions about what the future of
01:02:22work looks like i think one thing we can
01:02:23be absolutely sure of is there'll be
01:02:24more flexibility
01:02:26where
01:02:27you know where it used to be hey boss
01:02:29can i take off next friday can i work
01:02:31from home next friday i have to stay
01:02:33home for whatever right
01:02:36becomes emailing in the morning saying
01:02:38i'm working from home today and
01:02:39everybody's just fine with it
01:02:41you know
01:02:42introverts liking work working from home
01:02:44extroverts like working at the office
01:02:45but at the same time sometimes
01:02:47extroverts should stay home because
01:02:49they can get more work done and
01:02:50sometimes introverts need to come to the
01:02:51office because they need to connect and
01:02:53and and we want you to be a part of the
01:02:54culture and so
01:02:56i don't think you know making any
01:02:58predictions about what it will look like
01:02:59i think is a little foolish at this time
01:03:02we know it'll be
01:03:04some sort of amalgamation we know it'll
01:03:05be more flexible and probably every
01:03:07office will be slightly different and
01:03:09it'll fit whatever their culture is
01:03:12and i think the office environment will
01:03:14become one of the selling selling things
01:03:16which is if somebody really hates this
01:03:18rfis environment they'll find another
01:03:19company where they like the office
01:03:20environment
01:03:21but i think what's really interesting
01:03:23about the great resignation what's being
01:03:24talked about less
01:03:26and the great resignation is sort of the
01:03:28reasons for it some people talk about
01:03:29the government checks that we've gotten
01:03:31that runs out so that's not the main
01:03:33reason for it
01:03:34people talk about uh how people are
01:03:36quitting to follow their dreams you know
01:03:38i've always wanted to be an actor or a
01:03:39writer great and that is definitely a
01:03:41percentage and i
01:03:43and i love that but that's not
01:03:46those numbers aren't big enough
01:03:48i think
01:03:49what i think is more interesting
01:03:52is that the great resignation is an
01:03:54indictment
01:03:55on decades
01:03:56of substandard corporate culture and
01:03:58poor leadership
01:04:00where
01:04:01and because it's a big deal that we're
01:04:03seeing people especially at
01:04:04um front line level jobs
01:04:07which um
01:04:09where leadership used to say of them
01:04:10they should just be happy to have a job
01:04:12right
01:04:13um
01:04:14that
01:04:15those people are quitting without new
01:04:17jobs necessarily is a big deal
01:04:21and they're definitely not all just
01:04:22following their dreams
01:04:23i think it is because in the past you
01:04:26know when you ask those people how's
01:04:27work and they'd be like it's fine
01:04:30is it good no it's it's fine it's a job
01:04:34it's fine
01:04:35well why didn't you quit because the
01:04:37unknown was way scarier than fine
01:04:40and so they may do with fine and
01:04:42leadership took advantage a lot of
01:04:43corporate managers took advantage of the
01:04:45fact that they could get away with fine
01:04:47we could do the minimum because they're
01:04:49not going to leave
01:04:50they're lucky to have a job and what are
01:04:52they going to go out there and the the
01:04:53great unknown fine is fine
01:04:57and then covet happened
01:04:59and a lot of people were laid off a lot
01:05:01of people lost their jobs
01:05:03a lot of people were furloughed
01:05:05some people kept their jobs but just
01:05:06lived in fear
01:05:08and we all kind of made it out okay
01:05:10we ate
01:05:11we had food
01:05:13you know
01:05:15most people
01:05:17made it okay
01:05:19even if it was difficult they made it
01:05:21through and so all of a sudden the great
01:05:22unknown a lot less scary
01:05:26and so when you're offering me fine i
01:05:28choose unknown
01:05:29that's a better option
01:05:30in fact not only do i choose unknown i'm
01:05:32going to wait until you fix fine and i
01:05:36don't think enough companies are
01:05:38recognizing
01:05:39that the great resignation is an
01:05:41indictment that the great resignation is
01:05:43a
01:05:44wag of the finger that you have been
01:05:45getting away with substandard culture
01:05:48and poor leadership for too long
01:05:50and you better fix your stuff
01:05:52and i think the companies that will have
01:05:53the huge advantages is not the combat
01:05:56the companies that get the balance of
01:05:57in-person or or or
01:05:59or online work
01:06:01right i don't think that's what makes it
01:06:03i think the companies that get the huge
01:06:05advantage moving forward are the ones
01:06:07that teach leadership to their leaders
01:06:09that teach these human skills that we've
01:06:11been talking about that create a
01:06:13corporate environment and a corporate
01:06:14culture that i want to go to every day
01:06:16and i actually form good strong bonds
01:06:19with my new tribe with the people i go
01:06:20to work with and i'm willing to
01:06:22sacrifice and not get everything exactly
01:06:24how i want it because i'd rather be here
01:06:26and serve these wonderful group of
01:06:27people those are the companies that will
01:06:29have the huge advantage of the next
01:06:30decades or two one of the things that i
01:06:33saw in that postcode period was in my
01:06:35company in particular was
01:06:37one of the things that
01:06:38i believe and from our
01:06:40our research at the time i'm no longer
01:06:42with this company so i can kind of talk
01:06:43about it um with a bit more honesty
01:06:47in our in our questionnaires we would
01:06:49see that a lot of the reason why people
01:06:50love to come and work there was because
01:06:52of the
01:06:53the company culture right we're done
01:06:55we've gone to extreme lengths we had
01:06:56like five people that were just in
01:06:57charge of happiness called the happiness
01:06:59team
01:07:00we paid for everyone's mental health
01:07:01therapy it was a very it was the it was
01:07:03in terms of flexibility what the world
01:07:05is like now or you can decide for
01:07:06yourself when you work and then when
01:07:08covert came around we were like known
01:07:10for that in the uk like the bbc demo
01:07:12pieces this the best place to work when
01:07:13covert came around it smashed our usp
01:07:16because it and this is why i almost
01:07:18viewed it as a leveler because now
01:07:19everyone was working from their laptop
01:07:22at home in their box of shorts so now
01:07:24what i think i saw was our employees
01:07:26were going to some degree
01:07:29i can work at home in my box of shorts
01:07:30for this company or i can work home in
01:07:33my box of shorts for this company where
01:07:34they'll pay me double yeah
01:07:36and and that shift was and it was
01:07:38terrifying for us because that's when we
01:07:40started to see people leaving because
01:07:41they would go oh well this company will
01:07:43give me 30 more and i'm still going to
01:07:45be doing my to-do list at home on my own
01:07:47so why not move now
01:07:49is there truth to that in your view yeah
01:07:50of course because you mistook
01:07:52um trappings for culture
01:07:55right right now those things are good
01:07:57let's not diminish the value of those
01:07:58things
01:07:59but this this is a beautiful full circle
01:08:01we're going in from the very beginning
01:08:03of our conversation which is to what end
01:08:05to what end like what are we doing this
01:08:07in service too what's the bigger thing
01:08:10that was missing and that was missing
01:08:12100 and that's that's
01:08:14that's where cultures become magic
01:08:17they're fun
01:08:19like you know the number of companies
01:08:20you and i have both visited that have
01:08:21you know flat screens everywhere amazing
01:08:23design freeze free lunch
01:08:26you know
01:08:26we had a slide yeah yeah you have a
01:08:28slide like cool you know now is somebody
01:08:31going to turn down a better paying job
01:08:32to keep that no
01:08:34you know
01:08:35but if you give them the opportunity to
01:08:37contribute to something bigger
01:08:38themselves
01:08:39would they turn down a better paying job
01:08:40now
01:08:41yes
01:08:42right and so i think
01:08:45it's probably driven by the whole
01:08:46dot-com tech culture
01:08:48um
01:08:50but it's it's you know because tech
01:08:51companies largely are that sort of
01:08:53ridiculous
01:08:54bright color slides in every office you
01:08:56know which is fun don't get me wrong
01:08:57it's fun
01:08:59um but that that's not that's not
01:09:01cause
01:09:02that's not purpose
01:09:04uh and great cultures are are are
01:09:07organized to advance something bigger
01:09:09than themselves they're not just fun
01:09:10places to work you know the thing i
01:09:12think we did wrong is i think we asked
01:09:14people what they wanted yeah so they
01:09:16said things like
01:09:17a bar yeah a basketball hoop whereas
01:09:21as you've as you're clearly alluding to
01:09:23here you can't ask people for culture
01:09:24like in that regard you can't ask people
01:09:26for to all
01:09:28name the collective cause because
01:09:30they'll all say different things correct
01:09:32you have to you have to offer them a
01:09:33cause to join yeah that's one of the
01:09:34reasons they join the companies because
01:09:35they believe in the cause
01:09:37not just because it's a a job i want to
01:09:39do
01:09:40um you know henry ford famously said if
01:09:42i asked people what they wanted they
01:09:43would have said a faster horse
01:09:45you know this is where
01:09:46folks like steve jobs who's given
01:09:49too much credit for being able to
01:09:50predict what people want is totally not
01:09:53true
01:09:54it's he had a cause and he simply made
01:09:56products that brought that cause to life
01:09:58which is
01:09:59to give people
01:10:00the power
01:10:01to stand up to big brother
01:10:04that's it
01:10:05and we develop technology to empower
01:10:06individuals
01:10:08that's it
01:10:09you know
01:10:10and so those who came to work there
01:10:13they recognized that they were a part of
01:10:14a revolution the computer revolution
01:10:16they constantly talked about it as the
01:10:17revolution then they invented itunes
01:10:19which more than the ipod revolutionized
01:10:22the music industry turned it from an
01:10:23album culture to a song culture
01:10:25let us make music portable
01:10:28you know um and that was the music they
01:10:31referred to as the music revolution
01:10:33um
01:10:34and
01:10:36and you carried a banner you know and
01:10:38you sacrificed for it was it a great
01:10:40place to work it was a hard place to
01:10:41work
01:10:43but it was worth it and that's the
01:10:45question are the sacrifices worth it and
01:10:47sometimes we
01:10:49we
01:10:50hide
01:10:51the pain or the difficulties or the
01:10:53strains or the stresses with all the
01:10:55silly fun stuff which is a salve let's
01:10:58be honest i mean it does work to some
01:11:00degree
01:11:01but not all
01:11:02stress is bad you know you know i i i
01:11:05joke
01:11:06you know
01:11:08often
01:11:09you know when we work hard for something
01:11:10we love it's called passion
01:11:13we work hard for something we don't love
01:11:14it's called stress now in both cases
01:11:16you're working hard you know what's the
01:11:18difference what's the difference between
01:11:20you know
01:11:21doing something you love and you work
01:11:23late hours and you sacrifice your
01:11:24relationships and you sacrifice your
01:11:25family but you look at and say
01:11:27ah it was hard but it was worth it
01:11:30you know versus losing all those things
01:11:32and all you do is get a lamborghini at
01:11:33the end you know it's like was it worth
01:11:35it i'm like ah not so sure i'd do that
01:11:37again
01:11:38you know
01:11:39um
01:11:40and so i think that's what that's what
01:11:41purpose and cause provide us is they
01:11:43give us a reason for the sacrifice
01:11:44that's what love gives us because it's
01:11:46the reason for the sacrifice that's what
01:11:48children do they give us the reason for
01:11:49the sacrifice your life will profoundly
01:11:50change when you have a child is it worth
01:11:52it yes
01:11:54is it easy no every person i've ever
01:11:56talked to who has children
01:11:58say it's the most difficult thing
01:11:59they've ever done
01:12:01and if you ask them if it's worth it
01:12:02they will say yes
01:12:04that doesn't go together
01:12:05you
01:12:06know when i think about even this
01:12:09podcast and setting
01:12:11purposeful goals for what we're doing
01:12:13here
01:12:14we definitely fell in the trap of being
01:12:16like i think a lot of people do you get
01:12:17consumed in the charts oh my god we're
01:12:18number one
01:12:19right for now for now yeah and then you
01:12:22scratch your head and go well then what
01:12:23what next what's sake what's a more
01:12:25worthy more purposeful goal for us to
01:12:28have as a team when we're building
01:12:29something like this podcast because it's
01:12:31so easy to get you know caught up in
01:12:33we've been born in the charts and sure
01:12:35and that does drive you to some extent
01:12:36yeah it seems to be a a reason whether
01:12:39it's a a vapid one or whatever
01:12:42but what is a better
01:12:43more worthy purposeful goal to set
01:12:46okay so let's take a step back uh-oh
01:12:49can you interrogate me no
01:12:51what was the reason you did episode one
01:12:54um
01:12:55plentiful i'm gonna give you all of them
01:12:57i'm very honest as well
01:12:58thought podcasting as a medium would be
01:13:00a big opportunity i thought that was
01:13:02would be a really effective medium of
01:13:03communication when that's growing
01:13:05opportunity for what to
01:13:07grow my personal brand okay i'm going to
01:13:10give you all of the reasons even the
01:13:11selfish ones okay
01:13:12number two
01:13:14i
01:13:15find a thrill and deeply compelling and
01:13:17liberating for others to talk about
01:13:20things and be honest in a way that most
01:13:21people aren't usually honest so in the
01:13:22first episode i talk about things like
01:13:24masturbation
01:13:25and mental health problems as a ceo
01:13:28difficulties with my family all of those
01:13:29things i find it liberating for myself
01:13:32but i know for others that listen to it
01:13:33when especially when we got um started
01:13:35to get the feedback it was equally
01:13:36liberating for them and then when you so
01:13:38episode one is a little episode one was
01:13:40more of an experiment but it's okay so
01:13:42episode yeah episode two whatever then
01:13:43it was the feedback so i was doing a lot
01:13:45of other things that were doing bigger
01:13:46views my facebook videos would get 10
01:13:48million each 10 million views each but
01:13:50the feedback i was getting from the
01:13:51thousand people that were listening to
01:13:53this was deep it was profound and it was
01:13:56intense and it said things like they
01:13:58said things like
01:14:00i can relate to that um that's really
01:14:02helped me solve this problem i've had
01:14:04you've made me a big one we get is
01:14:05you've made me feel like i'm not alone
01:14:08and then going if i go to the last like
01:14:10you know if i go to more recent times i
01:14:12quit when i left my job and i was now no
01:14:15longer needed to do anything for money
01:14:16anymore in my life
01:14:18when i took stock of because there was
01:14:19about a six month or one year gap in
01:14:21this podcast which is when i was leaving
01:14:23my job
01:14:24and i took stock of my life and thought
01:14:25about the things i want to do for the
01:14:26rest of my life and this was one of the
01:14:27things that seemed to touch all bases it
01:14:29was
01:14:31enjoyable for myself i get to sit and
01:14:32learn from people like yourself it feels
01:14:34like as you said it's like a service to
01:14:35others a really profound one probably
01:14:37the most the great service i feel like i
01:14:39can do to the external world
01:14:41and it's it's money generating but to be
01:14:43honest if it makes a profit i just spend
01:14:45it on a podcast
01:14:46so uh
01:14:48yeah and that's where that's kind of my
01:14:50my thesis so okay so let's back up a
01:14:53second yeah i'm just taking on your own
01:14:55words i'm not adding anything here
01:14:57would you rather do this to be number
01:14:58one
01:15:00to grow your own brand
01:15:01or would you rather grow this would you
01:15:03rather do this to tell the truth
01:15:05so it helps others tell the truth to
01:15:07themselves and to others
01:15:10number two
01:15:12obviously yeah and so your podcast
01:15:15absolutely has purpose
01:15:16and so when you start recognizing that
01:15:19we do this
01:15:21we do this to tell the truth so that
01:15:23others can be honest with themselves and
01:15:25others
01:15:26in a way that they struggle to find
01:15:29anywhere else
01:15:32and if we're number one for a period of
01:15:34time amazing
01:15:36but if we're number two we'll still do
01:15:37it with number four we'll still do it
01:15:38everyone know the term will still do it
01:15:41because there's a reason to do this
01:15:42that's bigger
01:15:44now if
01:15:45the numbers are steadily declining and
01:15:46no one's listening
01:15:48then maybe we're doing something wrong
01:15:50to spread our message maybe we've gone
01:15:52off base maybe we're maybe we're not
01:15:53telling the truth like we used to we
01:15:55need to reevaluate if we're still
01:15:56fulfilling our purpose or maybe the
01:15:58manner or medium that we're using is no
01:15:59longer relevant
01:16:01so you know because things change in
01:16:03time too
01:16:05so that's why the metrics do matter
01:16:08but the absolute of the metrics don't
01:16:09matter the trend of the metrics matter
01:16:13and so you do have purpose for this and
01:16:15that
01:16:17means you have to practice that kind of
01:16:19truth telling with your team who work on
01:16:21this podcast because you have to live
01:16:24when the microphone is off the same way
01:16:25you live when the microphone is on
01:16:27and
01:16:29that starts to have a profound impact on
01:16:31you and your team so if that becomes the
01:16:33purpose rather than being number one
01:16:36maybe it gives people a reason to stick
01:16:38around here
01:16:39because
01:16:41they believe in it
01:16:42it's benefited them is there a role for
01:16:44those arbitrary goals
01:16:46is that
01:16:47are they useful to say we want to be
01:16:49number one in the united states is that
01:16:51a useful goal to set ourselves um
01:16:54alongside the sense of purpose can they
01:16:56coexist
01:16:57they can co-exist as long as you're
01:16:59as long as you recognize the reason
01:17:01right because if you become too obsessed
01:17:03with the goal
01:17:04at the sacrifice of the cause like there
01:17:06is a hierarchy the cause comes first
01:17:09because the goal comes first
01:17:11you can look i know authors
01:17:14who and i'm sure you know i'm sure
01:17:15there's ways to do it in podcast as well
01:17:17but like i know authors who are number
01:17:18one amazon bestsellers well that's
01:17:20because you can game the you can game
01:17:22the algorithm you just have all your
01:17:23friends buy a book on the same hour
01:17:24because it's calculated hourly and
01:17:26congratulations you can't be
01:17:28a number one amazon bestseller with the
01:17:30worst book in the world it exists you
01:17:32can do it i've seen it
01:17:33there are companies that
01:17:35you can buy
01:17:37a new york times bestseller
01:17:39like they know how to game the new york
01:17:41times algorithm and they buy books
01:17:42across the country basically you buy the
01:17:44books and they buy them on your behalf
01:17:47so and if
01:17:48and i've had an opportunity to look at
01:17:50the publishers
01:17:51like look at the publishers computers
01:17:53where you can see any book we can track
01:17:54any book book sales and they've showed
01:17:56me they showed me how the trend works
01:17:58that you can tell who game the system
01:17:59and there are some very famous authors
01:18:01that i will not mention on this podcast
01:18:04who i know for a fact because i looked
01:18:06at the the
01:18:07that they brag about how they're new
01:18:10york times best sellers well it's
01:18:11because they paid for it they bought all
01:18:12those books themselves right you can
01:18:14game all these systems and if you're too
01:18:16obsessed
01:18:17with the number because you think the
01:18:19number is what gives you credibility
01:18:20then it goes back to ethical fading
01:18:22again then the pressure becomes
01:18:23overwhelming and you start doing things
01:18:25that have nothing to do with the podcast
01:18:27or the cause and only have to do with
01:18:29advancing the number so you can go
01:18:30around telling people you got the number
01:18:33right
01:18:34great good for you you know and
01:18:36you know i don't
01:18:38it's not how i choose to build my
01:18:40business or live my life you know
01:18:42but
01:18:43i think what's more fun is to be
01:18:45surprised
01:18:46which is is it okay to be driven to be
01:18:48number one as long as you're doing it
01:18:50second and the pud and the and the cause
01:18:52comes first sure if that's your thing
01:18:55um
01:18:56but just be prepared to answer what what
01:18:58next
01:18:59you know because you you can't be number
01:19:00one forever i love it when companies say
01:19:02i'm number one or i've got the number
01:19:03one podcast and you heard i always say
01:19:05for now
01:19:06for now like that stuff doesn't last
01:19:09even if it's 10 years it still won't
01:19:10last
01:19:11right
01:19:12quick one we bring in eight people a
01:19:14month to watch these conversations live
01:19:17here in the studio when we're here in
01:19:18the uk and when we're in la if you want
01:19:21to be one of those people all you've got
01:19:22to do is hit subscribe
01:19:24what are you working on at the moment
01:19:25simon because you're
01:19:27you're known for writing amazing books
01:19:28and delivering amazing content what are
01:19:30you working on what's what's compelling
01:19:32you at the moment what's your why
01:19:34well my why is to inspire people to do
01:19:36the things that inspire them so to each
01:19:38of those so that each of us can change
01:19:40our world for the better that is the the
01:19:41foundation of everything that i do and
01:19:44and that's the test
01:19:46through which i
01:19:47run everything that i will do like does
01:19:49this inspire people to affect some sort
01:19:51of change or perspective
01:19:54um
01:19:55why does that matter to you
01:19:58it's not that it matters to me it's
01:19:59that's who i am
01:20:00it's like that's core to my being like
01:20:02you're why is courtier being my wise
01:20:03court of my being that's my personality
01:20:05it's what wakes me up every day it's
01:20:07what fulfills me it's what fills me as
01:20:09well
01:20:10so and then i have my cause my just
01:20:12cause which is you know my why is where
01:20:14i come from
01:20:15my cause is where i'm going
01:20:16and my cause is to create a world in
01:20:18which the vast majority of people wake
01:20:20up every single morning
01:20:21inspired to go to work
01:20:23feel safe wherever they are and then the
01:20:25day fulfilled by the work that they do
01:20:27you know that if you're going to put
01:20:28stress into something that you get to
01:20:30enjoy the fruits of your own labor you
01:20:32know building something and looking at
01:20:33and say i helped build that you know
01:20:35that's a beautiful thing
01:20:37and so
01:20:38any work that i do is always to advance
01:20:40that cause so there's a bunch of things
01:20:42that i'm doing
01:20:43some of which will work and some of
01:20:44which will fail um i started a
01:20:48my own imprint with penguin random house
01:20:50oh really called optimism press amazing
01:20:52where i'm looking for the people or
01:20:54ideas that i believe need to be shared
01:20:56that help move
01:20:57uh the needle and advance towards that
01:20:59cause
01:21:00and so we've published
01:21:02four books so far we have two coming on
01:21:04the way
01:21:05which is really exciting
01:21:07uh how to make a plant love you
01:21:09trust first
01:21:11the power of giving away power and our
01:21:13newest one is called partnering
01:21:15and they all have a point of view about
01:21:17how to move or new ideas about how to
01:21:20advance this
01:21:21closer towards this world that i imagine
01:21:22so
01:21:23um and all different takes on it which
01:21:25is really fun
01:21:26um so i have the imprint
01:21:28um i'm working behind the scenes on
01:21:30police reform
01:21:32uh which has been intense and
01:21:33fascinating and a steep education
01:21:36also looking
01:21:38um i'm doing some work to try and sort
01:21:40of figure out how to drive innovation
01:21:42inside large bureaucracies
01:21:44so i'm trying to figure out i'm working
01:21:46behind the scenes trying to work with
01:21:48some really forward-minded
01:21:50forward-minded
01:21:52really
01:21:53infinite-minded
01:21:54young ceos or at least younger companies
01:21:57to help them figure out how to build
01:22:00infinite minded companies now it doesn't
01:22:02matter if they sell it doesn't matter if
01:22:03they have a liquidity event but they're
01:22:05not driven by the sale they're not
01:22:06driven by the liquidity event they're
01:22:08driven to build a company that can
01:22:09outlast them and they're driven to build
01:22:11cultures that can withstand the test of
01:22:13time and the loss of every single
01:22:15employee
01:22:16you know that you could have an entire
01:22:18new generation come in and the company
01:22:19will survive
01:22:20um and so i really wanna i'm i'm looking
01:22:23for those companies that i think are
01:22:25worth
01:22:26supporting and helping them build
01:22:28a new kind of company for the next
01:22:29generation because i think the way we've
01:22:31been doing it for the past
01:22:3230 40 years has been
01:22:34really not helpful to the economy into
01:22:36the world and i think that we have to
01:22:38find new ways to do it in other words
01:22:40i'm putting my money where my mouth is
01:22:41i'm all the books that i've written
01:22:43about these things i'm going to try and
01:22:44get under the hood and try and help
01:22:46these companies do it
01:22:47your brilliance you know i saw it in the
01:22:49list of all the things you're doing
01:22:51you're brilliant but i also see it in
01:22:52all the work you've created i see in the
01:22:53content you put out there your
01:22:54brilliance is very obvious i sat here
01:22:56with the the guy that trained uh michael
01:22:58jordan for 15 years and then he trained
01:23:00kobe afterwards and he said that with
01:23:03our brilliance often comes what he
01:23:05refers to as like our dark side which is
01:23:07the things we struggle with and those
01:23:09and he says they there tends to be a
01:23:10relationship between our brilliance and
01:23:12our struggle or our dark side
01:23:14are you aware of what your dark side is
01:23:16in terms of the cost of your brilliance
01:23:19well i think um
01:23:23first of all i don't think i'm brilliant
01:23:25i know that sounds
01:23:27sort of like
01:23:28falsely humble but i really don't think
01:23:30of myself that way i genuinely think of
01:23:32myself as an idiot and
01:23:34and i'm not being glib at all i
01:23:37i don't really understand very complex
01:23:40things
01:23:41um
01:23:42and i have pretty bad adhd and so
01:23:45everybody thinks i'm extremely read and
01:23:47the reality is i've written more books
01:23:49than i've read
01:23:51and
01:23:52and
01:23:54i just i love the idea of reading i i
01:23:56don't i can't read i don't read i learn
01:23:58by listening and talking
01:24:00and so uh um and so very complex things
01:24:05my brain doesn't work that way and so i
01:24:08i've learned to ask lots and lots and
01:24:09lots of questions
01:24:11so that something can be simplified to
01:24:13the level that i can understand it and
01:24:14if it's simple
01:24:16and i can understand it that means i can
01:24:18repeat it and so my books are my ability
01:24:21to understand complex things by asking
01:24:23other people lots and lots and lots of
01:24:25questions so i can simplify it enough so
01:24:26that other people can understand these
01:24:27complex things too talk about biology
01:24:29and anthropology of you know all kinds
01:24:31of you know things that yes i know that
01:24:33i've oversimplified them i'm fully aware
01:24:35you know like people who criticize you
01:24:37know criticize me like this is pop
01:24:38culture you know pop science i know that
01:24:41but if i make it it's full complexity
01:24:42all i've done is written a textbook well
01:24:44that's not helpful is it
01:24:46so i don't think of myself in the way
01:24:48that you receive my work
01:24:50you know and i think that maybe the
01:24:52impact of my work may be perceived as
01:24:54genius but let us not confuse that the
01:24:56impact of the work that may be perceived
01:24:58as genius doesn't make the person who
01:24:59produced it the genius right so i i
01:25:02reject i'm flattered by but reject the
01:25:06the
01:25:07the compliment even though it's a gift
01:25:09i'm supposed to gift yeah yeah um uh
01:25:12take your gift back it has no use here
01:25:15um so when you ask me like what's the
01:25:17balance of genius genius being this
01:25:18thing off the scale all the way far away
01:25:20over there well if i don't think of
01:25:23myself or even live my life that way
01:25:26then the balance of something is
01:25:27probably a little closer to the middle
01:25:29so do i have darkness of course i have
01:25:30darkness you know uh do i find that
01:25:33darkness absolutely fascinating i do
01:25:35what is it uh
01:25:37the
01:25:38i mean
01:25:39a lot of my insecurities
01:25:42uh that i'm
01:25:43that i've dealt with some of like i've
01:25:46it
01:25:47i don't think i've ever actually said
01:25:48out loud on a podcast like this
01:25:50i might have mentioned a couple times
01:25:52scarily like people would always ask me
01:25:54um so simon what books are you reading
01:25:56or what books are in your bedside table
01:25:58well i can answer that question because
01:26:00i have a pile of about five or six books
01:26:01on my bedside table and i've read none
01:26:03of them but they've been sitting there
01:26:05for like two years
01:26:06i've read some of two of them
01:26:09i honestly don't remember the last book
01:26:10i finished
01:26:12other than my own because i had to read
01:26:13it for the book on tape you know for the
01:26:15audiobook
01:26:16um
01:26:17and so i would always answer that
01:26:19question i would name one of the books
01:26:20or i just named one of my perennial
01:26:21favorites like oh man search for meaning
01:26:23you know
01:26:25and only now i'm sort of getting
01:26:26comfortable with the idea of saying out
01:26:28loud i don't read books and not because
01:26:30i don't like them it's because i
01:26:31struggle to
01:26:33the good news is i learned how to learn
01:26:35without them
01:26:36i wish i could read because there's so
01:26:38much good stuff in them and i know that
01:26:39they go into level of depth that i
01:26:40really want to understand but there you
01:26:42go
01:26:43and i think that goes to the honesty
01:26:45thing you know i'm realizing that me
01:26:47trying to answer the question
01:26:49and avoid embarrassment
01:26:51um
01:26:52[Music]
01:26:53it's valuable for people who like to
01:26:54read books but for the people who
01:26:56struggle to read books i just made them
01:26:57feel worse
01:26:59you know and somebody pointed that out
01:27:00to me it's like every time i lied about
01:27:02i never lied they said what books you're
01:27:04reading said well this is on my bedside
01:27:05table
01:27:06um or i believe this book is important
01:27:08you know or i just picked up this new
01:27:10book which should all be true
01:27:12i just didn't read them
01:27:15that there's a group of people who also
01:27:17struggle to read for whatever dyslexia
01:27:18or add or whatever it is and and
01:27:22i'm i'm living proof that you can do
01:27:25okay without it now that doesn't mean
01:27:26you can't learn
01:27:28but you gotta find the hack
01:27:30there's a couple books i finished
01:27:32um i finished
01:27:34i finished the davinci code
01:27:39it's so good
01:27:40and it's you know why because it's
01:27:42written with really really really short
01:27:43chapters
01:27:45like three pages that's i'm the person
01:27:46who like always looks pages ahead to see
01:27:48how much i have to go and if it's like
01:27:4950 pages i'm like yeah how does that
01:27:52change how you write though if you if
01:27:53you're not a reader yourself
01:27:55when you're ironic isn't it yeah that i
01:27:57yeah it's ironic that i ended up writing
01:27:59books
01:28:00writing is a it's a it's different um
01:28:03because if it's really fun when i'm
01:28:05editing because if i'm boring myself i
01:28:07just
01:28:08cut that whole section
01:28:10and so
01:28:11the books have my sense of humor in them
01:28:12like there's little jokes in there
01:28:14because it makes me giggle
01:28:16and i write about the things that i
01:28:18think are really interesting i tell the
01:28:19stories that make me
01:28:22interested and and i can make myself cry
01:28:24with some of those stories in the book
01:28:25and i can give myself goosebumps with
01:28:26some of the stories in that book and if
01:28:28i'm doing it for myself it's probably
01:28:29working for others too
01:28:30you know um
01:28:32but i i do love ideas
01:28:35and i love
01:28:36dissecting ideas and understanding ideas
01:28:38and i really love understanding why
01:28:40things work i am a little kid at heart
01:28:42you know i want to know why
01:28:44um not as a noun as i popularized it
01:28:46would start with why but as a question
01:28:48like why is it that way i'm really i
01:28:50love that question it is
01:28:52it is a little kid question you know and
01:28:54for some reason as adults we stopped
01:28:55asking and started just blindly
01:28:57accepting and that doesn't mean i have
01:28:58to be rebellious in the question it's
01:29:00not it's not an accusation like why are
01:29:03you doing it that way
01:29:05it's genuine curiosity like why does it
01:29:07work that way
01:29:09and i love that and when i discover
01:29:11things that are
01:29:13illuminating to me
01:29:15and i'm able to explain it to my friends
01:29:17my friends can understand these things
01:29:19and the joy i see in people's faces and
01:29:22when they when i challenge their
01:29:23perspective
01:29:25then the the fun is to share it
01:29:27well i'm going to give you your the gift
01:29:29back
01:29:30of brilliance thank you the reason why i
01:29:32think i do use the word brilliance is
01:29:34because
01:29:35you meet people sometimes that have one
01:29:37of the three believe you use the word
01:29:38genius
01:29:43um if you meet people sometimes you have
01:29:45like one of the what i consider to be
01:29:46the holy trinity of like affecting
01:29:48change as an orator sometimes they have
01:29:51wisdom sometimes they're like good
01:29:52storytellers and then sometimes that
01:29:54they have the delivery but you rarely
01:29:56meet people that have all three your
01:29:57delivery in terms of when you deliver
01:29:58ideas the way you can like punctuate
01:30:01sentences and the tone of it keeps
01:30:02people incredibly engaged and i think
01:30:04you gave me
01:30:05the root cause of that when you said you
01:30:06had adhd and you're a bad reader because
01:30:08you find it hard to hold
01:30:11you find it hard for other things to
01:30:12hold your attention so you're very good
01:30:13at holding the attention of someone else
01:30:14listening and then the circuitous way in
01:30:17which you deliver a point as well makes
01:30:18incredibly engaging from a storytelling
01:30:20perspective and then the wisdom or the
01:30:22simple idea that underpins it that we
01:30:23can understand because i've sat here
01:30:24before and honestly we've deleted
01:30:25podcasts because someone comes in
01:30:27they're a genius mathematician yeah but
01:30:29when you ask them to make that complex
01:30:32math idea relevant and resonant in my
01:30:35own life it's impossible we deleted the
01:30:37episode because they're too smart to
01:30:40like to simplify for sure um but you're
01:30:43able to do that that's why your books
01:30:44are so important and that's why
01:30:46all the content you put out online and
01:30:47on your youtube channels and instagram
01:30:48is so necessary we have a closing
01:30:51tradition on this podcast where
01:30:54the last guest asks a question for the
01:30:56next guest oh cool so they wrote it in
01:30:58the story they don't know who they're
01:30:59writing it for i love that and you when
01:31:01you write your question you also don't
01:31:02know who you're writing it for but it's
01:31:03our way of all the guests talking to
01:31:04each other that's great and a long
01:31:06linear scene do i get to know who's
01:31:07asking you don't i don't okay
01:31:10what was
01:31:11the happiest moment of your life so far
01:31:16the happiest i literally can't answer
01:31:18the question it's for me it's
01:31:21my happiness doesn't exist in the past
01:31:23it's i've done many things that made me
01:31:25happy but i'm much more
01:31:28interested in what's going to happen
01:31:30next
01:31:32i'm probably better at answering the
01:31:33question what's the happiest thing
01:31:34you're going to do
01:31:36um i i'm i'm actually drawing a blank
01:31:40what is the happiest thing you're going
01:31:41to do
01:31:42um
01:31:44walked into that one didn't i
01:31:48um the happiest thing i'm going to do
01:31:51is
01:31:52actually solve some of the problems
01:31:54and or at least contribute to the
01:31:56solution of some of those problems that
01:31:57we talked about
01:31:58like i will be very happy when i help
01:32:01when i can contribute to police reform
01:32:03in this country
01:32:04i will be very happy
01:32:06when i can
01:32:08figure out
01:32:10better systems to help
01:32:13reinvent
01:32:14what modern business looks like and
01:32:16reject everything that jack welch built
01:32:19you know
01:32:20and
01:32:22disrupt
01:32:23shareholders supremacy and the way that
01:32:25we build companies now i will be very
01:32:27happy to demonstrate a momentum towards
01:32:30an entirely different direction
01:32:32um i will be very happy
01:32:35um
01:32:36if all of the sum of my work
01:32:38makes it feel like i have moved the
01:32:41needle somewhat closer
01:32:43though not final towards that vision i
01:32:45talked about of an inspired safe and
01:32:46fulfilled world ironically those sound
01:32:48like infinite games many of them yeah i
01:32:50don't believe i mean
01:32:52all of the things that will make me
01:32:54happy will be incomplete
01:32:55i
01:32:56i don't expect them to be complete what
01:32:58will bring me joy
01:33:00like when when you if let me rephrase
01:33:02the question for myself
01:33:04which is how will you know you lived a
01:33:06life worth living
01:33:07it's kind of the same question right
01:33:10and the answer will be is because
01:33:12other people will pick up where i left
01:33:14up and continue without me
01:33:16that i
01:33:17was clear enough
01:33:19my cause was compelling enough
01:33:21and the tools that i left were sharp
01:33:22enough that others figured out how to
01:33:24not only use them but make them better
01:33:26and reinvent new ones
01:33:28i will have lived a life worth living if
01:33:30i can look back and say it will keep
01:33:31going without me
01:33:33because it doesn't need me
01:33:34and that's the goal
01:33:37simon thank you
01:33:39it's a huge honor and a pleasure and it
01:33:41it's very clear why you were probably
01:33:43the most requested guest on this this
01:33:45podcast um from our from our viewers and
01:33:47you've definitely given much more than
01:33:50um i could have ever hoped for in terms
01:33:51of your generosity and wisdom to me but
01:33:53also to our listeners in this
01:33:54conversation so thank you so much for
01:33:56your generosity simon thank you it's
01:33:58it's been a joy um
01:34:00and you
01:34:01it's one of the best podcasts i've ever
01:34:04done i mean
01:34:05you are so engaging and driven your
01:34:08cause comes out clear which is you are
01:34:10so driven by the truth
01:34:12you are so compelled by the truth that
01:34:15anybody sitting here
01:34:17really wants to offer only truth
01:34:19um
01:34:21and
01:34:22it's a cause worth fighting for
01:34:24thank you i will accept the gift
01:34:28we are all looking for ways to live a
01:34:29little bit more sustainably and to make
01:34:31more conscious choices in our day-to-day
01:34:33routines so when a brand like my energy
01:34:35who i've spoken about before offered to
01:34:37sponsor this podcast i felt like and i
01:34:40knew deep down inside that i had to help
01:34:42them share their mission to create an
01:34:44even greener world it feels like there's
01:34:46not much more fulfilling than that and
01:34:48their products provide an easy and cost
01:34:50effective way to make a sustainable
01:34:51switch in your life and they've got some
01:34:53existing new products coming out that i
01:34:55can't wait to use myself and i'll let
01:34:57you know as i use those products how i
01:34:59get on so if you're a my energy customer
01:35:02at the moment let me know your favorite
01:35:03products down below in the comments
01:35:04section and if you haven't checked them
01:35:06out yet go to myenergy.com and find out
01:35:09a lot more about who they are and what
01:35:11they're doing if you're one of those
01:35:12people that wants to make a sustainable
01:35:14switch
01:35:15myenergy.com is the place for you
01:35:20[Music]
01:35:37[Music]
🎥 Related Videos
Hip Pain RELIEF! Stretches And Exercises For Lateral Hip Pain
Jenkins-Day-1|| Introduction to Continuous Integration and Continuous Deployment
How to Build the Life You Want: Timeless Wisdom for More Happiness & Purpose
Discovery 臺灣部落寶藏 第1季 信仰祭儀
Lessons Learned at Coursera – Expert Roundtable with Julia Stiglitz
Reality Transurfing Chapter 14 "Forward to the Past" by Vadim Zeland
🔥 Recently Summarized Examples
4 Steps to Master Any Complex Skill (quickly)
40 Years of Fitness Experience in Less Than 11 Minutes.
Gun Controlling Media Makes FATAL Mistake... They Have Tied Their Fate To Biden's & Gun Rights Win
GET READY! Palantir Is Officially The Next Nvidia.
Abundant Thinking: The Hidden Key to Get Everything You Want (Audiobook)