How to Build the Life You Want: Timeless Wisdom for More Happiness & Purpose
Mel Robbins2024-04-18
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💫 Short Summary
Dr. Tal Ben-Shahar discusses the five elements of happiness, emphasizing the importance of pursuing meaningful goals and achieving balance between present contentment and future aspirations. The video explores indirect paths to happiness through self-improvement in various life areas, highlighting the significance of small changes and daily habits. Antifragility and post-traumatic growth are discussed as ways to navigate challenging experiences and promote personal growth. The speaker stresses the importance of hope, resilience, and embracing difficult moments as opportunities for growth and fulfillment, ultimately encouraging viewers to take action towards a happier life.
✨ Highlights
📊 Transcript
✦
Dr. Tal Ben-Shahar discusses the five elements of happiness and their practical applications.
03:39Dr. Ben-Shahar teaches popular courses on positive psychology and leadership at Harvard.
Mel Robbins praises Dr. Ben-Shahar's ability to connect theory with real-life experiences.
The episode emphasizes the significance of setting goals and pursuing meaningful aspirations for happiness.
✦
The speaker shares their journey from unhappiness despite achieving success in sports and academics.
05:53They pursued the study of happiness after realizing that success does not guarantee happiness.
Achieving certain goals like winning championships or getting into top schools did not bring happiness as expected.
The speaker emphasizes the importance of introspection and questioning one's own happiness.
This journey led to a deeper understanding of true fulfillment.
✦
Pursuit vs. Outcome of Happiness
09:04Achievement and attainment do not lead to lasting happiness; our system is built for the pursuit, not the outcome.
Focusing on achieving goals as a source of happiness causes unhappiness.
Research shows that placing too much importance on happiness can actually decrease happiness levels.
Breaking down happiness into smaller components, like colors in a prism, allows for genuine enjoyment and fulfillment.
✦
Pursuing Happiness through Indirect Means.
12:42Happiness can be achieved through spiritual, physical, intellectual, relational, and emotional well-being.
Examples given include engaging in meaningful activities, maintaining good nutrition, continuous learning, spending quality time with loved ones, and embracing all emotions.
Pursuing these elements is likened to following the colors of a rainbow.
The ultimate goal is to become happier through indirect means.
✦
Two models of happiness are discussed - goal-oriented happiness and present-focused happiness.
17:19Having meaningful goals provides direction and purpose in life.
It is important to enjoy the present moment.
A balance between pursuing goals and appreciating the present leads to a more fulfilling life.
Goals give meaning and motivation, but their achievement alone does not guarantee happiness.
✦
Achieving happiness through self-improvement in different life areas is discussed.
21:51The importance of understanding happiness through biographies to gain insight into a happy and successful life is emphasized.
Emphasis is placed on personal growth and taking action to enhance overall well-being and happiness.
✦
Embracing the concept of experimenting with truth for personal growth and happiness.
23:36Importance of trying different ways of living and being through experimentation, even with small changes.
Focus on continuous improvement by becoming 1% happier through incremental adjustments.
Not being afraid to try new things for overall well-being and happiness.
Consistent application of small changes can lead to significant differences in happiness.
✦
Importance of Minimum Viable Intervention (MVI) for well-being.
27:20MVIs involve small changes such as one minute of meditation and short bursts of exercise throughout the day.
MVIs can have a significant impact on psychological and physical well-being over time.
Emphasis on incorporating MVIs into daily routines to promote overall happiness and well-being.
MVIs can enhance spiritual, physical, and intellectual well-being.
✦
Benefits of curiosity and relational well-being in promoting happiness and longevity.
32:51Quality time in relationships is crucial for happiness.
Loneliness is a significant factor in unhappiness, worsened by distractions and multitasking.
Single-tasking and meaningful connections are key in combating loneliness.
Distractions in the modern age hinder true togetherness and can lead to noise instead of harmony.
✦
The significance of mindful activities in addressing loneliness and unhappiness.
35:39Research indicates that journaling or discussing challenging experiences can improve happiness and overall well-being.
Writing and talking about emotions aids in understanding them, resulting in clarity and progress.
Taking action post-processing emotions, like exercising or socializing, is essential for mental health.
An example of a woman reuniting with her church emphasizes the importance of staying engaged in meaningful activities.
✦
Impact of small, consistent spiritual practice on happiness.
38:56A woman found vibrancy and wholeness by attending church for one hour a week.
Speaker's daily happiness routine includes morning meditation, quality reading, taking kids to school, and playing sports like squash.
Emphasis on the importance of small actions and rituals in daily life for cultivating happiness.
✦
Importance of Daily Habits for Overall Well-Being
42:21Engaging in activities like playing squash and pickleball, watching movies, reading, and spending time with loved ones is emphasized.
Focus on Consistent Actions Over Time
Highlighting the impact of daily habits and behaviors on long-term happiness and fulfillment.
Launch Program for Personal and Professional Growth
Information about a six-month coaching program called 'Launch' led by the speaker, offering structure, accountability, and tools for success.
✦
Antifragility concept focuses on systems that grow stronger in response to stress and pressure, contrasting resilience 1.0.
47:59Antifragile systems can be found both physiologically and psychologically, with post-traumatic growth (ptg) exemplifying this idea.
Awareness of post-traumatic growth (ptg) can lead to personal growth after trauma, in contrast to PTSD.
Research by Calhoun and others suggests that simply knowing about ptg increases the likelihood of experiencing post-traumatic growth.
Understanding antifragility can help individuals navigate and grow from challenging experiences.
✦
The importance of hope in distinguishing between sadness and depression.
50:08Depression is characterized by a lack of hope, leading to feelings of helplessness.
Understanding post-traumatic growth (PTG) can provide hope and increase the likelihood of growth.
Social media content often focuses on trauma, but more awareness of PTG is necessary.
Hope is crucial for overcoming challenges such as relationship issues or job loss.
✦
Importance of recognizing and moving through difficult moments in life.
54:01Emphasis on the bounce-back effect after grief or disappointment.
Value of understanding that hardships are a natural part of life and relationships, leading to growth and hope.
Introduction of systems thinking and viewing things as interconnected wholes.
Significance of identifying keystone habits that can positively influence multiple areas of life.
✦
Embracing Pain and Growth in Life.
59:52The speaker questions the idea of eliminating painful experiences through neuron manipulation.
Difficult experiences are important for personal growth and lead to a fulfilling life.
Traumatic events are temporary moments that are integral to the human experience.
The speaker advocates for acceptance and growth through adversity.
✦
Importance of Resilience and Overcoming Hardship.
01:02:27The speaker recounts a personal story of loss and grief, emphasizing the value of resilience in difficult times.
Through a mentor's guidance, the speaker discovers that pain is temporary and individuals possess the inner strength to push through challenges.
The discussion delves into the concept of creating lasting change and finding happiness through research and education.
Sharing personal experiences can inspire others to make positive changes and promote growth and resilience.
✦
The significance of reminders, repetition, and rituals in creating lasting change in life is highlighted.
01:06:32Reminders, such as Post-its or bracelets, are essential for keeping important things in focus.
Repetition is crucial for ingraining new habits, requiring consistent reminders and actions.
Rituals, deeply embedded neural pathways formed through repeated actions, solidify behavior changes.
By incorporating reminders, repetition, and rituals into daily life, individuals can increase the likelihood of enjoying lasting change and personal growth.
✦
Importance of rituals and repetition in forming neural pathways and creating habits.
01:10:16Rituals can lead to lasting change and support happiness and well-being.
Helen Keller's optimism and ability to overcome hardship serve as an inspiration for cultivating a positive mindset.
Recommendations to read Keller's essays on optimism and appreciation for what we have.
Dr. Tal Ben Shahar emphasizes the significance of rituals and gratitude in promoting a fulfilling life.
✦
Gratitude for Mel's impact on promoting happiness worldwide.
01:13:25Mel is commended for translating academic ideas into accessible content.
Viewers are encouraged to take action for a happier life.
Emphasis on supporting content creators by subscribing.
Recommendation to watch an episode on the formula for happiness with Sean Anker.
00:02[Music]
00:10I'm Mel Robbins I'm a New York Times
00:11bestselling author and one of the
00:12world's leading experts on confidence
00:14and
00:15motivation who was that the camera just
00:17stopped I it just went yeah I heard that
00:20why I don't know I don't know
00:23either he's also the New York Times
00:25bestselling author of eight yep you
00:27heard it eight incredible books all
00:30about happiness many of which are
00:31required reading in University cour so
00:34that's the first thing that that I
00:36learned now think that I found what
00:39maybe we should put an iPhone it right
00:41there just in case so we can keep going
00:44paradoxically actually needs two more
00:48[Music]
00:56happiness hey it's your friend Mel and
00:58thank you so much for spending some time
01:00with me today and I also want to thank
01:01you for making the decision to listen to
01:04something that could help you improve
01:06your life I think that's pretty cool now
01:08if you're new I want to welcome you to
01:09the Mel Robbins podcast family and by
01:11the way thank you for making this one of
01:13the most popular podcasts in the entire
01:16world my name is Mel Robbins I'm a New
01:18York Times bestselling author and one of
01:19the world's leading experts on
01:21confidence and motivation and I'm on a
01:24mission to inspire and Empower you with
01:26the tools and Export resources that you
01:28need to create a better life and you
01:30want to know a very important component
01:33of creating a better life that's
01:35happiness and I know that this is a
01:37topic that you love hearing about in
01:39fact every single time that you and I
01:40talk about it together you want more and
01:44today I'm going to introduce you to
01:46somebody I deeply admire he is one of
01:49the world's leading experts on happiness
01:51his name Dr Tall Ben Shahar and that
01:55name I bet you're like wait a minute I
01:57think I've heard that name before well
01:59let me tell you where you have heard it
02:00because we did an episode just a little
02:02bit ago on the science of goals and I'll
02:05link to that in the resources I will
02:06link to everything we talk about in the
02:08resources and at the very end of that
02:11episode I shared some powerful research
02:13from none other than Dr Tall Ben chahar
02:16remember that it was the research about
02:18the Olympic medalists and how they felt
02:22happier as they were training for the
02:25Olympics when they were pursuing that
02:28dream way happier when they were
02:30pursuing it than when they actually won
02:32the Medal and that part of the episode
02:35about goals and how goals are critical
02:38to happiness because your goals
02:39represent the pursuit of something that
02:42matters to you you love that so you know
02:45what I did I beg tall to join us today
02:48and he is here he is here to unpack his
02:52research and share very specific
02:54takeaways with you now tal is very well
02:57known for being Harvard University's
03:00most popular teacher like ever he taught
03:03two of the most popular courses in
03:05Harvard's history positive psychology
03:08and the psychology of leadership and
03:10today you are getting key takeaways he's
03:13also the New York Times bestselling
03:15author of eight yep you heard it eight
03:17incredible books all about happiness and
03:20you know what I love about t even though
03:22I've only just met him in real life I've
03:24been studying his work forever but what
03:25I love about him is that he has this
03:28amazing ability to bridge the academic
03:32aspect of happiness with the insights
03:34that you need to apply it to your life
03:36and today T is sharing the five elements
03:39of Happiness so let's jump in t welcome
03:42to the Mel Robins podcast thank you Mel
03:44so good to be here I am so excited to
03:47talk to you I want to just start with
03:49the beginning of your story because here
03:51you are one of the world's leading
03:53experts on the topic of Happiness
03:55something we all want to know more about
03:57but when you got to college you thought
04:00you were going to study computer science
04:03so what happened in your life that
04:05created this big pivot so I became
04:08interested in happiness because of my
04:10own unhappiness oh and um you know it
04:14started off even before uh College I was
04:17a squash player my dream as a as a young
04:21boy was to be a professional athlete
04:24initially it was supposed to be
04:25basketball but I stopped growing at
04:26about the age of five six so uh that
04:29didn't happen um but squash was it for
04:32me and I wasn't happy as a child but I
04:35would always tell myself when I become a
04:37professional when I win the national
04:39championship then I'll be happy and uh
04:43for years I was quite miserable and then
04:46I won the national championship and I
04:49was not just happy I was ecstatic right
04:52for about four hours and then again
04:54going back to where I was before the
04:56same stress and unhappiness and thought
05:00something was wrong here with my model
05:03but then I said oh no it's when I become
05:04a world champion then I'll be happy and
05:07I continue towards that and I played
05:08professionally for a few
05:10years and U then I got injured okay and
05:14I went to college and I said okay so I
05:17didn't make it in uh in in in athletics
05:22but I'll do it academically okay and I
05:24went to Harvard and uh I was a top
05:27student there and I was miserable
05:30and my sophomore year very cold Boston
05:33morning I went to my academic adviser
05:36and I told her that I'm switching Majors
05:38I was a computer science major and she
05:41said uh what to and I said well I'm
05:43leaving computer science and moving over
05:45to philosophy and psychology and she
05:47said why and I said because I have two
05:50questions first why aren't I happy
05:53second how can I become happier and it's
05:56with these two questions that I then
05:58went on to get my undergraduate degree
06:00then went to graduate school in
06:01education and organizational behavior
06:04all the time asking how can I help
06:05myself individuals couples organizations
06:09and ultimately Nations increase their
06:11levels of happiness and that was uh 30
06:13years ago wow that's quite you sound
06:16like a really intense dude no seriously
06:19like you sound like somebody that was
06:22incredibly tightly wound but that's not
06:25my experience of you right now and so I
06:27only say that because to me if somebody
06:31that is that driven and that competitive
06:34and that tightly wound can figure out
06:38first of all why you're not happy and
06:41also then figure out how to become a
06:44happier person and then translate that
06:46to everybody else that's cool because
06:49that means the rest of us can probably
06:51do it too um there's no question on my
06:53mind again after 30 years of uh work
06:56internal work external work research
06:59that there is a lot that we can do to
07:01become happier so if you go back to that
07:05sophomore you at Harvard and you're
07:08sitting there with your academic advisor
07:11and your advisor says wait what you're
07:13going to switch why would you switch and
07:15you say because I want to figure out why
07:17I'm so unhappy what did you learn about
07:21why you were so unhappy that we might be
07:23able to apply to our own lives yes so
07:25the first thing that I that I learned or
07:27that was uh you know obvious to me at
07:30that time was that success doesn't lead
07:32to happiness you know we think there are
07:33certain boxes that we need to check so
07:35for me it was winning that Championship
07:37or later getting into Harvard or
07:39becoming a top student or getting a good
07:42job and making a lot of money and we
07:45know you know all of us know that the
07:47best that these achievements can do is
07:49lead to temporary happiness a spike
07:52right but that high doesn't last so
07:54that's the first thing that that I
07:56learned now the thing that amazed me is
07:58that while we all know know that
08:01achievement attainment reaching a goal
08:04will not lead to Lasting happiness we
08:06continue to live as if it will why like
08:09why why wouldn't it make you happy to
08:11achieve something that you've worked
08:12really hard to
08:14get
08:15because our system is built for the
08:19pursuit not for the outcome so once
08:22there is the outcome there is sort of
08:24like okay check been there done that now
08:27I need something else and that's part of
08:29our nature and you know you may say you
08:31know it's it's terrible it's awful why
08:33is it that it just is you know why is
08:36the law of gravity the law of gravity
08:38and the question is how do we accept
08:40nature just like we accept the law of
08:41gravity how do we accept our human
08:43nature and then build our life based on
08:46that so if I'm hearing you
08:49correctly what you're saying is that one
08:53of the biggest things that somebody
08:54could take away from this conversation
08:56with you is that you are not hard
08:59hardwired to feel happy simply because
09:02you've achieved something that happiness
09:04is tied to pursuing it not the achieving
09:08of it yes and if you do live by the uh
09:14uh belief that achievement will lead to
09:16happiness that will cause you a great
09:18deal of
09:19unhappiness oh that's a big one in fact
09:22that is one of the main causes for uh
09:24the levels of unhappiness that we see in
09:26our world because people are focusing on
09:30on the wrong thing you know they're
09:31they're climbing up the wrong Mountain
09:33so can you break that down for us
09:36because I want to just stay on this
09:38point and highlight it
09:40because if if thinking about happiness
09:44wrong creates unhappiness like explain
09:48to us how you want us to think about
09:54happiness so happiness is important it
09:57matters just like we are a hardwired uh
10:00not to celebrate successes forever we're
10:03also hardwired to pursue happiness so
10:06it's not that I'm saying okay forget
10:07about happiness happiness matters okay
10:09however there's also research and this
10:11is um research done quite quite recently
10:16by Professor Moss ma us showing that if
10:20I wake up in the morning and say to
10:22myself I want to be happy or happiness
10:25is important for me or um it's a value
10:28for me I will actually become less happy
10:32what wait a minute really that that was
10:36exactly my reaction that's a problem you
10:38know and you know I read about this you
10:40know five years ago and I said but you
10:41know that's what I'm dedicating my life
10:43to of course happiness is important for
10:45me and yet what the research clearly
10:47shows is that um this will make you less
10:50happy so does this mean we should
10:53um kid ourselves you know say to
10:56ourselves you know I don't want to be
10:58happy wink wink I actually do you know
11:00self-deception is certainly not the path
11:02to happiness so what do we do about it
11:06well let me use an analogy that was very
11:08helpful for me in thinking about
11:09happiness imagine you go outside it's a
11:11it's a beautiful sunny day MH and you
11:14want to enjoy the Sun so you look up at
11:16the sun directly what happens you hurt
11:19yourself it burns it hurts you tear up
11:23so looking at the sun directly hurts
11:25however what if you take a prism and and
11:29you break the sunlight and then you look
11:33at what has just been broken in other
11:35words the colors of the rainbow then you
11:38can look at the the sunlight and enjoy
11:40it but you're looking at it indirectly
11:42it's the same with happiness pursuing it
11:45direct and saying I want to be happy
11:47happiness is important for me that that
11:49will make us unhappy but if I break down
11:52happiness into its metaphorical colors
11:55of the rainbow and then pursue it
11:57indirectly
11:59that is when I can actually become
12:02happier okay so I'm going to see if I
12:04can understand this because you're
12:06saying I totally get the part that if
12:08you focus at something maniacally right
12:10you're going to get the sun spots you
12:12can't you cannot hold that intent gaze
12:14at something even if you want to but
12:17when the sunlight hits a prism and it
12:19casts a rainbow you're saying that the
12:22rainbow H is the way that you indirectly
12:26enjoy the sun I have so many questions
12:28the first one I have is what is the
12:33definition of Happiness there are five
12:37elements to happiness there may be more
12:40but five main elements to happiness
12:42which uh we call the Spire SP s p i r e
12:47s stands for Spiritual well-being
12:50spiritual well-being is about uh of
12:52course we can attain it through religion
12:55but we can also find it through doing
12:56something that is Meaningful to us
12:58purposeful
12:59by being mindful by being present we
13:02experience the the
13:04spiritual that's one of the colors of
13:06the rainbow so if I wake up in the
13:08morning and say I want to be happy I'll
13:10be less happy but if I wake up in the
13:11morning and say I want to find something
13:13which is more meaningful to do or I'm
13:16going to meditate for 10 minutes now
13:19that is an indirect way of pursuing
13:22happiness that's one of the colors so
13:24that's the S of spire the P of spire
13:27that's physical well-being physical
13:29well-being is about nutrition it's about
13:32um about rest and Recovery sleep it's
13:36about uh touch it's about um what we eat
13:42that of course matters so if I start to
13:45exercise regularly that's an indirect
13:47way of pursuing happiness H if I eat
13:49more healthfully the same then we have
13:53the eye of spire I stands for
13:56intellectual well-being that's about uh
13:59curiosity about asking questions about
14:02constantly learning about deep diving
14:05whether it's into a text or a work of
14:07art or nature and these are again all
14:10indirect ways of pursuing happiness the
14:14fourth color of the rainbow the r of
14:17spire relational well-being number one
14:20predictor of Happiness quality time we
14:21spend with people we care about and who
14:23care about us so if I spend more time
14:27with my loved ones indirectly pursuing
14:30happiness and finally the E of spire
14:32emotional well-being emotional
14:35well-being is first of all about giving
14:38ourselves the permission to be human in
14:41other words allowing the um embracing
14:45painful emotions that are natural part
14:47of any life even a happy life sadness
14:50anger frustration allowing these
14:52emotions to freely flow through us
14:55paradoxically actually leads to more
14:57happiness so these five elements of
15:00Happiness spiritual physical
15:02intellectual relational and emotional
15:04well-being are the metaphorical colors
15:06of the rainbow and when we pursue them
15:09we're actually pursuing happiness
15:12indirectly and becoming happier as you
15:14were describing all five elements you
15:16did keep saying the word
15:18well-being and what I wonder as I'm
15:22listening because it makes a lot of
15:24sense right that all of these components
15:28go in into a a a a whole look at how to
15:34elevate or experience happiness in your
15:37life what do I got to achieve next to
15:39feel that thing that I want to feel how
15:42would you begin to explain to somebody
15:45like that what this actually means and
15:48how you pursue it if you don't even know
15:50what happiness kind of feels like you
15:52got the wrong definition right you know
15:55so the first thing that I would do is I
15:59take a step back and um explore models
16:02of happiness because if you think about
16:04it in our culture today we have two
16:06major models of Happiness the one model
16:09of Happiness which is mostly associated
16:11with the West is you become happier by
16:15achieving your goals right that's the
16:17most important thing you get to the peak
16:18of the mountain then you'll be happy
16:19that's a model that I tried and that
16:22many people tried it doesn't really work
16:25the other model that people Veer towards
16:28is okay so the future doesn't get us
16:31happiness let's focus on the now let's
16:34just be in the present moment yes and
16:38that's an alternative model which is
16:39mostly again this is very broad brush
16:41Strokes mostly associated with the East
16:44MH you know meditation mindfulness being
16:47the here and
16:48now there are problems with both models
16:52we know what the problem is with the
16:53future oriented model but there's also a
16:55problem with the present oriented model
16:57and that is human nature again
16:59because we do want goals we do we are
17:02ambitious we do want to achieve things
17:05and and and and whether you're living
17:07here or in uh in
17:10Vietnam and the question is can these
17:13two models be reconciled in other words
17:16can you draw The Best of Both Worlds and
17:19the answer is yes goals matter they're
17:22important whether it is to you know to
17:24win a championship in sports or whether
17:26it is to get into a college or whether
17:28it is to make x amount of money goals
17:31matter we care about them why do they
17:33matter in the context of Happiness well
17:35they matter because again it's part of
17:37our nature we want to improve we want to
17:39get better and that's a beautiful and
17:41wonderful part of our nature which we
17:43ought to
17:44celebrate not uh not not attack so
17:48that's a good thing however what we also
17:50know is that the achievement of these
17:53goals will not make us
17:55happy what will make us happy not the
17:58achievement of these goals but the
18:00existence of these goals whether or not
18:02I achieve them is actually less
18:04important to have them matters why does
18:07it matter because think about it you go
18:09on a road trip and You' have no idea
18:12where you're going so you know you turn
18:14left or right you look over am I falling
18:16over a a cliff what should I do today is
18:19this the right thing you know it's it's
18:21you're Meandering you're not certain
18:24you're not happy then but if you know
18:26I'm going to the top of that mountain
18:28over there then you can you know go
18:32there with full energy with
18:34motivation especially if that
18:36Mountaintop is Meaningful to you which
18:39is an important component of a goal of
18:42course so you have a meaningful goal
18:45you're going towards it and what does
18:47having that goal do what it does for you
18:50is it liberates you to enjoy the here
18:53and now that makes a lot of sense and
18:55that's how the two of the two of them
18:57are reconciled because it gives your
19:00daytoday life a sense of purpose and
19:02Direction and I can see how if you wake
19:06up in the morning and you're either just
19:08going through the motions or you wake up
19:10in the morning and you're not quite
19:13sure what to do with your time because
19:15you're not quite sure what you want how
19:18that lack of purpose then starts to
19:24probably make you think too much and
19:26probably make you start to dwell on
19:29questions like am I happy am I not happy
19:32what should I be doing I don't know am I
19:34lost am I stuck am I I mean I've
19:36certainly been in those areas of my life
19:38and so you're absolutely right about
19:40that I see what you're saying and then
19:42what that means is that that future goal
19:45is not an end but rather a means it's a
19:49means towards liberating you to enjoy
19:52the Here and Now T thank you for
19:54explaining that and this is a great
19:57moment to remind you as you're listening
19:59that the episode that we did on the
20:02science of setting deeply personal goals
20:04we're going to link to that in the
20:05resources it also is the episode that
20:08features some of T's research on goal
20:11setting that's there for you I want to
20:13hear a quick word from our sponsors who
20:15are bringing us this amazing amazing
20:18information about happiness at zero cost
20:21do not go anywhere you're going to be
20:22happy you stuck around because when we
20:24come back I'm going to ask T to walk you
20:28and I step by step through all five
20:31elements of happiness and give us a
20:33specific example of a simple action you
20:36could take in each area that will make
20:39you feel happier today stay with me hey
20:42it's Mel you know I see you showing up
20:44here all the time on YouTube and I love
20:46inspiring you but just imagine what
20:48would happen if for the next six months
20:49you took everything that you've been
20:50learning here on YouTube with me and you
20:52put it into action in your life let me
20:55help you do it let me give you the
20:57structure the accountability and the
20:59support that you deserve I want you in
21:01my six-month exclusive coaching program
21:03called launch registration is open right
21:06now it closes on April 25th at 700 p.m.
21:09Eastern and then that's it I'm not
21:11offering this coaching program again
21:12until 2025 you have no idea how
21:15successful you could be now's your
21:17chance to find out go to melrobbins.com
21:19launch before another year of your life
21:22goes by or click the link below
21:25[Music]
21:29welcome back it's your friend Mel and
21:32boy are you in for a treat today I'm so
21:35excited we are here with Dr Tall Ben
21:38Shahar he is the most popular professor
21:42in history at Harvard teaches positive
21:45psychology the psychology of leadership
21:48and we are going through 30 years of his
21:51work on happiness and more importantly
21:54how you can be a happier you now we've
21:56already covered two important things let
21:58me just recap to make sure that you got
22:00this that happiness is about wholeness
22:04and there are five elements to you being
22:07happier spiritual physical your
22:09intellectual wellness relationships and
22:12emotional and one of the things that I
22:14wanted to ask you T is you're talking a
22:17lot about the things we can do to
22:20improve those areas of our life which
22:23impacts our happiness for somebody
22:25listening that maybe
22:29has not grown up around happy
22:32people doesn't really know if happiness
22:37is possible or even kind of what it
22:39feels
22:40like where do you even begin if you
22:43don't know what happiness looks like or
22:45feels like or how to achieve it yeah you
22:48know um one of um I I always um tell my
22:52students that the best self-help books
22:54are
22:55biographies why because biographies give
22:58us you know the the
23:00deep understanding of what a a happy
23:02life or a miserable or a successful life
23:05looks like and one of my favorite
23:08biographies is um Mahatma
23:11Gandhi's the subtitle of his
23:14autobiography is my experiments with
23:18truth it's not my finding truth it's not
23:22the ultimate truth it's my experiments
23:25with truth and that for me is a guiding
23:29Mantra and I think it ought to be for
23:31many of us because it is very much about
23:34experimentation it's about trying things
23:36out it's about trying different ways of
23:39being living and doing and through
23:42experimentation and if we're not afraid
23:44of experimenting of trying if we're not
23:45afraid of falling down then we'll get
23:48better then we'll grow then we will
23:50actually become happier with an emphasis
23:53on happier what do I mean by that see
23:56many people ask me okay T you've been in
23:58in this business for 30 years 30 years
24:00ago you embarked on this journey are you
24:02finally happy today are you good
24:06question my answer is I don't know what
24:09that is not acceptable to you're
24:12supposed to be here and tell us to be
24:14happy how to be happy you don't know if
24:16you're happy I'm here to tell you how to
24:18be happier not happy
24:20because I don't know what being happy is
24:24or means in the sense that I don't think
24:26there is a binary zero1 Okay so
24:28yesterday I was unhappy today I am I'm
24:31happy rather than a binary
24:3401 it is a Continuum so I can certainly
24:38tell you that I'm a lot happier today
24:40than I was 30 years ago but I hope that
24:425 years from now I'll be happier than I
24:44am today how do you
24:47know how do I know that I will be
24:50happier or how do I know how to measure
24:53that I'm both how like I I know this's a
24:57kind of a basic question question but
24:59happiness eludes so many people there
25:03are so many people that write in about
25:05feeling stuck or a lack of purpose or
25:09devastated with
25:11grief
25:13that I know when you look in the
25:15rearview mirror you can say oh I'm
25:18happier than I was 10 years ago I feel
25:21in your definition that you've presented
25:24to us that you really like
25:28a sense of wholeness right H an access
25:32to it but for somebody that really feels
25:34like whether it's because of depression
25:35or they're just been miserable their
25:37whole life or their life has been really
25:39hard yeah so I would go for uh you know
25:43small changes the Kaizen change that the
25:46Japanese talk about which is how can I
25:50become 1% happier not how can I become
25:53happy not how can I you know find you
25:56know the uh the um the answer just how
25:59can I become 1% happier and then if you
26:02look at ask this question and look at
26:04the five Spire elements and you can look
26:05at all five and you look at one of them
26:08how can I introduce a small change
26:10experiment with a small truth and then
26:12see how that works and then if it does
26:16great to do more of it if it doesn't try
26:18something else but the key is to
26:20continue moving because as we know one
26:24of the the major characteristics of
26:27depression is uh helplessness which
26:30means doing nothing so counter that with
26:34doing something and again that something
26:35doesn't have to be major you know one of
26:38the things that I'm um working on a lot
26:40now is how small changes can make a big
26:43difference yeah when consistently
26:46applied and I know that you are uh you
26:48know you know doing work in that area as
26:50well when you talk about you know take
26:51that one minute to uh to breathe and
26:54those small changes make a big
26:56difference and you know I've I've coined
26:58uh term so I don't know if you're
27:00familiar with um the term MVP not from
27:03Sports from um from business MVP minimum
27:07viable product now this is something a
27:09company you know brings out as sort of a
27:12beta version a test
27:14case and um you know it's not perfect
27:17it's not ready it's not ideal but it's
27:20good enough so based on this MVP minimum
27:23viable product idea I coin the term mvi
27:27minimum viable intervention H minimum
27:31viable intervention these are the small
27:33changes that you can introduce that
27:36actually make a difference over time and
27:38this is what I would urge the mvi is
27:40what I would urge that someone who's
27:43feeling stuck or down or someone who
27:45just lacks motivation introduces in
27:48their lives okay what are these mvis for
27:51example um you know what actually let me
27:53go over the Spire elements and and
27:54provide an mvi for each one I love you
27:57yes all right so spiritual well-being
28:00spiritual well-being is about purpose
28:03and presence okay let's say we for uh
28:07one minute breathe deeply focusing on
28:10the air going in and out that's
28:12meditation you know it's not 30 minutes
28:14but it's one minute and we know and
28:16there's a lot of research showing that
28:18that one minute can make a huge
28:20difference now there are so many things
28:22we can do in one minute while being
28:25present and that will enhance and we
28:27know that there's a lot of lot of data
28:29on this will enhance your spiritual
28:31well-being as well as your physical
28:33well-being but let's let's move to the P
28:35of spire for a second so
28:38um going to the gym working out for an
28:41hour great you know doing high intensity
28:44interval training for 15 minutes amazing
28:47sounds horrible
28:49honestly but you will become happier as
28:51a result subsequently but what about
28:54taking 30 seconds or 45 seconds for a
28:58burst of energy running on the spot or
29:01doing your push-ups or sit-ups 45
29:04seconds that's all now we know again
29:07there is research on it showing that if
29:09you do it three times during the
29:11day you will actually um have the
29:15equivalent of a workout so it doesn't
29:19have to be all at once meaning you can
29:21do it you know now for 45 seconds and
29:23then in 2 hours another 45 seconds
29:25climbing up and down the stairs which
29:27you can do in the office you know you
29:28don't sweat you don't need to you know
29:30shower after and then 5 hours later you
29:32do it again when you when when you get
29:35home 45 seconds minimum viable
29:38intervention it's cumulative and it
29:41actually has the effect of psychological
29:44well-being impact and it also impacts
29:46your of course physical well-being now
29:49as you're talking I just want to remind
29:51the person
29:52listening that you're considering this
29:56inside the context
29:59of Happiness being
30:01wholeness and well-being meaning you are
30:06intentional about caring for your
30:09well-being that these are all components
30:12of wholeness and these five categories
30:16are the ones that matter the most so
30:19what's another mvi for I intellectual
30:23well-being so intellectual well-being
30:25which is after spiritual and physical
30:27it's the third El um this is about for
30:31example learning something new you know
30:33and going online and looking at these
30:35you know short excerpts okay I'm going
30:37to learn a new technique or I'm going to
30:39learn a new idea or I'm going to come up
30:42with a new question to ask my partner or
30:46my or my
30:48friend so this is intellectual
30:51well-being and it's incredible how these
30:54small changes just asking a question or
30:58just learning something new then
31:00trigger your curiosity muscles you know
31:04by the way M I forgot to say this but
31:06curiosity you know the the saying
31:08curiosity kills the cat yeah it turns
31:10out that it's the opposite for human
31:13beings meaning people who are curious
31:15who ask many questions who are lifelong
31:17Learners actually live longer wow so
31:21look at all the benefits of being
31:24curious so that's intellectual
31:26well-being then we have
31:29relational well-being the r of spire you
31:32know a hug you know and a nice text you
31:35send your um you know your partner uh
31:39relational well-being you know really
31:41listen really listen to someone be
31:43present for them even if it's for 2
31:45minutes the impact of it on the
31:47relationship on them on you is
31:50remarkable and yes of course if you have
31:52two three hours to spend together even
31:54better
31:55ideal good enough to use those mvis I'm
31:59hearing from so many people that listen
32:02to this podcast that are really
32:03struggling with loneliness and if one
32:07aspect of the Spire model one of the
32:09five elements of happiness is your
32:12relation your relationships and
32:14well-being in that area um what does the
32:18research say in terms of how many
32:22friends is it deep is it tons like for
32:25somebody that's just feeling isolated
32:27and lonely or that sense like where are
32:28all my friends and feels
32:31disconnection what does the research say
32:33in terms of Happiness number one
32:36predictor of happiness is quality time
32:39we spend with people we care about and
32:40who care about us now we also know that
32:45um the number one predictor of
32:46unhappiness in our world today is
32:48loneliness and this um was uh
32:51exacerbated as a result of covid of
32:54course because what loneliness does is
32:56it very often gets us into this downward
32:58spiral where I feel lonely and I feel
33:00you know incompetent in the social realm
33:03and what we need to do in order to get
33:04out of it is get out of it there has to
33:06be focused action and intention in other
33:10words single tasking rather than
33:13multitasking because one of the main
33:14causes of loneliness is not the fact
33:16that we're not around people it's the
33:19fact that when we're around people we're
33:20also doing 20 other things you know
33:23Daniel Gman calls our age the age of
33:26distraction yes so you know if I'm with
33:28friends but at the same time I'm texting
33:30and doing something else and they're
33:31doing we're not really together right
33:34you know it's um the the example that I
33:36like so imagine imagine you're listening
33:38to your favorite piece of
33:39music and um can I share with you what
33:43mine is absolutely all right don't tell
33:46anyone though Drake no close Whitney
33:50Houston and I will always love you oh my
33:52God my favorite song of all time so
33:56imagine you're listen listening to that
33:58or whatever your favorite is and you
34:01know you close your eyes you focus and
34:03you rate on a scale of 1 to 10 you know
34:05it's your favorite
34:0710 and then you listen to your second
34:09most favorite and you know my second
34:11most favorite is uh Beethoven's Fifth
34:15Symphony you listen to that and you rate
34:19it on a scale of 1 to 10 and you know
34:20it's not quite what Houston but he's
34:22pretty good it's a n and a half Y and
34:24then for the perfect experience you take
34:28these two pieces of music and you play
34:30them together at the same time at the
34:32same time what do you get 19 and a half
34:34no it's not a 10 not even a five it's
34:37cacophony it's noise and that's Modern
34:40Life for you because what we're doing is
34:44we're trying to pack because of you know
34:46fomo because you know you know we're
34:48eager to experience things we pack in
34:50many things so while we're with friends
34:52we're also you know doing some work
34:54perhaps and while we're with the you
34:56know kids we're also watching a movie
34:58and you can't do it
35:00all well you can do a lot but you
35:02certainly can't enjoy it all and much of
35:05our sense of loneliness comes because
35:07when we're with other people we're not
35:09really with other people and what we
35:12need to do is put down a uh put time
35:14aside and it doesn't have to be seven
35:16hours you know even if it's an hour
35:18twice a week or that text that you
35:21commit yourself to
35:23mindfully these small committed focused
35:28activities can get us out of the sense
35:32of loneliness or
35:33unhappiness beautiful beautiful what a
35:36beautiful metaphor it makes so much
35:39sense and finally emotional well-being
35:42that's about you know the Gratitude
35:44Journal
35:46take a minute to write three things that
35:49you're grateful for you know close your
35:51eyes and
35:52Savor Savor what what you have uh right
35:56now or
35:58write a journal about what's hurting you
36:00for 2 minutes there's research showing
36:03that even two-minute journaling whether
36:06it's about difficult experiences or
36:08about ecstatic experiences two minutes
36:11actually make us happier and healthier
36:14better to write it in a journal or to
36:16talk about it than to just ruminate over
36:18it why why is it better to write in a
36:19journal and talk about it so so so here
36:22I'm drawing on Research by Sonia lubiri
36:24who's a professor at UC Riverside and
36:26what she shows is that when we are
36:29dealing with um uh painful emotions or
36:34difficult experiences we can either talk
36:37about it write about it or think about
36:39it people who think about it it actually
36:41gets worse we ruminate we go down the
36:43rabbit hole downward spiral and we can
36:46stay there for for hours or sometimes
36:49weeks or decades in some people right
36:51exactly whereas if we write about it or
36:55talk about it there's a much higher
36:58likelihood that will emerge stronger why
37:01because what we're doing when we're
37:02writing and talking about it we're
37:04actually making sense of it you know so
37:06often and you know this is work on
37:08journaling Jamie pennybaker and others
37:10showing that when we write about
37:13something very often we reach a aha
37:15moment or oh now I see what what's
37:19happening or now I see what I need to
37:20do and then it becomes more
37:24manageable it becomes more coherent more
37:27clear and we're ready to move on and we
37:30know what we ought to do so writing and
37:32talking about it rather than ruminating
37:34about it is very
37:36important and then after we have uh
37:41written about talked about it just do it
37:44what is it it could be an mvi a minimum
37:47viable intervention it could be you know
37:49go to the gym it doing it could be you
37:53know go out with friends even if you
37:54don't really feel like it but keep on
37:58experimenting with truths rather than
38:00sitting down and trying to figure out
38:02the meaning of life or or the the the
38:05the ultimate answer to the universe you
38:07know I have something to share that um
38:10happened with my sister-in-law business
38:13partner and friend
38:15Christine she had been uh somebody that
38:19really loved going to church and then
38:21like many of us life gets busy with your
38:23kids especially if they're in these
38:25sports teams and everything else and
38:27something happened at the church and so
38:29they kind of stopped going and for a
38:31number of years she thought about it and
38:34thought about it and thought about it
38:37and recently let's talk mvi a minimum
38:40viable intervention she just got up off
38:43her rear end she didn't wait for her
38:45husband and Sons to go with her and she
38:48just one Sunday went back to one service
38:53and I will tell you that there is
38:56something if we go back to the rainbow
38:58analogy and you think about happiness
39:02being an indirect thing in your life
39:06that you feel in multiple ways that one
39:10small action of no longer thinking about
39:12it but going
39:14back it has
39:16created more it's almost like if if you
39:20think about a rainbow there is a hue
39:22there there's a vibrancy there and I
39:24love this word wholeness because it is
39:27part of her well-being to have a
39:30spiritual practice and it does create a
39:34vibrancy and a wholeness in that area of
39:37her life it is one simple change it is
39:40an hour every week she it is not
39:43dependent on anybody else in her family
39:45doing it and to me that is a very clear
39:49example of what you're talking about in
39:52terms of how it relates to these five
39:54elements of happiness and how you can
39:56just in very small ways experience what
40:00you're talking about yeah so so I love
40:03that story and I love it because of what
40:05you brought up saying that it's one
40:08small action experiment with these small
40:10truths you know I'm wondering as one of
40:12the world's most respected and leading
40:14experts on happiness what do you do
40:17every day to be
40:19happier um you know I do the basics H I
40:23wake up in the morning and I do my
40:24meditation now do you lay in bed you get
40:27get up do you like do how do you do your
40:29medit I lay in bed and again I'm is that
40:32technically like just sort of snoozing
40:34like what are you doing like you
40:35literally are like you wake up and then
40:37you meditate while you're I meditate and
40:39again this is this is good for a morning
40:41I'm a morning person so when I wake up I
40:43wake up it's not I won't fall asleep
40:45again but for people who for whom it's
40:47difficult to wake up in the morning get
40:49out of bed you know wash your face do
40:50whatever you need to energize and then
40:52sit down if you need or or walk do
40:54walking meditation but meditation is uh
40:56is where I start and then um I read and
41:01I and I I love reading in bed and I read
41:03quality stuff I don't look at the news
41:07uh that's very looking at TMZ on your
41:09phone no just kidding yeah that yes but
41:12not the other news um so so I do quality
41:17stuff in the morning then you know I I'm
41:19I'm responsible for taking the kids to
41:22uh to to school I love that yeah they
41:25might I bet they love that too they do
41:27and and I do and and and always and we
41:29have a sort of a a ritual around uh
41:33around that you know where where where
41:35we where we talk and then they ask me
41:36okay Dad one message for the day and it
41:39could be something like um be generous
41:42be kind or appreciate or whatever
41:45whatever it is and they go with it and
41:47and they also share it with their
41:48friends that's pretty cool yeah so so we
41:51have that and then and then I go home
41:53and and and I work mornings are my my
41:56productive hours and then I do yoga in
41:59the in the
42:00afternoon um almost every day you know
42:03have uh have lunch with uh with my wife
42:08and um and then sometimes work in the
42:11afternoon you know do Sports I do a lot
42:13of sports you know you still play Squash
42:15I play Squash I didn't play Squash for
42:1725 years and I always said if one of my
42:19kids plays then I'll take it up again
42:21and our little one our 14-year-old plays
42:23squash so I play with him I bet you're a
42:26monster on the pickleball court I've
42:28never played pickleball but I want toy I
42:31want to just yeah yeah and um so yeah
42:37and then you know I love movies I love
42:39you know reading hanging out with
42:41friends uh family I want to reflect on
42:44something because what you're
42:48describing sounds like a happy life and
42:53if you're not watching this on
42:55YouTube you can probably hear in T's
42:58voice that he's smiling as he's
43:00reflecting on this
43:03and it is true that so many of us make
43:06ourselves unhappy because we
43:08think that the answer to it is something
43:13out there that National Championship the
43:15getting into the right School the right
43:17grades the right this the right that and
43:20what you just described is the little
43:24things you do every day that make you
43:26feel whole there's something very
43:28important Mel that I want to add you
43:31know it may sound you know fairy tale oh
43:34he's always happy and always smiling far
43:36from it I had ask your kids they said
43:38some days you're a real
43:40jerk kid they don't say they don't say
43:42jerk but they say Daddy chill yeah chill
43:45chill yeah um and um and and and it's
43:49it's important to to understand you know
43:51not every morning when I get up I I want
43:53to write you know some mornings I get up
43:56and I want to stay in bed and do nothing
43:58what is most important is what we do
44:01rather than what we
44:02feel you know I do what I what I do
44:06whether it's the yoga whether it's the
44:07writing whether it's spending time with
44:09with family and friends I do it even if
44:11I don't feel like
44:13it and over time what we do affects
44:18us also affects our feelings you know T
44:21when I was researching uh your work to
44:25get ready for this conversation today I
44:26came AC Ross a video that you did that
44:28has 7 million views where you say stop
44:31chasing happiness and you want us to
44:33focus on something else instead I'm
44:36going to ask you to tell us what we're
44:37supposed to be focused on after a short
44:39word from our sponsors so stay with us
44:41you'll be happy you did hey it's your
44:43buddy Mel and I made this video because
44:45I am constantly asked by fans of the Mel
44:47Robbins podcast Mel how can how can I
44:50work with you Mel like how can I get
44:52more support from you and there's one
44:53way you can do that once a year I offer
44:56a six-month long program called launch I
44:58lead it I designed it it is
45:00extraordinary and it is open for
45:02registration right now I am not doing
45:04this again until 2025 I am leading the
45:07trainings I put you through a six-month
45:09experience where you get to pick a
45:11project in your personal your
45:13professional your business life and for
45:156 months you are in a coaching container
45:19led by me where you get the structure
45:20the accountability the research back
45:22tools that you need in order to take
45:24something from here to real life this is
45:26your chance registration is open go to
45:28melrobbins.com launch to get all the
45:30details and see if it's for you and if
45:32it's for you get yourself in this you
45:34deserve it and you're going to shock
45:35Yourself by what you create when you
45:38have the support from Mel Robbins that
45:39you
45:42deserve welcome back it's your friend
45:45Mel Robbins I'm so happy you're here
45:46with me today because we are getting to
45:48spend time with tall Ben shahari he's
45:51one of the most respected and prolific
45:54experts on happiness in the world and he
45:56is the most popular Professor to ever
45:59teach at Harvard he taught positive
46:01psychology and we're digging into 30
46:04years of research and what research says
46:07about how you can be happier we've
46:10already covered the definition of
46:11Happiness as the sense of wholeness
46:14we've talked about the five elements of
46:16Happiness he's made it very clear that
46:18this is not about checking boxes it's
46:20not about achieving goals it's about
46:22pursuing small 1% changes in these five
46:27areas of your life and one of the most
46:30popular things you've ever put out
46:32online has 7 million views in less than
46:34a year don't chase happiness become
46:37antifragile what what does antifragile
46:39mean yeah you know that's one of those
46:41Concepts that really made a difference
46:43in my life it's a it's an idea that I
46:46read about through the work of Nasim
46:48Talib who's a professor at New York
46:51University and what is anti fragility
46:54the opposite of fragility or I've come
46:56to look at it as resilience 2.0 okay so
47:01let's begin with 1.0 resilience please
47:04resilience 1.0 is actually a term that
47:06comes from engineering it simply means
47:08that resilience 1.0 comes from
47:10engineering resilience as a term comes
47:12from engineering see that computer
47:13science the classes you took in good
47:17absolutely so what what what it means is
47:20that if you have certain material and
47:22you put pressure on it if it's resilient
47:25it goes back to its original form mhm
47:27you squish you know a piece of uh rubber
47:30resilient it returns to where it was
47:32before a ball you drop it if it's
47:34resilient it bounces back up to where it
47:37was before so that's 1.0 what's
47:39resilience 2.0 or anti fragility you
47:42take material you put pressure and
47:44stress on it as a result of the pressure
47:46and stress it actually grows stronger
47:49bigger healthier or you drop a ball
47:52resilience 1.0 it simply bounces back
47:552.0 antifragility it bounces back higher
47:59as a result so that's antifragility and
48:02it turns out that there are antifragile
48:04systems all around us and within us I
48:07mean think about it for example our
48:08muscular system you go to the gym you're
48:11putting stress on your muscles what
48:13happens as a result of it if you persist
48:16you actually grow stronger bigger
48:17healthier as a result of that stress
48:20where anti fragile systems not just
48:23physiologically also psychologically
48:27and that's
48:28important you know I most of the
48:31students in my class not all but most of
48:33them were psychology majors and I would
48:34always ask them two questions the first
48:37question was put your hand up if you
48:39know what PTSD is just about everyone in
48:42the class put their hand up they've
48:44heard of post-traumatic stress disorder
48:46they've read about it studied it in
48:47Psych one newspaper people know what it
48:50is then I said okay put your hands down
48:52and now put your hands up if you've
48:53heard of the term ptg
48:57hardly anyone put their hand up and
48:59again these are psychology Majors ptg
49:02stands for
49:04posttraumatic growth so whereas PTSD is
49:08breaking down being fragile ptg
49:11post-traumatic growth is being
49:14antifragile growing as a result of
49:16trauma or hardship or difficulty how do
49:19you do that so here is the thing this is
49:23this amazed me about the re and there's
49:24a lot of research by tesi Calhoun and
49:26others merely knowing about the
49:30existence of ptg of post-traumatic
49:32growth of anti- fragility actually makes
49:35it more likely to happen wow why because
49:40what does knowing about ptg do for us
49:43what it does for us is it actually gives
49:45us hope because okay so I'm going
49:48through a hardship difficulties I'm
49:50really struggling but I can actually
49:52grow from this so I become hopeful now
49:55if you think about it what is this main
49:57difference between sadness and
50:00depression the main difference between
50:02sadness and depression is that
50:04depression is sadness without
50:08hope depression is sadness without hope
50:11cuz sadness I mean you feel it every day
50:15yeah 10 times a day sometimes big deal
50:17that you shall pass but if that
50:20sadness um is devoid of hope you know
50:23that two Shall Pass then that's problem
50:26atic that's when we become hopeless yes
50:30and that's when we experience being
50:32helpless and that's depression so
50:35knowing about ptg gives us hope makes it
50:38more likely to happen it becomes a
50:40self-fulfilling prophecy and remember
50:41most people have never heard of these
50:43terms don't know that it's even in the
50:45realm of the possible so that's the
50:48first thing I love that because the
50:50other thing that's happened and I know
50:51that you see this too is just the
50:56proliferation of short form content on
51:00social media has so much about
51:03identifying trauma and it would be
51:07wonderful especially based on This
51:09research if there were just as many
51:13reals and social media posts about
51:16post-traumatic growth that knowing that
51:20you are struggling with
51:21something is the first step to kind of
51:24knowing what you need to address but
51:26being aware that you can grow through
51:29this and be stronger and I think we all
51:32know this somewhere in the back of our
51:34mind and even if I look back on my own
51:36life tall and I think about um like even
51:40a period in my marriage where my husband
51:42and I like wanted to kill each other and
51:45we went to therapy our marriage was in
51:48the pits we were we'd been together for
51:51over 20 years and we were just having a
51:54lot of problems and we were not feeling
51:56connected with one another and I can see
52:00that if you're in a situation that's
52:02very difficult whether you're grieving
52:04or you're having a relationship problem
52:06or you've now just lost your third job
52:08or whatever it may be and you add a
52:12sense of hopelessness to it you've just
52:15driven a nail into the coffin and sealed
52:17it shut it's the hope that it can get
52:20better that is what allows you to grow
52:24through it and you're here to say that
52:26that no matter what the traumatic
52:28experience or the heaviness of the
52:31emotion or the very real life experience
52:34that you may be living through right now
52:37that just like a sun can shine through a
52:40prism and cast a rainbow so too hope can
52:44shine through this experience and you
52:46can grow stronger and even just knowing
52:49that in your definition of being a whole
52:53human being who takes care of self
52:57that hope is a critical ingredient to
52:59you getting better that's is that what
53:01you're saying absolutely and it's a
53:02critical period for you as an individual
53:04getting better it's a critical element
53:07of a relationship as you pointed out
53:10it's also a critical element of national
53:14growth yes that's exactly what happened
53:16I realized it didn't complete the whole
53:18thing is that in working through it and
53:23having the really hard conversations and
53:25and really- exporing ourselves and
53:28sticking through the very hard painful
53:33times I have a profound sense of in your
53:38definition that you are giving us t a
53:41sense of
53:42wholeness in the relationship and also a
53:46sense of wholeness with self and it's
53:49true if you really are listening to what
53:51T's saying and you reflect on your own
53:53life and you think about any moment in
53:55your life that was crazy
53:58painful notice whether or not as you
54:01moved through
54:03it and you really are honest with
54:05yourself that there was that bounce up
54:09effect that happens after it as you move
54:12through the grief or the disappointment
54:14or the Heartbreak that all of a sudden
54:16you wake up one day and you weren't
54:18staring at the sun directly going I'm
54:20going to be Happ now you were just
54:22slowly working on your well-being and
54:26you felt different and it as I really
54:29listen closely to what you're teaching
54:31us I think that's what I'm starting to
54:33take away and and I will add to that and
54:37and you know you mentioned earlier about
54:40how knowing that you can grow from it
54:45contributes to your uh to your
54:46well-being just knowing that a gridlock
54:50or
54:51hardships these are all natural parts of
54:55our evolution of life you know no no one
54:57is exempt from these no relationship it
54:59could be the best you know fairy tale
55:01relationship they'll have their
55:03gridlocks just knowing that it's a
55:04natural part of a relationship that is
55:07uh you know uplifting because it's
55:09liberating because you're saying oh okay
55:12it's normal and that's exactly what I
55:14felt after reading schnarch and going
55:15through a gridlock with my amazing wife
55:18saying okay so so so it's fine that two
55:21shall pass and that's what gives hope
55:26and that is what becomes a
55:28self-fulfilling prophecy because through
55:30that hope you actually grow within the
55:32relationship or in another context it's
55:34so true you know with the 30 years that
55:37you have spent researching this topic is
55:41there anything that bubbles up from the
55:42research that is top predictors of
55:45whether or not you're going to have that
55:47sense of wholeness and happiness in your
55:50life um the number one would be the
55:56belief that you can make a difference
55:59you know many people ask me um so what
56:02is the uh the content of uh the the
56:04chorus you know whether it's the the ma
56:06or the certificate program and they're
56:09always surprised that I say that at the
56:12beginning we start learning about
56:15systems thinking oh really yeah and
56:18systems thinking you know for somebody
56:19who has no idea what that is what the
56:21hell is systems thinking no seriously
56:22like for somebody who's like what system
56:24thinking yeah so so systems thinking is
56:26um about looking at things as holes so
56:32looking at the system rather than the
56:34symptom so looking at the system whether
56:36it's an organization is a system y the
56:39human body is a system it's a system of
56:42you know cells and organs um a system is
56:46all about
56:48interconnectedness and the key in a
56:51system is to find leverage points okay
56:55where do I press where do I touch to
56:57affect the entire system you know it's
56:59what Charles doig talks about you know
57:01Keystone habits what is that place one
57:04thing that if you do will will impact
57:06another part of the system and another
57:08part is it exercising daily is it you
57:10know starting your day you know Zone one
57:13of the day with uh deep breaths right
57:17and meditation is it um you know leaving
57:20home and you know hugging your your your
57:22loved one what is that one thing and
57:25when everything is interconnected it
57:28actually doesn't matter that much where
57:30you enter the system because it will
57:31affect everyone else this is why the
57:34emphasis on that one small action is so
57:37critical because you can literally sit
57:40down and think for years about How am
57:42I'm going to change my life or you can
57:43just do it you know what is so cool
57:47about this is
57:48that visually speaking between the
57:52rainbow example and this idea of systems
57:55and Ness and everything being
57:57interconnected in this model traumatic
58:01experiences are connected to happiness
58:03sadness and grief are connected to
58:06happiness struggles and periods of
58:09feeling lost are profoundly connected to
58:13happiness why painful experiences
58:15difficult experiences are inevitable
58:17again there is no life example but let
58:19let's play a a game okay let's imagine
58:23that sometime in the future and by the
58:25way this right now it's a it's a theory
58:28but it could become a reality sometime
58:29in the future we'll have the ability to
58:34drive away all pain because we'll have
58:37such great control over our neurons that
58:40we'll be able to control what we feel
58:44all the time so you know in um in why
58:47would you want to do that well why would
58:50you want to do it many people would
58:52especially when they're in the midst of
58:54hardship and difficulty you know all you
58:56want is for it to go away or what if you
58:58see your loved one your your child in
59:01pain maybe you can make it go away I
59:04just got something from you do tell the
59:07reason why I had that
59:10reaction I realized is because I have
59:12the belief that pain disappears with
59:16time the Hope
59:18yes whoa and what if someone is um
59:22doesn't have that and what if and again
59:24many people many people will make it go
59:26away I mean if you think about it why
59:28are we so um as a culture so obsessed
59:32with uh with those pills and again I'm
59:35not against psychiatric medication and
59:37sometimes it has saved lives and I know
59:40some cases intimately where where it has
59:43however we're too um trigger happy when
59:46it comes to dispensing pills why because
59:49we want to make it go
59:50away so if we play this theoretical game
59:52that we do get to a world where no s
59:56side effects because we know exactly how
59:58to make these painful experiences
01:00:00disappear would we do it but then what
01:00:02would happen you know if you take a room
01:00:05full I've often asked my students this
01:00:07think about the experiences that you are
01:00:10most grateful for in terms of where you
01:00:12are today things where you have learned
01:00:14the most that have helped you grow the
01:00:16most think about them now put your hand
01:00:18up if there were fun experiences
01:00:20enjoyable ones very few people put their
01:00:22hand up it's almost always difficult
01:00:25experiences
01:00:26now do you want to do away with that do
01:00:29you want to get rid of growth and
01:00:31learning and this is exactly what will
01:00:33happen if we don't have any of these
01:00:36painful experiences So when you say
01:00:38they're part and parcel of a happy life
01:00:40they're essential to a full and
01:00:43fulfilling life and when we begin to
01:00:46look at these experiences as such then
01:00:50our reaction can be similar to what you
01:00:52said I don't want to get rid of them in
01:00:54fact I embra I don't enjoy them but I
01:00:57embrace them well and what you're also
01:00:59offering is a road map of Hope and
01:01:02action for anybody who's in the thick of
01:01:05that who's like give me the pill because
01:01:07I just lost my child and there is I
01:01:11don't want to feel what I'm feeling and
01:01:14what you're saying is that based on The
01:01:18Human Experience from the beginning of
01:01:21time we are designed to move through
01:01:23these things these emot emotional
01:01:26painful traumatic
01:01:28experiences are a moment in your life
01:01:32and that if you look at that rainbow and
01:01:35you look at spiritual physical
01:01:37intellectual relational or emotional
01:01:40Wellness for
01:01:42yourself and you take this mvi model of
01:01:45minimum viable intervention and you say
01:01:49to yourself there it can two things can
01:01:52be true this can be the worst thing
01:01:53that's ever happened to me and the
01:01:54deepest pain I've ever felt
01:01:56and I can wake up in the morning and I
01:02:00can pick one of those categories and I
01:02:02can take one action in the Spire model
01:02:07forward and that is a way to start to
01:02:11move through this and
01:02:13experience that wholeness that you're
01:02:16talking about even though it's so
01:02:20difficult yes and and you know Mel I
01:02:24want to share a story um
01:02:27when I was
01:02:2827 um I lost the most important person
01:02:32in my life to me at the time it was uh a
01:02:35dear dear friend who died in a plane
01:02:38crash uh this was when I was living in
01:02:41in Asia it was a plane from Indonesia to
01:02:43to Singapore and uh it crashed was the
01:02:4619th of uh December
01:02:511997 and um I thought my life had ended
01:02:55at that moment you know we were uh were
01:02:57supposed to meet in Singapore and and
01:03:00and it didn't
01:03:02happen and um I called up a a mentor of
01:03:06mine his name uh is Nathaniel Brandon
01:03:09Nathaniel Brandon has written many books
01:03:12on self-esteem I'd learned with him and
01:03:15I called him up for two reasons a
01:03:17because he was my teacher and
01:03:19mentor and and B because he himself had
01:03:22lost he lost his wife in a freak
01:03:25drowning accident when he was around a
01:03:27bit older than I was at the
01:03:29time and I called him up crying and uh
01:03:33he knew he knew my friend so uh you know
01:03:36he was he was he was very much
01:03:38distressed as well and he said t I'm
01:03:41going to tell you something now that
01:03:43you're not going to understand but keep
01:03:46it in mind
01:03:47anyway he said you're going to get over
01:03:51this it's going to be painful it's going
01:03:54to hurt like hell but you're going to
01:03:56get over
01:03:57it we all do because if we hadn't then
01:04:01God help us
01:04:04all and again this was many many years
01:04:09ago I still remember it and I remember
01:04:11it each time even when I go through
01:04:13minor uh
01:04:15crisis because we do get over it because
01:04:17we're built to overcome hardship and
01:04:20difficulties and sometimes it takes
01:04:21longer sometimes you know it's it's it's
01:04:23a
01:04:24day but we do get over it and having
01:04:27that hope and doing something with it
01:04:31again not staying and moping and and
01:04:33ruminating writing about it talking
01:04:35about it doing small things that is the
01:04:39way out of
01:04:41it thank you for sharing that like I I I
01:04:45was trying to put myself in your shoes
01:04:47because I think in the depths of that
01:04:48moment I'd probably be like [ __ ] you you
01:04:50know I don't want to hear that I'm not
01:04:52getting over the you know I was saying
01:04:54but it
01:04:56it is true that we do get through the
01:05:00things that we never think that it's
01:05:03possible to get through I'm also really
01:05:05curious since you're constantly
01:05:06researching something and clearly
01:05:08writing a book and you've got an academy
01:05:11and you are teaching people around the
01:05:13world is there a particular piece of
01:05:16research or new kind of finding around
01:05:20happiness that really excites
01:05:22you so what I think about a lot is how
01:05:26do you bring about lasting change
01:05:28because you know people are listening to
01:05:30us now and they're thinking oh yeah you
01:05:31know I want to do it or you know I would
01:05:33give a lecture and you know the audience
01:05:35would think yeah I'm I'm you know I'm
01:05:36going to implement it but most times
01:05:40nothing happens right most change
01:05:42efforts you know you talk about it you
01:05:44know coming into
01:05:462024 so you have a a goal and you know a
01:05:4930day challenge you know January
01:05:51February what happens with that usually
01:05:54not much so what I think think about
01:05:56constantly and what I'm researching is
01:05:58how can you increase the likelihood not
01:06:00guarantee but increase the
01:06:02likelihood that you will enjoy lasting
01:06:05change and um you know I love acronyms
01:06:08as you figure it out you know the Spire
01:06:10mvi so here is the third acronym give it
01:06:12to us the three Rs of change okay and we
01:06:16can use this with everything that you've
01:06:19taught us today in terms of making H
01:06:23being happier a lasting change in your
01:06:27life exactly so that's why the three are
01:06:29that that's that's why it's so important
01:06:30for me to to think about it write about
01:06:32it talk about it the three Rs of change
01:06:34are essentially the um you know should
01:06:37be the Intel inside so to speak of every
01:06:40uh change effort okay so what are they
01:06:42it's not reading writing in
01:06:44arithmetic other three Rs it's the first
01:06:47R is reminder I mean think about it Mel
01:06:50so if I asked you this um tell me is it
01:06:53important for you to uh
01:06:56appreciate the good people in your life
01:07:00um to uh to appreciate whatever works in
01:07:03your life or do you prefer to take it
01:07:05all for granted exactly exactly so you
01:07:08know no one would say you know I've had
01:07:09enough of appreciating my loved ones
01:07:11it's time to take them for granted for a
01:07:12for a while no one would say that except
01:07:16for my husband and
01:07:18therapy that too shall pass so and yet
01:07:23and yet even though everyone would say
01:07:25it's important for me to appreciate most
01:07:27people this is an empirical fact most
01:07:29people most of the time take the good
01:07:32things in their lives for granted true
01:07:34do not appreciate their loved ones most
01:07:36of the time most people most of the time
01:07:38now it's not because they're bad people
01:07:40it's not because they are not smart it's
01:07:44not because they have the desire to
01:07:46appreciate all these things are in place
01:07:48the problem is that we
01:07:51forget which is why the first antidote
01:07:55to
01:07:57forgetfulness or the first antidote to
01:07:59the absence of change is reminders and
01:08:04Mel you talk about it you talk about
01:08:05your Post-its I love that create
01:08:07reminders around you whether it's
01:08:09Post-its whether it's um you know
01:08:12walking around with a with a bracelet
01:08:14that reminds me of some of of something
01:08:15specific or a rainbow like I keep
01:08:17thinking about how much you've poured
01:08:19into us and how actionable everything is
01:08:22and understandable that even if you were
01:08:24to write on a post at spire and it's a
01:08:27reminder of the five elements every
01:08:29morning and you pop it on your mirror at
01:08:31your computer at work like now it's in
01:08:33your face and that's more
01:08:36likely with the reminder to help you go
01:08:39to the next star which is what which is
01:08:42repetition because one or two reminders
01:08:45one day second day not enough y we need
01:08:48repetition we need to do it over and
01:08:50over and over again and for that you
01:08:52need many reminders so for example a
01:08:54recurring function on your you know on
01:08:56your calendar yep you know every Monday
01:08:59Wednesday and Friday I'm in the gym yep
01:09:02and after you have repetition and you
01:09:04have enough of it that is when we get to
01:09:05the third R which is rituals what are
01:09:09rituals rituals are actually deeply
01:09:12embedded neural
01:09:14Pathways that when we repeat an action
01:09:16over and over again that action becomes
01:09:18automatic because neural Pathways have
01:09:20been
01:09:21formed our brain has quite literally
01:09:24been trans formed through the repetitive
01:09:28action simple example mom reminded me to
01:09:31brush my teeth yeah over and over again
01:09:34repetitively I don't need mom anymore to
01:09:36rebind because it's a ritual right it's
01:09:39the same with the cultivating a you know
01:09:41a tennis forehand initially the coach
01:09:44reminds me you get your your hand up you
01:09:46know meet the ball here and you do it
01:09:49again and again right and then you wake
01:09:50up Serena Williams in the middle of the
01:09:52night she'll hit that forehand that's
01:09:54true perfectly because it's a ritual
01:09:56it's a habit there are neural Pathways
01:09:58associated with that whether it's for
01:10:01hugging your loved ones whether it's for
01:10:03acts of kindness we can actually
01:10:06ritualize them now to many people this
01:10:08this sounds like you know the absence of
01:10:10spontaneity you know if you ritualize
01:10:12things I'm not against spontaneity it's
01:10:14great but if you want to bring about
01:10:16lasting change the only reliable way
01:10:19that we know about is by cultivating
01:10:22rituals and you do that through reminder
01:10:25and repetition well and there's a fourth
01:10:28R which is the fact that it's not about
01:10:32the fact that you're removing
01:10:33spontaneity you're removing something
01:10:35else your resistance to doing something
01:10:38new and if I bring this full circle to
01:10:42um the topic of being a happier
01:10:47you and the fact that in your definition
01:10:51of wholeness and the five elements of
01:10:54Happiness which all tie to
01:10:58well-being that you could apply the
01:11:03reminder the
01:11:04repetition over and over and over in
01:11:07each of those five elements going to
01:11:09church or to Temple or to mosque or if
01:11:13your church version is taking a walk in
01:11:16the woods making that something that you
01:11:19repeat so that it becomes a ritual that
01:11:23these things and I and I'm I'm Su I'm
01:11:26suspecting that this is why you are an
01:11:31unwavering
01:11:32Optimist in people's
01:11:36ability absolutely anyone's ability to
01:11:40be
01:11:41happier you know Helen Keller who's one
01:11:45of my teachers has an essay on optimism
01:11:50which I highly recommend uh that that
01:11:53you read and um in it she says my
01:11:57religion is
01:11:59optimism and she says I look around
01:12:02metaphorically I look around the world
01:12:04and um and what I see is a lot of
01:12:07hardship and difficulty what I also see
01:12:10is the overcoming of
01:12:12it and she was a consummate Optimist I
01:12:15mean how could she have not been you
01:12:17know given the hand that she was uh
01:12:20dealt and she still lived a a happy life
01:12:23a full and fulfilling life and I think
01:12:26there is a very important
01:12:28lesson that we can uh learn from her and
01:12:31if I may I just want to recommend
01:12:32something else by Helen Keller please so
01:12:35the essay on optimism the second one is
01:12:39an essay that she wrote called three
01:12:41days to
01:12:43see in it she reflects on what she would
01:12:45do if you know having been um blind and
01:12:49deaf for most of her life what would she
01:12:51do if she were to regain her hearing or
01:12:55Vision what would she do for 3 days and
01:12:58she talks about it and she talks about
01:13:00how important it is to appreciate not
01:13:02take for granted the things that we have
01:13:04and I have Helen Keller's essay next to
01:13:07me as a reminder a reminder a to
01:13:10appreciate and as a
01:13:13reminder uh of the religion of
01:13:15optimism wow wow Dr Tall Ben Shahar
01:13:21thank you thank you thank you you you
01:13:25made a huge difference in my life and I
01:13:26know that you just made an enormous
01:13:28difference in helping people around the
01:13:32world be happier thank you Mel and what
01:13:36I'm most grateful for in terms of your
01:13:39work is that you created a bridge
01:13:41between evidencebased
01:13:44academic ideas and you make them
01:13:46accessible oh that's a massive
01:13:50compliment coming from you I accept that
01:13:52thank you thank you and for you
01:13:54listening I just wanted to be sure in
01:13:56case nobody else tells you that I tell
01:13:59you that I love you and I believe in you
01:14:01and I know I speak for both of us when I
01:14:03say we believe in your ability to take
01:14:08action and do the little things every
01:14:11single day that will bring more
01:14:13happiness into your life now go do it
01:14:16I'll talk to you in a few
01:14:17days don't you love him I love you thank
01:14:20you thank you thank you for being here
01:14:22with us and me on YouTube it makes me so
01:14:25happy that you're here it also makes me
01:14:26happy that you share what you're
01:14:27learning so thank you for sharing this
01:14:29episode thank you for subscribing it
01:14:31just takes a second it's a small thing
01:14:32you can do to support me in bringing you
01:14:35this amazing content and I know what
01:14:37you're thinking now Mel what do I watch
01:14:39next well you're going to want to watch
01:14:40this this is an episode that we did
01:14:43about the formula for happiness and it's
01:14:45with Sean Anker and what's super cool
01:14:48about this is that he was a student of
01:14:50Dr Tall Ben Shahar how cool is that
01:14:52check it out
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