00:00so Subaru owners have another engine
00:02issue to be concerned with this is an
00:05issue with the tcv not the CVT and not
00:09tgvs the tcv the thermal control valve
00:13we're going to talk about that in
00:24video so guys yes unfortunately there is
00:27a new issue with modern Subaru now this
00:30isn't a brand new issue as of today as
00:32of making this video it has been an
00:34issue since 2019 2020 model year when
00:37this part was introduced on these
00:38vehicles so if you've bought a newer
00:40Subaru within the last 5 years or so
00:42youve probably heard of this issue
00:43already or have experienced this issue
00:45in the past and that is an issue with
00:48the tcv not the CVT not the CVT this
00:51time it's the tcv I know a lot of
00:53acronyms the thermal control valve so
00:56the thermal control valve was introduced
00:58in 2019 2020 model year depending on
01:01what vehicle you have and has had a high
01:04failure rate since this introduction now
01:07what is a thermal control valve so what
01:09it is essentially is a big old chunk of
01:12plastic with some metal bit sensors
01:14wires Etc glump all together and stuck
01:17under your intake manifold and what it
01:20does is replace the tried true and
01:22tested mechanical thermostat that has
01:24been in engines basically since the
01:26beginning of internal combustion engines
01:28now why did subar go and put this
01:31monstrosity on their engines especially
01:34knowing that most of the German brands
01:36have been doing this for about 20 years
01:38now and know that there's issues and
01:40high failure rates with them when you go
01:42to these plastic and electronic water
01:44pumps and thermostats thermal control
01:46valves Etc there's a high failure rate
01:48and it's an expensive failure when it
01:51does fail I know a lot of you have
01:53messaged me in the past about the tcvs
01:55and the failures and having to pay out
01:57of pocket when the warranty for the car
02:00out and this can be a $1,200 repair it
02:02can be a $2,000 repair it just depends
02:04on the area you're at what the labor
02:06rate is and how badly the dealership is
02:08marking the parts up that is like head
02:11gasket replacement money on the older EJ
02:13series engines or a full engine out
02:15reeal on the modern f-s series engines
02:17but back to the explanation what is it
02:20why is it there's probably lots of good
02:22reasons why Subaru went to this thermal
02:24control valve over a regular thermostat
02:26I don't know exactly what those are I'm
02:28assuming to get every ounce of fuel
02:31economy out of the engine as they could
02:33lessen the emissions output as much as
02:35they could and just have better control
02:38over the heating and cooling of the
02:41engine now did it work no it's been a
02:44high failure rate part again what they
02:46did was replace a big old chunk of
02:49aluminum the regular old coolant
02:50crossover pipe we've had in basically
02:53all the subar boxer engines it's got two
02:55ports that connect the engine block
02:57Hales together it's got one that hooks
03:00up to the upper radiator hose one that
03:03hooks up to the heater core and uh this
03:06pipe here is for the PCV Union on the fs
03:09Series this is off of an f-s series
03:10engine uh but the EJ series was
03:12basically a straight through pipe heater
03:13core radiator and the engine block Hales
03:16it helps to circulate coolant from one
03:18half of the engine to the other to the
03:20radiator and the heater core very simple
03:23does not fail the only place of failure
03:24you really have are the two ceiling
03:27O-rings on the bottom where it hooks up
03:29to the engine block cves other than that
03:31it's a big chunk of aluminum it's not
03:33really going to fail and it replaced
03:35this the tried true tested old school
03:37mechanical thermostat they're about 60
03:39bucks from Subaru and people were like
03:41why are Subaru thermostats so expensive
03:44but I've found issues with not using
03:46Subaru genuine thermostat it's always
03:47springing for the genuine thermostat so
03:50why did they replace this and this with
03:53this overly complex part now again I
03:55don't know exactly why only Subaru and
03:58their Engineers can tell but again I
04:00think it has to do with trying to
04:01maximize fuel economy control of heating
04:03in the engine and lessening those
04:06emissions now which engines and cars
04:09does this pertain to uh I believe it was
04:112019 in the cross Trek and the Forester
04:14and 2020 in Legacy and Outback when they
04:16started putting this in now this is only
04:18for the direct fuel injected naturally
04:20aspirated 2.5 so if you sprung for an XT
04:23you got a turbo model you don't have to
04:25worry about this if you've got a WX
04:26you've got a 2 L turbo you don't have to
04:28worry about this and if you got a BRZ
04:30you don't have to worry about this
04:31either this is basically for cross Trek
04:33empreza Forester Legacy Outback
04:37naturally aspirated 2.5 L engines from
04:402019 2020 to current now the
04:43thermocontrol valve has a higher failure
04:45rate because it is polycarbonate plastic
04:49There's issues with the housing cracking
04:51leaking coolant There's issues with the
04:53temperature sensor inside failing
04:55There's issues with the motor that moves
04:59the valve to open and close and regulate
05:01the flow of coolant failing so this part
05:03has a high failure rate how will I know
05:05if I have this failure going on in my
05:07Subaru vehicle what are some signs and
05:09symptoms well you'll pretty much know
05:11right away you'll get a check engine
05:13light on your eyesight will be disabled
05:15all the warning lights will be up on the
05:17dash plug in a scan tool you will have
05:21p0128 for coolant temperature failure to
05:24reach minimum threshold you'll have like
05:30there's lots of different codes
05:31associated with this failure and there's
05:33lots of different symptoms associated
05:35with this failure now as far as I know
05:37there's two different versions of the
05:38part they've redesigned it around 2022
05:41or so but there's still failures on both
05:43the original and the new redesign now
05:46there's two different ways that it can
05:47fail well there's more than that but
05:50it's basically like a thermostat failing
05:52open or failing closed this valve can
05:54fail in the same manner if it fails
05:57closed it will overheat your engine
06:00cause engine damage if you continue
06:02driving it if it fails open your engine
06:04just will not reach operational
06:06temperature it will always be cool and
06:08you won't get much heat if any at all
06:10out of your heater now that is the
06:14optimal way you want it to fail open
06:17that way you can still drive the car
06:18you're not going to be issues until you
06:20can get it replaced if it fails shut
06:22you're pretty much screwed and have to
06:23fix it right away now as far as I know
06:26the new part has been designed to fail
06:28open but you can't guarantee with an
06:30electronic system that it will fail open
06:33on a mechanical thermostat you can have
06:35a fail safe where it fails open but uh
06:38it's a little bit tricky on this part
06:41with the plastic electronics and sensors
06:43all kind of issues bed all the way
06:45around should not be on the car in my
06:48opinion and Subaru honestly realized
06:50that this was a big screw up because on
06:51the 2025 subar Forester the new redesign
06:56you'll note that there is no thermal
06:57control valve looks like they've gone
06:59back back to a mechanical thermostat and
07:01a regular coolant crossover pipe they
07:04realized they screwed up and backpedal
07:06on this design so on February of 2022
07:09Subaru issued a technical service
07:11bulletin about this thermal control
07:12valve failure and introduced their new
07:14redesign of the part now it's pretty
07:17much the same part looking at it it's
07:19just three different things really that
07:20they changed on the inside uh they
07:23changed the molding resin on the housing
07:26to make it less susceptible to cracking
07:28and leakage uh they tried to better the
07:31waterproofing on the temperature sensor
07:33to again prevent coolant and water
07:35getting in there and corroding that
07:36sensor out and they changed out and
07:39enhanced the stainless steel shaft in
07:42the internal part of it so they did a
07:45little bit of tweaking to it but it's
07:47still a big plastic hunk of junk if you
07:49wanted it to last you made it out of
07:51aluminum and it would have cost three
07:53times as much this thing is not cheap
07:55it's plastic and uh you know some metal
07:58bits and electronics and stepper motor
08:01and all this other stuff and it's almost
08:03$400 I'm sure if they made the part out
08:05of full aluminum and like made it a
08:07really nice part it'd be like $1,200 if
08:09not more so not sure how they're going
08:12to long-term fix this looks like it's
08:15just going to be an issue that has to be
08:16bandaged and repaired from now until
08:19there's like in a delete kit or a
08:21retrofit kit but then you have to go
08:23through and do a software update and
08:25just it's going to be a mess in the
08:28foreseeable future so so that was their
08:332022 change the part fix the part
08:36upgrade the part and uh you know change
08:39it out and the silver lining in all of
08:41this is that Subaru just the other day
08:44ironically enough on April Fool's Day
08:46April 1st of 2024 they issued at TSB
08:50another technical service bulletin on an
08:52extended warranty for the tcv now that
08:56extended warranty is good for 15 years
08:59or 150,000 Mi on the part I believe the
09:02standard subar warranty now is like 3
09:05years 30,000 Mi or 3 years 60,000 Mi I
09:09can't remember all the companies are
09:10changing their warranties on their
09:12vehicles but now you have an extended
09:14warranty of 15 years or 150,000 Mi now
09:18if you're over that you're still screwed
09:20and got to out of pocket
09:21that uh because I think it's whichever
09:24comes first so if it's uh it's either 15
09:26years or 150,000 miles it's not you know
09:30in between so if you got over 150,000
09:32miles on your 2020 you're going have to
09:34pay for this out of pocket again they
09:37need to figure out a long-term solution
09:39for this they need to figure out how to
09:43make this right because this is going to
09:44be a continuing issue until the part is
09:47completely redesigned it's no longer an
09:48issue but I don't think that they can
09:50make this part be no longer an issue or
09:53not fail just because of the nature of
09:55the part they should have stuck the way
09:57they were with manual stats and a
10:00regular coolant crossover pipe and
10:01they've learned that this is a big screw
10:03up because again like I said the 2025
10:06does not have the thermal control valve
10:08they realize this this was a blunder
10:10this was a misstep and now we've got a
10:135year model range year of vehicles that
10:15are just going to have continuing issues
10:18with this until there is a permanent
10:20solution so just be wary of that guys if
10:22you're looking at a 2019 2020 to up to
10:252024 model year Subaru and it's not a
10:29turbocharged one and it's not a WRX not
10:32BRZ you got to think about the issue
10:35with this tcv you got to think about the
10:37failure you got to think about replacing
10:39that paying someone to replace it or
10:41replacing yourself the downtime all of
10:44this stuff it's just a another headache
10:46and another mark on Subaru another black
10:49eye form we went through the head gasket
10:51issues of the ejs now the oil leakage
10:54issues the SS series and now the later
10:56FS series is having this issue as well
11:00with their thermal control valves it's
11:02just always something now before again
11:04you get in the comments and saying
11:05Subaru is a piece of junk Subaru is
11:07trash and doging them every single car
11:10manufacturer whether it's GM or Ford or
11:13your beloved Toyota everyone loves the
11:15gloat about they all have failures they
11:18all have common issues there's always
11:20something going to break on it anything
11:21mechanical will break eventually it will
11:24wear out it's just the way it is so just
11:27letting you guys know educating you guys
11:29on this part on this failure so you can
11:32be informed an informed consumer is a
11:34powerful consumer know that this is a
11:37potential issue can crop up don't be
11:39stressed out don't be nervous about it
11:41again you got the extended warranty to
11:43cover those of you that are not over
11:44150,000 miles yet and uh For You Second
11:48owners or third owners of these vehicles
11:50you just got to be aware of it uh we'll
11:53be making a DIY how to replace this soon
11:56enough when I get my hands on one to
11:58actually film and do
11:59but it's not that complicated it's not
12:01that difficult it's just a timec
12:03consuming thing with having to drain the
12:05cooling system acquire all the parts get
12:07that $400 thermocontrol valve and then
12:09take off your upper plenum intake
12:11manifold all that mess and get in there
12:13and there's lots of wires and pigtails
12:15and hoses and things to switch around
12:17and change and there's actually been
12:19some fires I know that uh there was some
12:21fires people had their thermal control
12:23valves uh replaced and then their car
12:25burned to the ground leaving the
12:26dealership because uh people weren't
12:28twering or light in these high pressure
12:30fuel lines and they were spraying gas
12:31under the hood and uh there was a couple
12:33Subarus that burned up because of this
12:35right here uh so uh yeah we we'll show
12:40you how to do it right we'll make that
12:42video in due time as soon as I can get
12:44my hands on one anyone that lives in the
12:46Northford South Carolina area and you
12:48have a failed thermal control valve on
12:50your Subaru let me know hit me up email
12:53if you want to bring it to me to repair
12:55it I'll give you a great deal on the
12:57labor as long as you let me film the car
12:59to get this information out to you other
13:01Subaru owners I would greatly appreciate
13:03that thank you guys so much for watching
13:05hope you enjoyed the video and I'll see
13:07you all in the next one
