00:01happen we got through it
00:04together we're there we're on the other
00:07side see you want to pass it around to
00:09somebody yep I'll pass it to
00:12SEMA yeah hi everyone um hi an I'm the
00:16I'm SEMA I'm based out of Dallas Texas
00:18um I'm with the literacy Architects and
00:20we are designing cohort-based learning
00:22experiences for reading and writing
00:24teachers um so we're in the K12 space
00:27and our main like Partnerships and you
00:31know our main clients are um school
00:33districts and schools and we're with um
00:37our new like model of cohort-based
00:39learning we're starting to Pilot with
00:42different districts and I guess I'm
00:44interested in learning like when you
00:47know some of our Pilots some of the
00:49districts are coming to us and like
00:50wanting like significant like changes to
00:54our model like um and sometimes our
00:57content too so I guess I'm thinking like
01:00wondering like how far to stray from
01:03like what our core offering is or like
01:05how much to change for different um
01:08people and for different partners um
01:10when when we're starting to examine some
01:12of these yeah and would you consider
01:14districts your customers yes
01:25sorry awesome thank you SEMA hey hey um
01:30co-founder of workit we're based in
01:32technically the us but I'm currently in
01:33Canada in Toronto uh we're also
01:36designing cohort based uh experiences
01:38for us is for um more of individual
01:42roles so the first role that we're doing
01:43is for product management um we're bring
01:45bring together a community of mentors
01:47peers coaches to really help product
01:49managers design what comes next in their
01:50careers um launching in September
01:53basically in four weeks which I'm super
01:54excited but also super scared of uh but
01:57is coming along and I'm here just to
01:59listen I don't have any particular
02:00questions we we currently have a
02:02partnership uh that's been pretty
02:04fruitful with um just local organization
02:08local nonprofit in Colorado um but just
02:11looking to expand in other Partnerships
02:13so just wanted to just hear your wisdom
02:15I'll pass it to Anna great that sounds
02:17good good luck with your launch also
02:20thank you so much um I I have a favor to
02:22ask at the end of this session um maybe
02:25you guys could explain to me the
02:26difference between cohort-based fill-in
02:33class because I think we just reinvented
02:36classes but I would like to know the
02:38difference that's sure we'll talk about
02:44afterwards hello and um I'm Anna um I'm
02:47building cido which is a Marketplace for
02:50high school students and young
02:52professionals um and we're doing career
02:55exploration exposure for high school
02:57students um by facilitating the
02:59conversation with uh young professionals
03:03um and I am very drawn to um this um
03:08this talk uh with you um because a big
03:12part of strategy of cido is to um to do
03:15a lot of Partnerships uh with student
03:18Outreach and uh young advisor young
03:20professional advisor Outreach so that
03:22means that we're um looking into
03:25nonprofits as well as um um like um
03:29business organizations um like young
03:31adult business organizations as well
03:34perhaps even as employers and schools to
03:37increase our um accessibility to
03:39students um and to um get more advisors
03:43on board um so very curious to hear from
03:46you um you know if you have any
03:48experiences um kind of involving like
03:53organizations uh of Partnerships um and
03:56I think uh some of us have said um with
04:00um um Partnerships you do have some
04:03troubles in kind of like navigating the
04:06um what they want versus what you want
04:09so yes kind of like understanding how to
04:11keep a balance on that uh for the future
04:14so thank you for your wise words uh in
04:18alette thank you Anna so I think some of
04:21the patterns that I heard are I guess
04:23like early stage Partnerships that might
04:25drive growth and actually be pretty
04:27Central to the product and the
04:28experience of the users
04:30um kind of the fine line between uh I
04:33guess Aqua hires at the really early
04:34stage and Partnerships um and I guess
04:37also content Partnerships um and just I
04:40think General like a general exploration
04:42of Partnerships that R and I were just
04:43mostly curious about um so with that
04:47I'll pass it to you and uh feel free to
04:49kind of share a little bit more about
04:51yourself and about uh kind of the the
04:53experience that you bring in um to
04:56Partnerships I guess I'll preface it by
04:57saying that and and I connected recently
05:00um in the context of corsera because Nea
05:04is an investor at in corsera and we've
05:07been exchanging a lot of ideas recently
05:09um and yeah I just super excited to
05:12bring in Anna to some of our work in our
05:14community and her expertise as an
05:17operator and now on the investment side
05:19so thank you for being here Anna and
05:21I'll pass it to you that sounds great
05:24thank you Alberto thank you for inviting
05:27me here I'm really excited about what
05:29you're all building through this network
05:32and um you know the future of work
05:34future of learning it's definitely a big
05:36interest area of mine and in a personal
05:38passion point so very exciting to meet
05:40all of you and um I'll give you a little
05:42bit of background and maybe just really
05:44quickly share kind of you know how I
05:47think um companies sort of derive value
05:49from Partnerships to give us a little
05:51bit of a framework but really I would
05:52love to just brainstorm with you the
05:54questions that you have so that you're
05:56you're getting something from the
05:57session because Partnerships and
05:59business development in general like
06:01that could be a cohort-based class in
06:03and of itself um there's a lot of ground
06:06to cover but to give you a sense I'm a
06:08partner at Nea Nea is um you know a
06:12story Venture Capital firm we've been
06:13around for I think 40 years or so so
06:16definitely built a venture capital and a
06:18big chunk of Silicon Valley um I joined
06:21as a partner about six months ago uh
06:23formerly an operator for many many years
06:26and I focus on both consumer and
06:28Enterprise investing at the SE to series
06:30B stage a lot of what I'm focused on
06:33right now is future of work and kind of
06:34future of learning as part of that and
06:38um but uh prior to all of this I spent
06:42many many years in business development
06:44and so um just to give you a sense my
06:47first job ever after college was working
06:50for one of the top environmental
06:52nonprofits in the country the nrdc I
06:54went to DC you know wanted to save the
06:56world um from a sustainability persp
06:59perspective and I actually kind of cut
07:01my teeth on building public private
07:02Partnerships political alliances um kind
07:06of in the policy and political world um
07:08then after getting my MBA I went into
07:11Tech um you know and worked at a number
07:13of different companies but always in the
07:15business development capacity so
07:17commercial Partnerships government
07:18Affairs um then when I moved into sort
07:21of more mainstream consumer Tech um at
07:24Twitter and Uber really focused on
07:27growth Partnerships product partners
07:29ships platform Partnerships and just
07:31sort of like the the Partnerships and
07:33business development side of fast
07:35growing tech companies so I won't bore
07:38you with my background because I you
07:40know there's a lot in there related to
07:42to Partnerships but I think you know the
07:44reason I was excited to do this session
07:46on this topic is I think my own
07:48experience is that Partnerships are an
07:50incredible way for young companies and
07:53growing companies and certainly mature
07:55companies but even young companies to
07:57get a lot of Leverage um but you have to
07:59do it the right way because you know
08:01Partnerships sound good but they take a
08:03tremendous amount of effort and kind of
08:05the right approach or it could end up
08:07being something that you spend a lot of
08:08time on and your young company and young
08:11team doesn't get any value from or worse
08:13yet somebody else gets all the value and
08:15you walk away with nothing right so I
08:18want to share a little bit of a
08:20framework and then kind of dive into the
08:22questions so um you know I think first
08:25off it's helpful to think about um what
08:29you know how like what can you get from
08:31a partnership or more importantly like
08:33what can Partnerships and Business
08:34Development really do for a technology
08:37first company a product Le company which
08:40all of you are right um number one is
08:44product so oftentimes Partnerships are
08:47very helpful in going from the product
08:49you've built to the whole product that
08:51your customers expect right that could
08:54be you know integrating different
08:56Services sort of foundational elements
08:58of the product that you need in order to
09:01stand up kind of the full Suite of
09:03features that your customers expect but
09:06I think a lot of how Partnerships add
09:08value in the early days is around
09:09helping you to fill out the product so
09:12that your customer is getting the
09:13complete experience that they expect
09:15right so let's just take notion for
09:18example right like notion needs partners
09:20for notion as a product to actually be
09:22usable right it needs Integrations it
09:24needs to connect with other services and
09:27sometimes you can do that off the shelf
09:28but sometimes you need bespoke
09:30Partnerships to actually build the right
09:32product so that's one category two is
09:35distribution it's a big way that
09:37Partnerships can help you at different
09:39stages distribution can be um you know
09:42unlocking new user acquisition channels
09:44through marketing Partnerships right or
09:47Integrations it you know if you're a SAS
09:50company that could be Channel
09:51Partnerships right where somebody else
09:53is reselling or marketing your product
09:55to their customers um it could be
09:58different kinds of marketing
09:59Partnerships but distribution getting
10:01you in front of the customers that you
10:02are trying to acquire is a great place
10:06Partnerships um three is testing new
10:09markets and products right um this is
10:13kind of a complicated one and it wasn't
10:15an area of interest in these um in in in
10:17in the questions that you describ so
10:19I'll spend less time on this one but I
10:22Partnerships are a great way to do trial
10:25balloons of new products new geograph
10:29graic markets New Vertical markets that
10:31you might be interested in before you
10:34commit to a product investment a full
10:37kind of product buildout to do something
10:39so finding partners that can help you
10:42test the waters and really learn so
10:44think of them as like learning testing
10:46iterating kind of innovation
10:48Partnerships that allow you to kind of
10:49test the waters before you commit to a
10:52strategy as a company fourth is growth
10:55and expansion like bread and butter of
10:57of commercial partnership ship
10:59partnering with someone to go into a new
11:01country to create a new business line um
11:05Etc and the fifth I would say is moat so
11:09and you see a lot of companies kind of
11:11doing this as they mature you know the
11:12sales forces of the world the slacks of
11:14the world um how do you use Partnerships
11:18to kind of build a moat around the
11:20ecosystem that you've created and Corner
11:23the indust the industry that you're in
11:25in terms of relationships so that it's
11:27much harder for new ENT to come in
11:29because you've kind of tied up all the
11:31key commercial players in the category
11:33that you're in that helps you build mod
11:36so product distribution testing new
11:38opportunities growth and mo I think are
11:41the five key ways that Partnerships can
11:44create value for product L
11:47companies and um you know I think like
11:51Partnerships is a colloquial term like
11:54the common term gets used so many
11:56different ways like anything can be
11:57called a partnership right and I'm not
11:59really referring to that because you
12:02know a customer is a customer you might
12:03call them a partner because you want
12:05them to feel important right and you
12:08want to Foster that relationship but uh
12:11you know for example see I think you
12:13mentioned school districts like school
12:16districts are a great example you might
12:18call them a partner but really really
12:42withit they could be
12:53doing my connection might be but where
12:57you can really sort of
13:04um and we're having a hard time um
13:07hearing you I think you uh can can you
13:13us can you guys still hear me yeah we
13:23hello oh I think this sorry about that
13:28good me here um no worries we lost
13:32you when when you were talking about the
13:34difference between uh partners and
13:37customers that's the last part we so the
13:39te there is like when I speak about
13:42partners and just for your thinking
13:43about what is a partnership it is you
13:46know in its nature kind of a commercial
13:47relationship where you figure out how to
13:49create value for each other right
13:51there's Mutual value getting created and
13:53it's always something that you should be
13:55able to quantify in a very specific way
13:57it's not a feel-good thing we just kind
13:59of do things together it should have a
14:01direct benefit on a metric that you
14:04really care about and need for your
14:06company that could be Revenue growth it
14:08could be user growth it could be
14:10eliminating you know a specific risk
14:12that exists to your company and so
14:14that's something to strive for you know
14:16in Partnerships they should be either
14:17making you money or saving you money
14:20right or you know unlocking some new
14:23kind of expansion opportunity um versus
14:26just you know things you're trying out
14:27with companies that you want to shared
14:29logos with like resist the temptation to
14:31go down that path make it very um kind
14:34of metrics and numbers driven to make
14:36sure it's moving the needle because and
14:38the reason for this is really important
14:40because um almost without exception
14:43Partnerships require product engineering
14:45marketing and legal resources from your
14:47team so if you're going to invest those
14:49resources that means you're not doing
14:51something else right on your product
14:53road map so you have to make sure it's
14:56going to move the needle for you right
14:57and and if you quantify Partnerships
14:59it's obviously easier to kind of make
15:01those tradeoffs as you're allocating
15:03resources so maybe let's with that let's
15:09the some of the uh questions that that
15:12you had um and let me I'm I'm trying to
15:16think through like the best way to kind
15:18of navigate um yeah all of these but you
15:22know I think um there were a couple
15:24questions around sort of you know um
15:29how you know what can Partnerships do
15:31for you um and um you know I think in
15:36the framework I covered a little bit of
15:37that but I think this is you know you're
15:39all kind of early stage companies and so
15:42I would say you know there's a lot that
15:44you probably can do but what's you know
15:47you should be spending the majority of
15:49your time on partners that can
15:51essentially Drive distribution for you
15:55right and at the very early days I think
16:00um of company building the way to think
16:02about distribution Partnerships is sort
16:04of like how do they perform relative to
16:06other marketing channels you have both
16:09organic and paid um and so you know um
16:13for example looking at you know if I do
16:15a co-marketing campaign with this uh
16:18with this partner am I going to acquire
16:21new users potentially more efficiently
16:23than if I were to do a paid marketing
16:25campaign on Facebook or Instagram right
16:28to ire that same user so thinking about
16:31it in terms of marketing
16:32efficiency um uh and then you know and I
16:36think that's sort of like a very simple
16:38framework that will help you prioritize
16:40like which Partners can do that for you
16:42or not is it worth the resource
16:44Investments versus other options
16:46available to you and just to give you as
16:48an example when we were doing growth
16:49Partnerships at Uber um for a long time
16:53the way that we actually measured the
16:56deals that we were willing to do was
16:58whether or not the user acquisition
17:02cost um uh essentially like could we get
17:06partner channels where the CAC would be
17:0930% more efficient than our paid
17:12channels and so the idea with deals was
17:15you know they take time effort obviously
17:17you know you want to get like a
17:19significant amount of Leverage on you
17:21know um user acquisition through those
17:24channels um you know sometimes in the
17:26early days you do need partnership to
17:28kind of validate your product I didn't
17:30mention that before but you know if
17:32you're selling to school districts is
17:34there partnership with an association or
17:36some sort of a nonprofit where if they
17:39kind of certify you or you work with
17:41them it gives you this kind of
17:42credibility Halo I think it is okay to
17:45do those in the early days right even if
17:47they're not necessarily driving growth
17:49because they're going to help you unlock
17:50customers and I think of that as almost
17:52like a product partnership in the early
17:54days they're validating your product
17:55right um so that so that your customers
17:58can get excited about it um you know in
18:02terms of sort of um you know I think a
18:05couple questions came up around um like
18:08Discovery essentially like how do you
18:10even figure out what's worth doing and
18:13so a lot of successful partnership
18:16building is actually that front-end
18:19process of really figuring out like
18:22beyond the logo of like I'd love to have
18:24a press release where we're both you
18:26know on it together but beyond like what
18:29are the top priorities of your the
18:32partner that you're considering right um
18:35and then being both sort of datadriven
18:37and creative in figuring out like can do
18:41you move the needle for them and can
18:43they move the needle for you right and
18:46so um I think that is a process you
18:51don't want to skimp on and I think the
18:52way to do it is you know whatever
18:56considering you know down with them even
18:59if it's just for 30 minutes because
19:00you're short on time you're startup
19:02Founders right and ask them like what
19:04are your top business priorities in the
19:07next 12 months you know if you're
19:09talking to the founder the CEO they
19:11should know the answer and if you're
19:12talking to someone you know who's
19:13running bizav and say you know what are
19:16the top three you know metrics or the
19:18top three kpis or the top three goals
19:21that you're reporting to your SE Suite
19:22on in the next 12 months then you get a
19:25sense of like what does this person
19:26actually care about at the end of the
19:27day right like what are they going to go
19:29to bat for and then um I think you want
19:32to be really transparent too of what's
19:34in it for you so if again if it's you
19:38distribution um you know if it's access
19:41to a particular customer if it's you
19:43know a new kind of product experience or
19:45integration the clearer you can be in
19:48describing like hey here's my number one
19:50priority for the next 12 months um you
19:53know that the easier it'll be to see
19:55like do your interest align
19:59and one of the most important things in
20:01Partnerships is to know like when to
20:03walk early because you know you you meet
20:06people you like there's someone you
20:08might want to do something with you
20:10could keep chatting for a very long time
20:13that's not the goal in Partnership
20:14building it's to identify whether
20:17there's mutual interest and mutual
20:18opportunity if there isn't put a pin in
20:20it and say great I would love to work
20:22with you in the future let's check back
20:24in 12 months maybe our priorities will
20:26align better then and don't waste too
20:28much of your time on Partnerships and
20:30conversations more importantly that
20:31aren't going to take you anywhere um and
20:34so you know what I often do at the front
20:37end of a partnership is I'll have that
20:39conversation and then I'll have a
20:40brainstorm with a partner like okay what
20:43channels do you have access to what
20:45resources do you have access to you know
20:47mapping out like again more often than
20:50not I think you guys are going to do
20:51distribution Partnerships like mapping
20:53out their channels their marketing
20:55channels what kind of a social presence
20:57do they have do they have access to
21:00people on email what's the size of their
21:02customer base right what kind of
21:04customers do they have you know mapping
21:06some of that out so you can see okay
21:08here are some things that I could tap
21:10into for myself and then brainstorming
21:12like how could we design a partnership
21:14where you know um we're you know you're
21:17driving a metric for me I'm driving a
21:19metric for you um the the secret of a
21:22lot of Partnerships is that you don't
21:24actually want it to be one-sided
21:26sometimes it feels awesome to be like
21:28hey they're just like promoting us and
21:30like we're getting all this value for
21:33free but if the other side isn't getting
21:35something out of it How likely are they
21:37really to prioritize you right or stick
21:40with you after an initial partnership so
21:42always make sure that the value is
21:43Flowing both ways to make sure that you
21:45have a really committed partner who's
21:47going to do what they say most
21:49partnership values created not in the
21:51term sheet not in the contract but in
21:53the follow through so it's like
21:55designing incentives make sure there's
21:57an incentive for for them to do what you
21:59want them to do and vice
22:01versa and um let me just stop there for
22:04a second just to make sure I'm like
22:06going down a path that's actually
22:07helpful to you in this
22:09conversation um do you guys want to jump
22:11in with some questions so far thank you
22:14so much an this is super super valuable
22:16I'm taking notes like a like a madman
22:18that we'll share later um uh so I think
22:21I I actually um had an idea I think
22:24before open it up before opening it up
22:26to questions uh I kind of wanted to hear
22:28here maybe some some examples of some
22:29Partnerships that you maybe drove at at
22:32some of the organizations that we're in
22:33whether it was Uber or Twitter um or
22:35some of the startups that you were in or
22:37even the kind of more on the nonprofit
22:39side uh because I feel like that might
22:41be helpful as we think about our own
22:43cases um if we have some of those
22:45examples from uh any Partnerships that
22:47you feel and that you can share of
22:49course um I think our answers might our
22:52questions might be a little bit more
22:54focused even so I'm curious if there's
22:55maybe an example or two that you feel
22:58comfortable sharing in terms of how you
23:00IDE ideated through it uh how you
23:02executed it uh and maybe the outcomes
23:05after it would be super cool to get into
23:07your kind of your your brain as a um I
23:11guess a BD executive in those situations
23:16yeah there's a lot let me try to think
23:18real quick and also a lot of that stuff
23:20does stay confidential typically um yeah
23:24whatever feels comfortable and and
23:26whatever you can no worries no worries
23:32um let's see I mean I'll I'll give you
23:34one example that was pretty well covered
23:38um so uh and this is a more complicated
23:42scenario so I actually not quite sure
23:44it's relevant to you guys but it's I'll
23:46tell the story anyway um you know when I
23:50was at Uber we had um created a number
23:53of different business lines right to
23:54help the company scale and grow and um
23:58one of those was creating an automotive
24:00leasing um business unit that would
24:02essentially Finance new cars for drivers
24:04people who wanted to drive and um you
24:08know didn't have access to a car and we
24:09thought we were doing a great service by
24:11essentially getting them into cheap cars
24:14um the you know I was kind of brought
24:17into a project um where uh you know our
24:21board who was kind of over uh overseeing
24:23and kind of looking into this business
24:25realized hey you know it's actually
24:26losing like $30 million a month for the
24:29company like it was in really bad shape
24:32and so we went through you know a really
24:34kind of intense 90day process of
24:37figuring out you know what do we do with
24:39this business unit um we have to sell it
24:42um but we have to be able to replace it
24:44with a partnership that is as good if
24:47not better than our own product so that
24:49we do not disrupt our business and a
24:51really important part of our business
24:52which is the driver's ability to log on
24:54to Uber and provide a ride to all of us
24:58and so you know what I did in that case
25:01um which you know is harder to replicate
25:04for a startup but um one I really
25:07thought about you know well um what it
25:11you know who who are the partners out
25:13there that would be interested in what
25:15we have that have a vested interest in
25:17kind of picking up these assets right
25:20and um who absolutely need a partnership
25:23with Uber in order for their business to
25:25thrive um I created a very competitive
25:28process for um uh to essentially invite
25:32kind of five to six players not
25:35everybody wasn't open but it was a very
25:37exclusive process that was designed to
25:39generate demand for the partnership
25:41where I said okay I'm going to invite
25:44the rental car companies because they
25:46need our business and a couple of other
25:48startups who are building new Mobility
25:51offerings and um I'm going to invite
25:53them to essentially bid on this
25:55partnership so I created a reverse
25:57auction where instead of me going to
25:59Partners and being like do you want to
26:01do this it's you know essentially take
26:03this like failing business off of our
26:05hands like that's a tough sell right so
26:07you got to work with what you've got um
26:10what I did was essentially turn the
26:12tables and say look if you take this
26:15business off of our hands in exchange
26:17for that we're going to give you this
26:19exclusive partnership to serve drivers
26:22going forward with your new Mobility
26:24offering and everybody wanted that and
26:26so uh you know in essentially 90 days we
26:29were able to uh a sell off that part of
26:33our business get cash back into the
26:35company a very meaningful amount in the
26:37hundreds of millions of dollars um and
26:40then you know for the benefit of our
26:42drivers really replace it with a much
26:44better product and um while that's hard
26:48to replicate for a startup I think
26:50that's actually a great example of like
26:52look you're in a tough spot and you will
26:54find this this you know you're in this
26:56situation many times throughout the
26:58company building and so you have to take
27:01you know you have to think creatively
27:02about how to kind of orchestrate a
27:05situation so that you know you have
27:08something that Partners want and you
27:10kind of trade that asset um trade that
27:13currency that you've got with your
27:16product your company your situation into
27:18something of value for partners and then
27:21create a very competitive process where
27:23you're in control of the timeline of the
27:26terms of the kind of um engagement
27:31process uh to kind of you know negotiate
27:35something like that effectively um and
27:39you know it it is hardest to do as a
27:41startup but it is possible because you
27:43know chances are you've got kind of a
27:46new product um or a new idea that people
27:49want to Rally around but as a startup
27:53it's very important to learn how to play
27:55up and kind of turn what you have into
27:57kind of an upperhand advantage versus
28:00always being kind of the small fish to
28:02somebody who's a bigger fish um and so
28:05something you should always be thinking
28:07about in Partnerships is you know how do
28:09you kind of play as an equal even if
28:10your company's very small and starting
28:13out um and make sure they understand
28:16that you you've got something they want
28:18and not the other way around even though
28:20in Practical terms in most cases they've
28:25want yeah that's super cool I I was I
28:28was trying to like map it out as well in
28:30terms of like there being a bit kind of
28:32a process of identifying kind of your uh
28:36your needs right then identifying those
28:39assets and then running that process and
28:42um I think something that we've noticed
28:44a lot in our work is um a lot of
28:46Founders kind of end up being in that uh
28:48kind of position where they um they they
28:52don't try to find that upper hand when
28:53they actually have a lot of value like a
28:55lot of companies that are willing to to
28:58pay up and uh sometimes be really really
29:02um give very large concessions to to the
29:05startups because they have something
29:06that is for them impossible it would
29:08take a lot of resources for them to get
29:10be able to get that asset or yeah that
29:13product there's a good question in here
29:15about can you test or trial a
29:17partnership for with an
29:19organization yeah this is actually a
29:21great way to begin Partnerships right
29:23it's low stakes for both sides but you
29:26know you essentially set up let's say a
29:2860-day trial period right and um again
29:33there's always a temptation to be like
29:35let's sign a commercial partnership at
29:37first but like then it's it takes longer
29:40to get to that and then both sides
29:42commit to something they don't know if
29:43it's going to work or not and it becomes
29:45a nightmare to manage so I think you
29:47know um you know let's say you're
29:49interested in partnering with somebody
29:51figure out a 30 to 60 day trial you
29:54usually that's a good window you want to
29:56know right away of like let's let's do
29:59activities and um you know uh metrics I
30:03mean metrics kind of depend on the you
30:06know on the business but it it should be
30:08a test to move a metric that you know is
30:13would get you to invest in the
30:15Partnership if that makes sense so if
30:18the reason you would invest in this
30:19partnership is because um you know
30:22they're driving user growth for you then
30:24you have to test the ability for you
30:26know what's the number of new users that
30:29are coming in through that partnership
30:31right um if you know the partnership is
30:37um you know uh let's say your you know
30:43um integrating with their API to offer a
30:47new feature right on your um on your
30:50product well maybe you Market that new
30:53feature to your customers before you do
30:55commit to the API integration or the
30:57product custom product integration you
31:00test you know how many customers are
31:02clicking to get this feature right or to
31:04get this kind of shared offer and if
31:07there's enough interest at the end of
31:08that 30 days and you're like great then
31:10our engineering team will do the work of
31:12essentially committing to this to this
31:14product partnership so I think the
31:16metrics really Ma you know don't have
31:18too many metrics pick pick one that
31:20matters um that will be your reason to
31:23invest more resources into that
31:24partnership and in most cases you know
31:29know Partners will want to do this with
31:31you right so um because they don't want
31:34to uh go down a long path of um you know
31:38committing a lot of resources to
31:40something that's not working either
31:43um and Zab I want to go back to your
31:46question because I think you had a
31:47question too about m&a and
31:50Partnerships and it's kind of hard to
31:52talk about it in generalities without
31:54knowing your your specific situation but
31:58you know when you're a young company a
31:59lot of people will um obviously you know
32:03a express interest in a partnership as a
32:05way to learn about your company um and
32:08and like look under the hood so you want
32:10to be aware of that what information you
32:12share with which companies which CEOs
32:14which you know BD people because
32:17sometimes you know that's just a way for
32:19Corp Dev to kind of figure out like is
32:21there a there there right um I think
32:25that one thing that's helpful as an
32:27Stage Company is you always want to have
32:30really warm friendly but well-managed
32:33relationships with kind of the big fish
32:36in your space right so if I were
32:38building kind of a you know let's say I
32:40was building like a new professional
32:42networking product um maybe I'd want to
32:45have a really warm relationship with
32:47LinkedIn right and some of the
32:48executives there but be really guarded
32:50in the information that I share um
32:53because you actually do want to tee up
32:56those m&a opport opportunities for
32:57yourself you always want to have options
33:00right as a Founder even if you want to
33:02go the Long Way having m&a interest is
33:04good it can help you rally fundraising
33:06rounds it can help you you know just
33:09have exit path options most of the time
33:12m&a opportunities don't materialize when
33:14you need them to they only materialize
33:17if you've already built a relationship
33:18for a long period of time and you've
33:20been fing inbound interest for a long
33:23time before you decide that that's the
33:25right path for your company and so
33:27always have those commercial
33:28relationships in in in your space to
33:32options um but let's say you are getting
33:35inbound and they're like we want to
33:37acquire you and you don't want to be
33:39acquired well that's an amazing leverage
33:41point to build a partnership right um
33:44and I think when you have that interest
33:46there's a number of different ways that
33:47you can convert it one is you could you
33:50know say to them like look we we don't
33:52want to be acquired we you know um we
33:56you know actually want to compete with
33:57you but you know if there's something we
33:59can do together like let's discuss right
34:02um you could bring them in as you know
34:05potentially an investor into your next
34:07round you could um you know get that
34:11design a partnership that you can do
34:13together right um you could um you know
34:18uh use them to kind of learn about the
34:21market right um and so I I don't know if
34:25that answers your question but
34:27um I think that the way to know what to
34:31get out of a specific relationship is
34:34like what is your endgame right um it
34:39should never be like what can I really
34:40get from them like if you know what your
34:42endgame is like where you want to go as
34:44the founder CEO what you want to
34:47accomplish then you'll be able to kind
34:49of negotiate and manage and move the
34:52pieces on the chessboard with these
34:55relationships to make that happen
34:57so you know make sure you're driving
34:59that train and not letting Partners kind
35:02of decide what the opportunity set is
35:05you that's super helpful um because
35:08that's exactly where I'm at right now I
35:10don't know if this is the space to like
35:11go into more details Alberto but yeah
35:17time um but yeah I mean you like kind of
35:21like set the stage for like exactly what
35:22I'm going through like I'm much more
35:24like a much smaller startup that is
35:26building a product and they've expressed
35:29a lot of interest in hiring me and like
35:32kind of like having us merge in to their
35:35company because they want that
35:37product um and I had never thought of
35:40like getting hired by another company
35:42I've been thinking like kind of this one
35:43track I want to be a Founder I want to
35:45build this product I want to you know
35:46create this impact and so I've been kind
35:50of like figuring out does this make
35:52sense is this like an opportunity that I
35:53shouldn't be passing up on or should I
35:56like stick to my guns and to try to just
35:58like continue building my product and
35:59finding like more low like barrier like
36:03partnership opportunities um so I think
36:07I I just keep going back and forth on
36:11that well I would just ask yourself how
36:14this helps you build your company and if
36:16you can't find a very fast answer to
36:20that or an obvious one pass move
36:24on well yeah they have a huge community
36:26help you build your company yeah yeah
36:29well they have two things that I I'm
36:31currently struggling one they have a
36:33really engaged community and like I'm
36:35building a community and then two they
36:37have investment and I'm like still preed
36:40so I don't have any of the
36:41infrastructure there and so they they're
36:43like well you know you could build it
36:45the the company you know with us like
36:47we'll provide you with all the resources
36:49and the infrastructure and stuff and so
36:51it's tempting but at the same time I'm
36:53like I don't know is that what I really
36:55want but it's also interesting that you
36:57were talking about the IP like not
36:59giving you know too much up because
37:02we're on the in the same space so we
37:04care about the same thing so a part of
37:05me is like oh maybe we should be sharing
37:07everything you know what I mean and
37:08building together but at the same time
37:11well if there's they're showing interest
37:12in building a product like mine that
37:14they they're a potential competitor
37:16right so so the other way in your
37:18situation since you're preed right so um
37:21you know that's a unique situation where
37:23like maybe you do want to consider that
37:25option I would sit down and write down
37:28like what are the conditions under which
37:32you would say yes to
37:34this okay you know what amount of
37:36funding what compensation package what
37:40you know are they gonna give you
37:42dedicated budget and resources are they
37:44going to give you $5 million a year to
37:47to create this new product and if those
37:50you know and so like what would it take
37:52for you to be excited and for this to
37:54make sense and for it to work
37:57and you kind of like aim really really
37:59high like really like you know you have
38:03leverage right now lay it all out and
38:05say like great I'm glad you guys are
38:07interested like I'm over here building a
38:09company if you want me to actually build
38:11a company inside your company this is
38:13what I need so if you're ready to do
38:15this let me know and if not I really
38:17can't be wasting my time on
38:19this love it yeah that makes sense um
38:27sure Alberto which one should we talk
38:30about next do you think uh I think maybe
38:32we can just take the um dh's one I think
38:35it was next uh so uh diving deeper into
38:38distinguishing customers and partners um
38:41I'm also curious kind of what what you
38:43might see what are some of the kind of
38:45implications of thinking of them as the
38:47same or and why should we think about
38:53basically um well um I mean a customer
38:57is someone who's paying you for your
39:00right so you know that could be a school
39:03district or an individual user or an
39:07Enterprise customer but you know it's
39:09someone who is kind of using your
39:11product to do whatever it is that
39:12they're doing in their
39:14day-to-day versus you know a partnership
39:17is um most often kind of a unique
39:20commercial relationship that you have
39:23that is um you know the partner is not
39:26using product right they're using your
39:28product to create some sort of value for
39:30their own customers right and um or you
39:35know to do something else for their
39:36business so it's not they're not a
39:37direct user of your product I think
39:39that's the easiest way to kind of
39:40distinguish it it's okay to call your
39:42customers Partners if that makes them
39:44feel good um but for your own purposes I
39:48think that's the dividing
39:51line and Partnerships is Broad
39:53everything that is not a customer where
39:55it's like a commercial relationship with
40:00right it can it can have many flavors
40:02but usually they're not also a user of
40:07product um if it's okay I would love to
40:09add up here um so for example if it's a
40:12B2B Toc products so like the end user is
40:15sort of an individual and then there is
40:18a buyer in the relationship uh if the
40:21buyer is sort of not a direct sort of
40:24Target group so let's say we're building
40:26a um we have a feedback an upskilling
40:29tool for professionals working in Tech
40:31and um the free tier will be for the
40:33these professionals the buyer would be
40:36like the company that they're working at
40:38but let's say an interesting maybe
40:40distribution partner could also be
40:42universities to get these users early on
40:45to start building on their development
40:47but um I guess for that profile like the
40:50university it is also in a sense a sort
40:52of buyer um so I'm curious sort of of in
40:56these kind of relationships like in
40:58these kind of situations where they're
41:01definitely not sort of the end user but
41:03there could be the buyer for the end
41:06user um what are some maybe examples or
41:09um best practices that you've seen to
41:12like help us as Founders to navigate
41:15negotiating this relationship if it's
41:16for a partnership so I think what you're
41:19describing there is actually an
41:21Enterprise customer right um because you
41:25know this happens most Enterprise
41:27customer the person who's buying the
41:29product is not the person using the
41:31product so in all of Enterprise sales
41:33you know you kind of have this challenge
41:35of like who's the decision maker and the
41:37buyer versus who's the individual users
41:39and you kind of have two essentially
41:41stakeholder groups um with Enterprise
41:44customers that you have to think about
41:46and so the university I think in your
41:48case is still a customer because they're
41:50buying your product right in order to
41:53students um and so I think there you
41:56want want to sort of like map best best
41:58practices of of Enterprise sales and you
42:02know with Enterprise sales you know a
42:04lot of the motion it's kind of similar
42:06to Business Development and sort of from
42:09a negotiation perspective um you know
42:12things that are helpful um things to
42:14watch out for and then things that are
42:15helpful with Enterprise customers the
42:17things to watch out for is you
42:20know um making sure that in the you know
42:24in the sort of relationship you set up
42:27with a university in your case that
42:29they're not just like buying the product
42:31that they're actually going to Market it
42:33for you to their students so that you
42:36get usage and engagement right and so
42:39oftentimes like where Enterprise sales
42:41kind of fall down is on the
42:43implementation like yes they said yes
42:45and they signed the contract and you
42:46even got the check but they forgot to
42:48roll it out to their organization so no
42:50one's actually using it if no one's
42:52using the product it's very unlikely
42:53that they're going to renew with you one
42:55year from now so so you have to worry
42:56about implementation and usage and
42:58engagement and have an Enterprise
43:00customer who's willing to do the work to
43:02kind of roll it out so that's something
43:05anticipate and you know um I think as a
43:09startup you know one way to play it it
43:11doesn't always work but like if you can
43:13do this it can really be very effective
43:16is again you create some sort of
43:18constraint right for um you create you
43:21know um you know it's like when you know
43:24Tesla was like we're only taking the
43:27first hundred customers right and they
43:29had everyone line up and they wanted to
43:30be on the waiting list and they created
43:32exclusivity and demand you can do that
43:34too even if it feels artificial but you
43:37can do it you can say look we've got
43:38this exciting new technology and product
43:41um for the next year we're only taking
43:44on three universities we're going to
43:46have a very close partnership with them
43:48you know but we're we're not we're not
43:51we don't want to work with everyone we
43:52only want to work with the leaders who
43:54want to test this kind of product we're
43:56only going to pick three we have a lot
43:58of interest if you want to be one of our
44:01like next three customers here's the
44:03commitment that we expect from
44:05you and you kind of let people self-
44:07select in and kind of drive a sense of
44:09urgency and commitment from your
44:11customers you know to kind of do the
44:13things that you need them to do by
44:15creating this era of
44:17exclusivity that make
44:21sense we can talk about Enterprise sales
44:23for a long period of time probably but
44:26I think there's a question in here too
44:31negotiations yeah um hard to cover all
44:35of that in in 10 minutes um you know
44:38negotiation is definitely Art and
44:40Science it's a learned skill anybody can
44:43learn it you don't have to be some like
44:45crazy Tech bro to be good at
44:47negotiating um or an investment banker
44:51stereotypes um you know the the best
44:55negotiators that know are people who and
44:59aren't just sort of aggressive although
45:00you need to know when to use that
45:03effectively um can't use it all the time
45:05but when to like Drop in that like
45:07leaning in pressing you know like that
45:10that element um but it's really about
45:13like how well do you know the other side
45:17that's the key to negotiation like I
45:19can't teach you all of negotiation here
45:21but the one piece of advice is um if you
45:25know the other side really well and what
45:28I what do I mean by that like one as an
45:30entity what is important to them what's
45:32driving their business what are the
45:34metrics that their SE Suite cares about
45:36and is obsessing over right what's
45:39happening for them in the market that is
45:41affecting their business creating
45:43opportunity creating pressure points you
45:45know like know the other side and then
45:48it's just as important to know the other
45:50side from an individual perspective who
45:51is that human being that you're dealing
45:53with on the other side what's going to
45:57what is their number one priority what
45:59makes them tick as a person you know on
46:02you know and and so the more you know
46:05about the other side the easier it is to
46:08see for yourself how you might kind of
46:12use that information um to your
46:15advantage in negotiating um you know a a
46:19partnership right and then there's the
46:21contract piece of it and the contract
46:23piece is incredibly important right
46:30elements one is there's always all of
46:33the legal terms which are really
46:35designed to sort of minimize risk for
46:38both sides in the relationship those are
46:40usually elements that any lawyer that
46:42you you know can contract should be able
46:44to advise you on the other part of a
46:47contract is sort of you know it's the
46:49compact um it's the commitments that
46:52both sides are making that create the in
46:55incentives and framework for the
46:57partnership right and so you know there
47:00are things like you know we you know
47:03we're going to build a co-marketing
47:05campaign or we're going to build this
47:07joint product there should be the like
47:09what are you actually doing together
47:12what is the timeline for that there
47:13should be very clear deadlines in a
47:15contract there should be you know kind
47:18of what if scenarios uh laid out in
47:21legal e like if a you know if a deadline
47:24is not met what is the escalation path
47:26what is the resolution path you know and
47:29to the extent that there's resources
47:31required there some you know some
47:33concrete terms around what both sides
47:36are committing and so you know uh as as
47:42sort of the founder CEOs the piece you
47:44probably want to own and really figure
47:46out is that like what's the construction
47:48of the partnership what's the framework
47:51and then just have a really good lawyer
47:52that you can lean on for the other terms
47:54to protect yourself El and to understand
47:56like what the other side is asking for
47:59um in terms of books I don't know any
48:02great books in negotiation I feel like I
48:04should I will think about that if I can
48:07think of one I will pass it on to
48:08Alberto to to share with the
48:13um I was gonna say and I feel like
48:18there's probably like a few people maybe
48:19on on Twitter or like on LinkedIn that
48:22you follow that you know that might be
48:24good also for partnership there somebody
48:25that you recommend we follow for any
48:28like kind of good Partnerships or
48:30strategy U gosh you know what's funny
48:33about bis Daven Partnerships people
48:35don't talk about it publicly because
48:37it's just hard most of the time you're
48:39bound by confidentiality on both sides
48:42as to the inside of any partnership and
48:44all you see is the like the headlines
48:47that get printed in the media and that's
48:49all you get it's very rare to see um I
48:54don't actually know know any any bis DAV
48:58exacts that are on Twitter that talk
49:00about bis DAV but again I take that as a
49:04challenge I will try to think of um
49:08something for you let me actually let me
49:10bring up this book that I mean I know I
49:13there should be more but that's that's
49:15sort of why it's not that people don't
49:17want to talk about it it's usually you
49:19can't um and then there is this kind of
49:22cultural thing I think for BD
49:24professionals where it's kind of like
49:26it's not your story to tell even if you
49:29led the deal you know it's up to the
49:31founder and CEO to decide when to reveal
49:34kind of what happened inside of a
49:43book hold on let me see yes okay so this
49:47is the one book I would recommend I just
49:49found it on Amazon so I'll drop it in
49:51here which I think is sort of like
49:53speaks broadly to Partnerships the be
49:55applicable to anything it's called
49:59Impossible and um I love this book
50:03because what it does is sort of layout
50:05in very simple to understand like
50:08relatable terms what it means to
50:11actually build Partnerships these are
50:13Timeless principles for building
50:15alliances Partnerships commercial deals
50:17kind of in any context so versus like
50:21you know it's not specific to Tech um
50:23but I think it's a really good read
50:27wonderful great and well um I don't know
50:30if there are any last minute questions
50:31but um I think we can actually wrap it
50:34up here I would love to hear maybe some
50:36of the insights that uh people might
50:38have gotten from from this session to
50:40make sure that an leaves with some like
50:43some of those some of that return U does
50:45anybody feel like sharing anything that
50:51today I just have so many so I'm just
50:53like going through going to through my
50:56notes what should I do a cohort based
51:00Partnerships I don't know of one so I'm
51:03now thinking like if I can't think of
51:05any resources should I do
51:07one I think uh I think I think
51:10so because it sounds like it's also
51:12something where um there is a a benefit
51:16of like getting experiences from other
51:17people Al I guess we have two minutes we
51:19can talk about cohort uh based learning
51:22before we rub up uh because uh I'm
51:25curious what others think around cohort
51:27based learning is um I guess SEMA or
51:32Anna or see DNE anybody want to chime in
51:36why is a cohort based class just a
51:41class um yeah that's a good question I
51:45mean I'll say like we we started off
51:50asynchronous learning for teachers and
51:54um now we're moving into cohort base so
51:57that teachers have an opportunity to
51:58develop like a community of peers that
52:01like across School building so they can
52:04talk to each other and reflect and share
52:06ideas um and it seems to be more
52:08engaging and also just to you know to
52:11increase the the rigor of of what's of
52:14what's going on in the class and to
52:15increase um the engagement and make it
52:18more likely that the practices are being
52:20implemented in their classroom so that's
52:22kind of our thought process is it just
52:25the class I mean I do find myself
52:27sometimes when I'm explaining it to
52:29districts I'm like you know it's like a
52:30grad school class but um with the
52:33asynchronous and synchronous part of it
52:36like kind of um woven together yeah I
52:41was gonna say that I think for me um
52:43it's it's G uh it's made more sense when
52:45I thought about it in the kind of at a
52:48larger scale like uh talking to a lot of
52:50the director of products like corera
52:51udem me um in the kind of early days of
52:54the mukes uh a lot of them thought about
52:56like should we have a start date for the
52:58session so that you get to complete a
53:00cohort with complete a course with a
53:02cohort uh and I just today in in here in
53:05Paris I was meeting with the founder of
53:07open classrooms who are very openly not
53:10a cohort um uh based uh platform um so I
53:16think it makes a lot of sense when you
53:17think about it a lot of these companies
53:19future learn as well they all tried it
53:21and they said this works great much
53:22better engagement we actually like
53:24self-pace better because it allows us to
53:25get to scale so I just see it as kind of
53:28a a turning back from that um to higher
53:31engagement um but it's also higher cost
53:33so I think a lot of platforms are going
53:35to realize that and are going to have
53:37maybe a bit of a maybe a few pivots
53:40we'll see but um I think for a lot of
53:43courses that like Seas um it's I think
53:45it's just bring the focus back on
53:47quality and engagement um which I think
53:49makes a lot of sense but I want to be
53:51respectful everyone's time um and you
53:54shared your email in the chat is there
53:56anything uh that we can do to support
53:59your work at Nea any type of companies
54:00you're looking to connect with or where
54:02can we follow you I gu yeah sounds good
54:07um first of all thank you for this it's
54:08been so fun and it's kind of challenged
54:11me to really um I think maybe distill
54:14more information on on Partnerships in
54:17bisav um for for companies yeah I mean I
54:20love um we are we have historically been
54:23very active in Tech I think you know
54:27adult learning in particular lifelong
54:29learning career building is just a space
54:31I'm very passionate about and interested
54:32in and so um I'm definitely interested
54:35in connecting with you know seed and
54:37series a companies or as you're coming
54:39up to kind of raise those rounds so feel
54:41free to reach out I just put my email in
54:43the chat aesy nea.com you can also DM me
54:47on Twitter if you like I do read my DMs
54:50um and then yeah for anyone in SF we're
54:53actually doing an edtech dinner in
54:55September just very casual to get people
54:58together to have some fun IRL so if
55:00anyone is in the Bay Area please let me
55:02know I'd be happy to invite you um and
55:05yeah feel free to feel free to stay in
55:08touch and um congrats on all the
55:09exciting things you're building it's
55:11amazing it's super inspiring thank you
55:14an thank you everyone for coming we have
55:16a closing ritual for our calls I would
55:17love to invite you to to join us in so
55:20we we put our hands in the middle we try
55:21to go off mute when we can and then uh
55:23we count to three and then we say go
55:26team so um I think would anyone like to
55:29lead it because I I usually do it I'm
55:31kind of tired of doing it anyway I'll do
55:34it I'll do it all right H three two one
